Mar 6, 2023 · 1h 17m · how-i-built-this
Michael Kors: Michael Kors
0:00 / 0:00
gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
Fashion designer Michael Kors recounts his entrepreneurial journey from sewing clothes in his New York apartment to establishing Capri Holdings, a multi-billion-dollar global luxury fashion empire. He reflects on overcoming Chapter 11 bankruptcy, discovering the transformative business power of accessories, and cultivating a democratic, customer-centric design philosophy.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 33.1% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Guy as informed peer 3.4 Guest teaching 1.8 Guest disagreement 1.1 Guy pushing back 0.5
speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 42:06 Pushing back on the concept of 'cheapening' the brand
Kors gently but firmly disagrees with the assumption that lowering price points compromises design integrity, arguing that good design applies at $79 or $7,900.
Hardest push from Guy ▶ 1:09:20 Raz presses on managing public market volatilityRaz pushes Kors on whether fluctuating market caps and quarterly shareholder accountability introduced severe stress to the business.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 1:06:08 Sizing economics of accessories versus apparelKors educates Raz on the fundamental retail economics of handbags, explaining how they eliminate sizing markdowns and fit issues inherent in apparel.
Guy holds their own ▶ 58:50 Raz citing Lawrence Stroll's acquisition remarksRaz demonstrates sharp preparation by quoting Lawrence Stroll's exact contemporary critique regarding Michael Kors needing cash and aggressive management.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Guy as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Guy pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| A Childhood Steeped in Style and Early Modeling | 3 | 1 | 1 | 0 | Guy Raz sets a nostalgic, biographical tone by asking about Kors' childhood, family background, and early child modeling. Kors warmly shares anecdotes about his mother's modeling career and his early TV commercials without any friction. | |
| Teen Years, Finding Individuality, and Studio 54 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 0 | Raz asks about Kors' teen years, identity as an aspiring gay designer in the 1970s, and attending Studio 54. Kors describes his early self-confidence and passion for fashion and nightlife in an engaging, open storytelling mode. | |
| FIT and Hands-On Retail at Lothar's | 3 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Raz explores Kors' brief time at FIT and hands-on retail education at Lothar's. Kors explains the unusual boutique model where he designed small reactive batches for elite clients, educating Raz on how boutique production worked at the time. | |
| The Bergdorf Goodman Breakthrough | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Raz inquires about the discovery by Dawn Mello and the pivotal pitch to Bergdorf Goodman. Kors recounts his early lack of logistical business knowledge and how Bergdorf agreed to fund and support his initial line. | |
| Mid-Episode Break: Moving Out of the Apartment | 4 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Raz asks about bringing in business partner Jack Orchele and the grind of building wholesale relationships across America. Kors elaborates on designing cross-generationally and learning consumer habits through trunk shows. | |
| Scaling with Licensing and Chapter 11 Bankruptcy | 3 | 2 | 2 | 1 | Raz probes the decision to launch a lower-priced bridge line and the subsequent Chapter 11 bankruptcy when their Italian licensee collapsed. Kors gently reframes the necessity of lower price points as broadening reach, admitting the mistakes of relying too heavily on one revenue stream. | |
| Mid-Episode Break: Rebuilding the Brand | 4 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Raz asks how Kors balanced designing his own brand while simultaneously working as creative director at French luxury house Celine. Kors describes learning the strategic importance and profitability of accessories while at Celine. | |
| Partnership with Lawrence Stroll and Global Scaling | 4 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Raz discusses the buyout by Lawrence Stroll and Silas Chou to globally scale the brand. Kors shares early missteps with mass market expectations, such as customer demand for machine-washable sweaters, and details how they balanced luxury branding with accessible fashion. | |
| The Handbag Boom, IPO, and Creative Leadership | 4 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Raz questions the mechanics of accessories driving company margins and how Kors delegates creative design at scale. Kors explains how bags avoid sizing inventory friction and humorously reflects on being wrong about color trends outside New York. | |
| Brand Longevity and Defining Luck as Opportunity | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Raz concludes with reflective questions about brand endurance and the role of luck versus skill. Kors explains his philosophy of luck as leaving oneself open to calculated leaps and maintaining creative curiosity. |
Statements from this episode (12)
Michael Kors worked as a child actor in Lucky Charms and Charmin commercials
“And the first thing I did was in fact, a Lucky Charms commercial. I did a lot of things that, in fact, got tested in different markets. You know, Snapple, for instance, of course, now we think of Snapple as iced tea. I did Snapple apple chips, which that did n…”
Michael Kors skipped his high school prom to visit Studio 54
“Instead of going to my senior high school prom, that was in fact the night that I first went to Studio 54.”
Lothar's dressed Cher, Jackie Kennedy, and Diana Ross in the 70s
“And we had remarkable celebrity clients from around the world. So, you know, we had Cher and Diana Ross and Goldie Hawn, Rudolf Nureyev, Jackie Kennedy.”
Kors: Fashion sportswear means versatile separates, not athletic jogging clothes
“You know, what we in the fashion industry say sportswear, A lot of people think that means jogging clothes, but it's really boils down to sort of this American invention of clothes that are versatile, you know, separate pieces that you can wear different ways.”
Bergdorf Goodman secured one-year New York exclusivity for Kors's debut line
“Don Mello said, we really think the clothes are terrific, and we think they're perfect for Bergdorf Goodman, and we... We want to be the only store in New York to carry the collection for at least a year.”
Kors: Good designers solve problems democratically across ages and sizes
“If you're good at what you do, you're a problem solver. You're solving the puzzle. So you should be able to design in such a way that you get your message across, but at the same time, you have that possibility to be democratic, whether that's just in size or …”
Michael Kors kept producing and shipping collections during Chapter 11 bankruptcy
“We went into Chapter 11 bankruptcy, but the, right away we made the decision
We're not gonna stop producing our collection.
We're gonna continue to ship it to the stores, and we're gonna continue doing business.
Maybe we won't be able to have an advertising…”
Kors: Handbags and footwear made up the bulk of Celine's business
“My eyes opened at Celine to the power of accessories handbags and footwear which was the bulk of their business.”
Kors: LVMH and Kashiyama investments stabilized brand to launch accessories
“We had an investment from Arnold Kashyama and we had the investment in 99 from LVMH. Definitely put us on much more stable ground to grow the business and to launch Michael Kors accessories in the early, I think it was, 2000, actually.”
The luxury fashion playbook is never talking down to the customer
“I think the big playbook is never talk down to the customer. So whether it's a t-shirt or an evening gown, It's thoughtfully and intelligently designed, and we also have to remember, in a world that is casual, the richest person in the world does not fill thei…”
Sizing makes apparel much more expensive to manage than accessories
“Well, the thing we have to remember about apparel versus a handbag, handbags don't have a size. In clothing, invariably, and we all know when we go shopping, if you wear a size 34 jean, and somehow you go to the store and they've got a hundred pairs of jeans, …”