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Dec 20, 2017 · 18m · top-founders

879 SaaS: From $360k Agency to 2 month old, $30k ARR SaaS

Nathan Latka · 8m spoken Tomer Aharon · 4m spoken Gal Dubinski · 3m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The Top Entrepreneurs, host Nathan Latka interviews Poptin co-founders Gal Dubinski and Tomer Aharon, who discuss bootstrapping their lead capture SaaS platform to $2,350 in MRR within two months using profits from their $360,000 digital agency.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 50.7% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.8 Guest teaching 2.3 Guest disagreement 0.8 Nathan pushing back 2.3
05100:0010:004:00–8:03 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Agency Operations and Scalable Content Strategy Latka inquires into agency revenue, full-time headcount, and freelancer spend. He explicitly turns to the guests for tactical advice on scaling content marketing for GetLatka, and they recommend letting users self-update data to eliminate outdated information.8:06–11:28 · Nathan as informed peer 3/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Promotion Following a standard HostGator sponsorship read, the host explores the founders' modest $3,000 monthly salaries, low living expenses with newborn twins in Tel Aviv, and how Popton originated out of repetitive client requests at the agency.11:29–14:22 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Customer Acquisition and Paid Advertising Unit Economics The conversation shifts to customer acquisition tactics and early paid advertising experiments. Latka demonstrates SaaS financial acumen by immediately calculating expected customer lifetime value from their 4% churn rate to validate their $200 CAC target.14:22–16:14 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Bootstrapping vs. Fundraising and Revenue Projections Latka explores their fundraising stance, analyzing their theoretical $3M valuation pitch deck against their current $30k ARR run rate. The guests explain that high dilution at this early stage was a primary motivation to remain bootstrapped.4:00–8:03 · Guest teaching 5/10 Agency Operations and Scalable Content Strategy Latka inquires into agency revenue, full-time headcount, and freelancer spend. He explicitly turns to the guests for tactical advice on scaling content marketing for GetLatka, and they recommend letting users self-update data to eliminate outdated information.8:06–11:28 · Guest teaching 1/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Promotion Following a standard HostGator sponsorship read, the host explores the founders' modest $3,000 monthly salaries, low living expenses with newborn twins in Tel Aviv, and how Popton originated out of repetitive client requests at the agency.11:29–14:22 · Guest teaching 1/10 Customer Acquisition and Paid Advertising Unit Economics The conversation shifts to customer acquisition tactics and early paid advertising experiments. Latka demonstrates SaaS financial acumen by immediately calculating expected customer lifetime value from their 4% churn rate to validate their $200 CAC target.14:22–16:14 · Guest teaching 2/10 Bootstrapping vs. Fundraising and Revenue Projections Latka explores their fundraising stance, analyzing their theoretical $3M valuation pitch deck against their current $30k ARR run rate. The guests explain that high dilution at this early stage was a primary motivation to remain bootstrapped.4:00–8:03 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Agency Operations and Scalable Content Strategy Latka inquires into agency revenue, full-time headcount, and freelancer spend. He explicitly turns to the guests for tactical advice on scaling content marketing for GetLatka, and they recommend letting users self-update data to eliminate outdated information.8:06–11:28 · Guest disagreement 0/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Promotion Following a standard HostGator sponsorship read, the host explores the founders' modest $3,000 monthly salaries, low living expenses with newborn twins in Tel Aviv, and how Popton originated out of repetitive client requests at the agency.11:29–14:22 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Customer Acquisition and Paid Advertising Unit Economics The conversation shifts to customer acquisition tactics and early paid advertising experiments. Latka demonstrates SaaS financial acumen by immediately calculating expected customer lifetime value from their 4% churn rate to validate their $200 CAC target.14:22–16:14 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Bootstrapping vs. Fundraising and Revenue Projections Latka explores their fundraising stance, analyzing their theoretical $3M valuation pitch deck against their current $30k ARR run rate. The guests explain that high dilution at this early stage was a primary motivation to remain bootstrapped.4:00–8:03 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Agency Operations and Scalable Content Strategy Latka inquires into agency revenue, full-time headcount, and freelancer spend. He explicitly turns to the guests for tactical advice on scaling content marketing for GetLatka, and they recommend letting users self-update data to eliminate outdated information.8:06–11:28 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Promotion Following a standard HostGator sponsorship read, the host explores the founders' modest $3,000 monthly salaries, low living expenses with newborn twins in Tel Aviv, and how Popton originated out of repetitive client requests at the agency.11:29–14:22 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Customer Acquisition and Paid Advertising Unit Economics The conversation shifts to customer acquisition tactics and early paid advertising experiments. Latka demonstrates SaaS financial acumen by immediately calculating expected customer lifetime value from their 4% churn rate to validate their $200 CAC target.14:22–16:14 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Bootstrapping vs. Fundraising and Revenue Projections Latka explores their fundraising stance, analyzing their theoretical $3M valuation pitch deck against their current $30k ARR run rate. The guests explain that high dilution at this early stage was a primary motivation to remain bootstrapped.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 68.7% · guest 31.3%0:00 · Nathan 68.7% · guest 31.3%3:00 · Nathan 39.3% · guest 60.7%3:00 · Nathan 39.3% · guest 60.7%6:00 · Nathan 49.9% · guest 50.1%6:00 · Nathan 49.9% · guest 50.1%9:00 · Nathan 44% · guest 56%9:00 · Nathan 44% · guest 56%12:00 · Nathan 30.7% · guest 69.3%12:00 · Nathan 30.7% · guest 69.3%15:00 · Nathan 65.4% · guest 34.6%15:00 · Nathan 65.4% · guest 34.6%18:00 · Nathan 100% · guest 0%18:00 · Nathan 100% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 6:32 Gal critiques GetLatka's stale database

