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Feb 16, 2018 · 18m · top-founders

937 SaaS: How He Gets 100-150% Expansion Revenue in Customer Year 2

Pierre Asayag · 9m spoken Nathan Latka · 6m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The Top Entrepreneurs Podcast, host Nathan Latka interviews Pierre Asayag, CEO and co-founder of Traackr, who breaks down how his enterprise influencer relationship management platform scaled to nearly $7 million in ARR with 50% to 150% second-year customer expansion.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 38.3% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.7 Guest teaching 3.3 Guest disagreement 2.0 Nathan pushing back 3.8
05100:0010:000:49–3:41 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Introducing Pierre Asayag and Traackr's Mission Nathan provocatively challenges the influencer industry as high-maintenance micro-celebrities needing green room pampering. Pierre politely pushes back, educating Nathan on distinguishing between noisy internet micro-celebrities and authentic topic authorities, while advising on courting rather than transactional payments.3:42–6:45 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Enterprise SaaS Pricing and Core Workflows Nathan presses for specific enterprise pricing numbers and the core utility metric driving contract growth. Pierre clearly explains their value metric based on tracked influencer volume and explains why early-stage brands are better off sticking with spreadsheets before graduating to Traackr.6:45–9:04 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Traackr's Founding History and Enterprise Clientele Nathan interrogates Traackr's bootstrapping claim versus outside capital raised. Pierre clarifies that while they avoided traditional institutional venture capital, they raised around five million dollars across priced rounds from their extended angel network.9:07–12:39 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship for SignEasy Document Management After the mid-roll ad read, Nathan calculates Pierre's ARR on the fly by multiplying 150 customers by their fifty thousand dollar baseline ACV. Pierre confirms it is in the ballpark at just south of seven million ARR, and discusses Traackr's top-down enterprise motion.12:39–16:15 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Unit Economics, Account Expansion, and Geographic Distribution When Pierre deflects providing an exact fully weighted CAC figure, Nathan skillfully pivots to payback period and calculates CAC back-of-the-napkin at twenty-five thousand dollars. Pierre details their strong net negative churn and fifty to one hundred fifty percent account expansion.16:15–17:53 · Nathan as informed peer 3/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions The interview concludes smoothly with Nathan's rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire, briefly clarifying Pierre's age and sleep habits before closing out.0:49–3:41 · Guest teaching 5/10 Introducing Pierre Asayag and Traackr's Mission Nathan provocatively challenges the influencer industry as high-maintenance micro-celebrities needing green room pampering. Pierre politely pushes back, educating Nathan on distinguishing between noisy internet micro-celebrities and authentic topic authorities, while advising on courting rather than transactional payments.3:42–6:45 · Guest teaching 4/10 Enterprise SaaS Pricing and Core Workflows Nathan presses for specific enterprise pricing numbers and the core utility metric driving contract growth. Pierre clearly explains their value metric based on tracked influencer volume and explains why early-stage brands are better off sticking with spreadsheets before graduating to Traackr.6:45–9:04 · Guest teaching 3/10 Traackr's Founding History and Enterprise Clientele Nathan interrogates Traackr's bootstrapping claim versus outside capital raised. Pierre clarifies that while they avoided traditional institutional venture capital, they raised around five million dollars across priced rounds from their extended angel network.9:07–12:39 · Guest teaching 3/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship for SignEasy Document Management After the mid-roll ad read, Nathan calculates Pierre's ARR on the fly by multiplying 150 customers by their fifty thousand dollar baseline ACV. Pierre confirms it is in the ballpark at just south of seven million ARR, and discusses Traackr's top-down enterprise motion.12:39–16:15 · Guest teaching 4/10 Unit Economics, Account Expansion, and Geographic Distribution When Pierre deflects providing an exact fully weighted CAC figure, Nathan skillfully pivots to payback period and calculates CAC back-of-the-napkin at twenty-five thousand dollars. Pierre details their strong net negative churn and fifty to one hundred fifty percent account expansion.16:15–17:53 · Guest teaching 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions The interview concludes smoothly with Nathan's rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire, briefly clarifying Pierre's age and