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Jun 14, 2016 · 19m · top-founders

What if An Accounting Firm Was Built Specifically For Young Entrepreneurs? EP 285: Finn Kelly

Nathan Latka · 9m spoken Finn Kelly · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

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In Episode 285 of The Top, host Nathan Latka interviews entrepreneur Finn Kelly, co-founder of We Love Numbers, exploring how he scaled a tech-enabled accounting platform to $50,000 MRR. Kelly reveals the company's SaaS unit economics, capital-raising plans on a convertible note, and strategic lessons from previous multi-million-dollar business exits.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 53.7% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.3 Guest teaching 1.6 Guest disagreement 1.1 Nathan pushing back 2.3
05100:0010:000:44–4:12 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Weekly Giveaway Winner Announcement and Contest Details Nathan introduces Finn Kelly and inquires into the We Love Numbers business model, asking whether the service is intended to replace a startup CFO.4:12–6:21 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Cloud Integration, Dashboard Metrics, and Strategic Advisory Nathan presses Finn to explain the strategic advisory value proposition rather than just software setup, leading Finn to explain their vertical benchmarking.6:21–9:13 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Customer Base, Pipeline Growth, and Monthly Recurring Revenue Nathan calculates MRR on the fly and challenges Finn on how private wealth management advisory firms are valued upon exit.9:13–12:18 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Capital Raising Strategy and the Software-Plus-Service Model Nathan demonstrates SaaS metrics mastery by calculating customer lifetime value based on worst-case and target monthly churn rates.12:18–14:55 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Distributed Team Operations and Monthly Headcount Burn Nathan estimates net monthly cash burn based on payroll expenses and asks precise questions regarding convertible note caps and terms.14:55–18:16 · Nathan as informed peer 2/10 Sponsor Message: FreshBooks Mobile Expense Tracking Nathan reads sponsor promos for FreshBooks and HostGator before moving through the rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire.18:16–18:49 · Nathan as informed peer 0/10 Interview Recap and Final Thoughts with Finn Kelly Nathan delivers a monologue wrap-up summarizing Finn Kelly's business statistics, previous exit, and funding goals.0:44–4:12 · Guest teaching 2/10 Weekly Giveaway Winner Announcement and Contest Details Nathan introduces Finn Kelly and inquires into the We Love Numbers business model, asking whether the service is intended to replace a startup CFO.4:12–6:21 · Guest teaching 3/10 Cloud Integration, Dashboard Metrics, and Strategic Advisory Nathan presses Finn to explain the strategic advisory value proposition rather than just software setup, leading Finn to explain their vertical benchmarking.6:21–9:13 · Guest teaching 3/10 Customer Base, Pipeline Growth, and Monthly Recurring Revenue Nathan calculates MRR on the fly and challenges Finn on how private wealth management advisory firms are valued upon exit.9:13–12:18 · Guest teaching 1/10 Capital Raising Strategy and the Software-Plus-Service Model Nathan demonstrates SaaS metrics mastery by calculating customer lifetime value based on worst-case and target monthly churn rates.12:18–14:55 · Guest teaching 1/10 Distributed Team Operations and Monthly Headcount Burn Nathan estimates net monthly cash burn based on payroll expenses and asks precise questions regarding convertible note caps and terms.14:55–18:16 · Guest teaching 1/10 Sponsor Message: FreshBooks Mobile Expense Tracking Nathan reads sponsor promos for FreshBooks and HostGator before moving through the rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire.18:16–18:49 · Guest teaching 0/10 Interview Recap and Final Thoughts with Finn Kelly Nathan delivers a monologue wrap-up summarizing Finn Kelly's business statistics, previous exit, and funding goals.0:44–4:12 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Weekly Giveaway Winner Announcement and Contest Details Nathan introduces Finn Kelly and inquires into the We Love Numbers business model, asking whether the service is intended to replace a startup CFO.4:12–6:21 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Cloud Integration, Dashboard Metrics, and Strategic Advisory Nathan presses Finn to explain the strategic advisory value proposition rather than just software setup, leading Finn to explain their vertical benchmarking.6:21–9:13 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Customer Base, Pipeline Growth, and Monthly Recurring Revenue Nathan calculates MRR on the fly and challenges Finn on how private wealth management advisory firms are valued upon exit.9:13–12:18 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Capital Raising Strategy and the Software-Plus-Service Model Nathan demonstrates SaaS metrics mastery by calculating customer lifetime value based on worst-case and target monthly churn rates.12:18–14:55 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Distributed Team Operations and Monthly Headcount Burn Nathan estimates net monthly cash burn based on payroll expenses and asks precise questions regarding convertible note caps and terms.14:55–18:16 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Sponsor Message: FreshBooks Mobile Expense Tracking Nathan reads sponsor promos for FreshBooks and HostGator before moving through the rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire.18:16–18:49 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Interview Recap and Final Thoughts with Finn Kelly Nathan delivers a monologue wrap-up summarizing Finn Kelly's business statistics, previous exit, and funding goals.0:44–4:12 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Weekly Giveaway Winner Announcement and Contest Details Nathan introduces Finn Kelly and inquires into the We Love Numbers business model, asking whether the service is intended to replace a startup CFO.4:12–6:21 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Cloud Integration, Dashboard Metrics, and Strategic Advisory Nathan presses Finn to explain the strategic advisory value proposition rather than just software setup, leading Finn to explain their vertical benchmarking.6:21–9:13 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Customer Base, Pipeline Growth, and Monthly Recurring Revenue Nathan calculates MRR on the fly and challenges Finn on how private wealth management advisory firms are valued upon exit.9:13–12:18 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Capital Raising Strategy and the Software-Plus-Service Model Nathan demonstrates SaaS metrics mastery by calculating customer lifetime value based on worst-case and target monthly churn rates.12:18–14:55 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Distributed Team Operations and Monthly Headcount Burn Nathan estimates net monthly cash burn based on payroll expenses and asks precise questions regarding convertible note caps and terms.14:55–18:16 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Sponsor Message: FreshBooks Mobile Expense Tracking Nathan reads sponsor promos for FreshBooks and HostGator before moving through the rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire.18:16–18:49 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 Interview Recap and Final Thoughts with Finn Kelly Nathan delivers a monologue wrap-up summarizing Finn Kelly's business statistics, previous exit, and funding goals.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 80.8% · guest 19.2%0:00 · Nathan 80.8% · guest 19.2%3:00 · Nathan 23.6% · guest 76.4%3:00 · Nathan 23.6% · guest 76.4%6:00 · Nathan 35.3% · guest 64.7%6:00 · Nathan 35.3% · guest 64.7%9:00 · Nathan 31.8% · guest 68.2%9:00 · Nathan 31.8% · guest 68.2%12:00 · Nathan 52.2% · guest 47.8%12:00 · Nathan 52.2% · guest 47.8%15:00 · Nathan 76.7% · guest 23.3%15:00 · Nathan 76.7% · guest 23.3%18:00 · Nathan 90% · guest 10%18:00 · Nathan 90% · guest 10%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 4:28 Rejecting manual ledger submissions