Gal directly points out that Latka's current editorial model results in stale data that is months out of date.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 12:01 Latka questions easy client conversion narrative

Latka refuses the guest's casual explanation of their launch, pushing back that getting paying agency clients to adopt software is not that simple.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 6:03 Founders educate host on crowdsourced data maintenance

Tomer and Gal walk Latka through a self-serve crowdsourcing model to maintain and scale directory listings without hiring editorial staff.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 13:29 Instant SaaS unit economics calculation

Latka instantly computes that a 4% monthly churn yields a 25-month lifetime, proving why a $200 CAC is mathematically viable against a $31 ARPU.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Agency Operations and Scalable Content Strategy 4512 Latka inquires into agency revenue, full-time headcount, and freelancer spend. He explicitly turns to the guests for tactical advice on scaling content marketing for GetLatka, and they recommend letting users self-update data to eliminate outdated information.
HostGator Sponsorship and Promotion 3101 Following a standard HostGator sponsorship read, the host explores the founders' modest $3,000 monthly salaries, low living expenses with newborn twins in Tel Aviv, and how Popton originated out of repetitive client requests at the agency.
Customer Acquisition and Paid Advertising Unit Economics 6113 The conversation shifts to customer acquisition tactics and early paid advertising experiments. Latka demonstrates SaaS financial acumen by immediately calculating expected customer lifetime value from their 4% churn rate to validate their $200 CAC target.
Bootstrapping vs. Fundraising and Revenue Projections 6213 Latka explores their fundraising stance, analyzing their theoretical $3M valuation pitch deck against their current $30k ARR run rate. The guests explain that high dilution at this early stage was a primary motivation to remain bootstrapped.

Statements from this episode (9)

Disclosure
Aharon: Poptin ARPU is approximately $31 per month
“So our pool is about 31 dollars.”
Tomer Aharon Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 2:28
Disclosure
Aharon: Poptin has 1,600 users, 72 paying customers, and $2,350 MRR
“So we have 16 hundred customers a total, which is including the free ones. From them, we have 72 paying customers. The MRR is 23 50.”
Tomer Aharon Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 3:04
Disclosure
Dubinski: Poptin MRR churn is four to five percent monthly
“Yes, logo, and MRL churn is four to five.”
Gal Dubinski Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 3:34
Disclosure
Poptin is fully bootstrapped using cash flow from founders' digital agency
“Okay, so we're completely bootstrapped. Actually, we use the revenue we create from ECPM, our digital agency, to support Poptin. And we don't need any money. We don't need to raise any money.”
Gal Dubinski Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 4:00
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Founders' digital agency generates about $30,000 per month in revenue
“It's about 30,000 bucks a month.”
Tomer Aharon Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 4:25
Disclosure
Poptin founders draw $3,000 monthly salaries from their digital agency
“So we keep, we take as lowest as we can, which is about three, 3000 dollars each.”
Tomer Aharon Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 9:10
Disclosure
Poptin acquires free users via Google AdWords for about $3 each
“We acquire like three, three users for like about three bucks per user.”
Tomer Aharon Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 13:10
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Aharon: Poptin CAC for paid customers could be around $200
“So it's still early to say that, but I think it could be around 200 dollars.”
Tomer Aharon Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 13:29
Disclosure
Poptin prepared an investor pitch deck but decided to bootstrap instead
“To be frank, we have the pitch deck completely ready. We have everything ready. We just, and then we said, okay, we don't need the money. We can bootstrap it and we do it well. So if we get to a point that we need the money, we'll do it.”
Gal Dubinski Dec 20, 2017 ▶ 14:53
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