sleep habits before closing out.0:49–3:41 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Introducing Pierre Asayag and Traackr's Mission Nathan provocatively challenges the influencer industry as high-maintenance micro-celebrities needing green room pampering. Pierre politely pushes back, educating Nathan on distinguishing between noisy internet micro-celebrities and authentic topic authorities, while advising on courting rather than transactional payments.3:42–6:45 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Enterprise SaaS Pricing and Core Workflows Nathan presses for specific enterprise pricing numbers and the core utility metric driving contract growth. Pierre clearly explains their value metric based on tracked influencer volume and explains why early-stage brands are better off sticking with spreadsheets before graduating to Traackr.6:45–9:04 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Traackr's Founding History and Enterprise Clientele Nathan interrogates Traackr's bootstrapping claim versus outside capital raised. Pierre clarifies that while they avoided traditional institutional venture capital, they raised around five million dollars across priced rounds from their extended angel network.9:07–12:39 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship for SignEasy Document Management After the mid-roll ad read, Nathan calculates Pierre's ARR on the fly by multiplying 150 customers by their fifty thousand dollar baseline ACV. Pierre confirms it is in the ballpark at just south of seven million ARR, and discusses Traackr's top-down enterprise motion.12:39–16:15 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Unit Economics, Account Expansion, and Geographic Distribution When Pierre deflects providing an exact fully weighted CAC figure, Nathan skillfully pivots to payback period and calculates CAC back-of-the-napkin at twenty-five thousand dollars. Pierre details their strong net negative churn and fifty to one hundred fifty percent account expansion.16:15–17:53 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions The interview concludes smoothly with Nathan's rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire, briefly clarifying Pierre's age and sleep habits before closing out.0:49–3:41 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Introducing Pierre Asayag and Traackr's Mission Nathan provocatively challenges the influencer industry as high-maintenance micro-celebrities needing green room pampering. Pierre politely pushes back, educating Nathan on distinguishing between noisy internet micro-celebrities and authentic topic authorities, while advising on courting rather than transactional payments.3:42–6:45 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Enterprise SaaS Pricing and Core Workflows Nathan presses for specific enterprise pricing numbers and the core utility metric driving contract growth. Pierre clearly explains their value metric based on tracked influencer volume and explains why early-stage brands are better off sticking with spreadsheets before graduating to Traackr.6:45–9:04 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Traackr's Founding History and Enterprise Clientele Nathan interrogates Traackr's bootstrapping claim versus outside capital raised. Pierre clarifies that while they avoided traditional institutional venture capital, they raised around five million dollars across priced rounds from their extended angel network.9:07–12:39 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship for SignEasy Document Management After the mid-roll ad read, Nathan calculates Pierre's ARR on the fly by multiplying 150 customers by their fifty thousand dollar baseline ACV. Pierre confirms it is in the ballpark at just south of seven million ARR, and discusses Traackr's top-down enterprise motion.12:39–16:15 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Unit Economics, Account Expansion, and Geographic Distribution When Pierre deflects providing an exact fully weighted CAC figure, Nathan skillfully pivots to payback period and calculates CAC back-of-the-napkin at twenty-five thousand dollars. Pierre details their strong net negative churn and fifty to one hundred fifty percent account expansion.16:15–17:53 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions The interview concludes smoothly with Nathan's rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire, briefly clarifying Pierre's age and sleep habits before closing out.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 54.6% · guest 45.4%0:00 · Nathan 54.6% · guest 45.4%3:00 · Nathan 14.8% · guest 85.2%3:00 · Nathan 14.8% · guest 85.2%6:00 · Nathan 16.7% · guest 83.3%6:00 · Nathan 16.7% · guest 83.3%9:00 · Nathan 52.2% · guest 47.8%9:00 · Nathan 52.2% · guest 47.8%12:00 · Nathan 36.6% · guest 63.4%12:00 · Nathan 36.6% · guest 63.4%15:00 · Nathan 56.9% · guest 43.1%15:00 · Nathan 56.9% · guest 43.1%18:00 · Nathan 0% · guest 0%18:00 · Nathan 0% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 2:33 Pierre pushes back on influencer stereotypes

