The Ledger, every show

“Our most recent customer actually turned off of Sierra to come to Decagon”

“I think it's basically impossible for any VC to help accelerate the process of getting to PMF. I think the issue is that VCs will sell that they can, but that's not possible.”

“The approaches are just very different because of their leadership all coming from Salesforce. They've taken a very Salesforce-esque approach where it's, you know, the heavy configuration and sort of this longer lift to get going. And we're more of a, you know…”

“But I think the point is that at a certain point, it's strictly better to use open source models because when your use case is solidified and you're in production at scale and you're pretty sure this is the sort of shape of the agent, then there's no reason no…”

“In enterprises right now, even though there's a lot of hype for open source, the sort of share of open source inference is actually Going down right now because people are spinning up all these new use cases.”

“I'm sort of teaching the AI my own procedures. And again, that doesn't happen through fine tuning. That, that happens like in context, because if you were to fine tune on that, you would have to reverse it every single time. You know, you change your procedure…”

“The labs themselves will have more application capabilities, but those will be fairly general. Like they're, you can maybe build general agents that can do this thing or that thing. But for a lot of these like core verticals, like ours, our thesis is that, you…”

“There are definitely scenarios where people use their BPOs a lot less or Don't need the BPO anymore.”

“I think it's a little bit overblown of like, oh, AI is replacing jobs and so on. I think most of, even the BPO as we talked to not really that concerned because what typically happens anyways, is that there's already very high turnover in these, BPO's cause li…”

“We have people who had said that they've used us, and we literally never heard of them.”

“Like right now, I would argue that if you're building an application, you're Margin shouldn't really matter that much. Like, people will often sort of critique the coding agents like they're hemorrhaging money. Yeah, but, you know, again, things are improving …”

“That's why I think the open AI's of the world will continue to move towards applications because it's quite hard for them to make money longterm on like their API, for example, because There's like such high competition, all the labs are building, and it's lik…”

“Oh, like probably a million.”

“You can't just go in and sell the vision because no one needs to buy into the vision. I think everyone already believes the vision. And so then it's more about showing the results quickly and being able to demonstrate that, hey, there is ROI here and that, you…”

“It's, in my opinion, one of the few markets right now that has true PMF with AI.”

“The reasoning capabilities matter a little bit less. I would say the models as they stand today are generally good enough at solving most of the meaty inquiries in customer service. I think it's like, instead of reasoning, it's more about instruction following…”

“When you think about people that raised that huge valuations, I, I've known folks that have done this. You get to a point where you maybe are still doing well as a business, but the markets change and you're just not able to raise at that price with some healt…”

“If you invest so much in the wellness stuff, it actually makes the stress worse because now there's this huge juxtaposition between like relaxing and stress. Well, instead, just like embrace it.”

“I don't think that long-term necessarily we'll always see a five X difference between open and anthropic. So I guess, yeah, maybe, maybe if the question is more like, what is spread trade? I think like that, that multiple will shrink. Over time.”

“The fact that there's this narrative that AI is just going to transform every single use case. I think what we've seen is that most use cases have not been transformed by AI, especially if you think about enterprise use cases and things like that, is that, yea…”

“I actually don't think we, there's that much advantage in a lot of application layer sort of solutions from having a better model. There is some advantage for sure.”

“I think our view is that for the vast majority of use cases right now, it is still, like there's not going to be real commercial adoption with the state of the current models because of a bunch of things.”

“And so because the models are inherently non-deterministic, It's very hard for buyers like really trust a gen AI solution there. And so, especially agentic solution. So like, I think that option there is going to be really, really, really slow, a lot slower th…”

“And if you fine tune it to be really good at that task, it can be just as good or better than the big models.”

“So today, 90% of our workflow is on open source.”

“First of all, very few companies, if any, can do what Palantir does, which is like close massive deals off the bat. And like, it's kind of worth it to spend all that effort.”

“The first thing I want to say is I'm like, certain there will be careers after AGI. The reason for that is, like, most of our jobs, for sure are for jobs, are kind of, like, made up. Most jobs are made up... So when AGI is here, like it will change people's jo…”

“An AI agent should just be the front door of your business, of your brand, and every interaction, whether it's like reactive or proactive with a customer should be handled by AI.”

“Our view, the reason why we've kind of built so horizontally is that we believe that in our space, the winners are going to be horizontal. There's just not that much that is like super verticalized that where like you could see a pure vertical solution survivi…”

“I actually think CRMs could do quite well. They'll, they'll be slightly different in the sense of, like, CRMs are kind of databases in a way, and, you know, the frustration people have with them sometimes is that the interfaces are not really difficult to use,…”

“Essentially what everyone told us, including like, you know, very smart, older founders that we knew and so on was that yeah, this is like excuse case, like super obvious. There's probably just going to be incumbents that are just tacking onto the product. And…”

“The other property, which I think is a little underrated, is that it's very easy to go live. And I think a lot of Gen AI use cases are struggling with that right now, especially at the enterprise level, because there's risk involved, right? Like people don't w…”

“And those two things I think are one of the big reasons why it's probably the use case with the most traction at the enterprise. And coding is another one.”

“I actually think, like, maybe one thing, the one way to think about it is that, like, AI use case will start eating the spectrum from both ends. And the reason why is that because engineers are the highest paid, like, they have the sophistication to, like, rea…”

“So I don't know any company that's like, hey, I would like to just let go of a bunch of my engineers, because now I have coding agents. That's just like, there's infinite engineering work to do, so you're just augmenting them.”

“I would say even for large enterprises, like within weeks, because the only, the, everyone wants to just go live to everything. Right. But the reason why you stage it out is so you can make sure nothing's going wrong. And you can tell if something's going wron…”

“I think probably like eight X higher or something like that.”

“When you think about like moats in the agentic world, a lot of it is around, well, if you've kind of been working with a client for a year, Has your agent just continuously gotten better by learning from the data? And that's, it's like, that's a different con…”

“In the natural end state, it is more unified for the exact reason you listed, which is people want a unified brand out there, and the brand's very important to them, and for some businesses it's more important than others, but eventually this is like, this bec…”

“Nowadays, it's just, I think there aren't that many AI companies that have like real, real traction on the revenue side especially in the enterprise.”

“During the stage where people want to invest, but they haven't yet, ah, that's when they're most willing to be helpful. And so it's actually like a great way for you to use that to proxy how helpful they'll be afterwards. Because if they're not that helpful in…”

“I'm very bullish on Google, actually.”

“I think long-term, you do need that consumer buy-in, because that's where all the new data is going to come from.”

“And especially when you get into agents an agent is not just a model, right? You have to like design it. You have to be able to put in guardrails. You have to be able to teach how to do new things. And that's where the sort of software layer on top of the mode…”

“I would expect a Decagon and a Sierra to be able to execute faster on a product side than Salesforce, but Salesforce has like so much distribution.”

“The seed round we raised before we had any ideas. So we raised from Andreessen Horowitz.”

“I mean, I just think that most people care. If you're responsible about your career, like, you're gonna look at all the different factors and Maybe the sort of kernel of truth behind that quote is that that shouldn't be the only thing they care about. But if y…”

“I actually think given a choice, you should have different investors for the C and the A because you just get two firms instead of one. They bring different things.”