Pierre immediately checks Nathan's cynical characterization of influencers as demanding green room divas, telling him not to caricature the industry.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 12:46 Nathan reframes CAC question into payback period

When Pierre demurs on sharing exact customer acquisition cost figures, Nathan refuses to abandon the line of inquiry and pivots to demanding the target payback period.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 2:42 Pierre explains authentic influencer relationship strategy

Pierre educates Nathan on the difference between superficial internet noise and genuine topic influence, explaining why courting creators rather than immediately writing checks drives long-term ROI.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 9:45 Nathan deduces run-rate revenue from customer metrics

Nathan instantly multiplies the disclosed fifty thousand dollar contract floor by one hundred fifty clients to pinpoint revenue at seven and a half million, forcing Pierre to validate the estimate.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Pierre Asayag and Traackr's Mission 4543 Nathan provocatively challenges the influencer industry as high-maintenance micro-celebrities needing green room pampering. Pierre politely pushes back, educating Nathan on distinguishing between noisy internet micro-celebrities and authentic topic authorities, while advising on courting rather than transactional payments.
Enterprise SaaS Pricing and Core Workflows 5424 Nathan presses for specific enterprise pricing numbers and the core utility metric driving contract growth. Pierre clearly explains their value metric based on tracked influencer volume and explains why early-stage brands are better off sticking with spreadsheets before graduating to Traackr.
Traackr's Founding History and Enterprise Clientele 4324 Nathan interrogates Traackr's bootstrapping claim versus outside capital raised. Pierre clarifies that while they avoided traditional institutional venture capital, they raised around five million dollars across priced rounds from their extended angel network.
Mid-Roll Sponsorship for SignEasy Document Management 6315 After the mid-roll ad read, Nathan calculates Pierre's ARR on the fly by multiplying 150 customers by their fifty thousand dollar baseline ACV. Pierre confirms it is in the ballpark at just south of seven million ARR, and discusses Traackr's top-down enterprise motion.
Unit Economics, Account Expansion, and Geographic Distribution 6425 When Pierre deflects providing an exact fully weighted CAC figure, Nathan skillfully pivots to payback period and calculates CAC back-of-the-napkin at twenty-five thousand dollars. Pierre details their strong net negative churn and fifty to one hundred fifty percent account expansion.
The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions 3112 The interview concludes smoothly with Nathan's rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire, briefly clarifying Pierre's age and sleep habits before closing out.

Statements from this episode (12)

Insight
Asayag: Influencer relations requires software management just like sales processes
“It's just gotten to a scale now that you need software to manage it very much in the same way you need software to manage your sales process.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 2:09
Insight
Asayag: Brands should court influencers' interest before offering checks
“We actually advise our clients that typically in the relationship with an influencer, your first move is really to court them and pique their interest and not to write a check to them. Cause otherwise it's not going to be a relationship anymore.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 3:27
Disclosure
Asayag: Traackr contracts typically start at $50,000 to $60,000 annually
“Typically we'll start around about 50 to 60,000 dollars a year.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 6:00
Insight
Asayag: Early influencer programs should invest in headcount over software
“But up until then your dollar is probably better invested in resources inside your team than in software. You know, you don't have Salesforce if you have a one person sales team.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 6:34
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Asayag says Traackr has 50 employees and doubles year-over-year
“Now we have about 50 employees in the firm and we roughly double size year over year.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 7:22
Assertion Supported
Asayag says Traackr has raised around $5M in total funding
“I think in total, we probably raised somewhere around five million dollars.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 7:51
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Asayag says Traackr has just north of 150 customers
“We have just north of a 150 customers now.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 8:20
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Pierre Asayag reveals Traackr's ARR is just under $7 million
“So we just south of seven.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 10:35
Disclosure
Asayag: Traackr gets 20% of business from outbound, remainder split inbound-referrals
“We do, I'd say, as it stands today, we're maybe 20% of our business is outbound. And even that it's very, very targeted outbound. And then it's split half and half between inbound and referrals.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 12:17
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Asayag: Traackr recovers CAC within six months on enterprise brands
“Typically we find that with these large brands within six months of onboarding a customer we've been able to recover.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 13:27
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Asayag: Traackr customers expand spend by 50% to 150% upon renewal
“Typically we see so we tier our customers in different groups, but we'll, we see that our customers will tend to increase between 50 and a 150% upon a renewal.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 14:16
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Asayag: Traackr maintains annual logo and revenue churn in low single digits
“I think we're talking about churning the low single digit.”
Pierre Asayag Feb 16, 2018 ▶ 15:37
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