Finn directly counters Nathan's hypothetical about sending a general ledger spreadsheet, explaining that manual spreadsheets are rejected in favor of automated cloud platforms.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 8:23 Challenging wealth firm valuation metrics

Nathan refuses Finn's explanation that wealth management firms trade purely on recurring revenue multiples, arguing the business value is tied to the manager's personal Rolodex.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 8:29 Explaining systematic wealth management retention

Finn educates Nathan on how implementing standardized operating processes retains clients and makes an advisory firm transferable independently of the founder's Rolodex.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 11:36 Calculating LTV from churn metrics

Nathan flexes deep SaaS financial acumen by immediately executing inverse churn calculations to determine customer lifetime and expected revenue value.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Weekly Giveaway Winner Announcement and Contest Details 4212 Nathan introduces Finn Kelly and inquires into the We Love Numbers business model, asking whether the service is intended to replace a startup CFO.
Cloud Integration, Dashboard Metrics, and Strategic Advisory 5324 Nathan presses Finn to explain the strategic advisory value proposition rather than just software setup, leading Finn to explain their vertical benchmarking.
Customer Base, Pipeline Growth, and Monthly Recurring Revenue 6324 Nathan calculates MRR on the fly and challenges Finn on how private wealth management advisory firms are valued upon exit.
Capital Raising Strategy and the Software-Plus-Service Model 7113 Nathan demonstrates SaaS metrics mastery by calculating customer lifetime value based on worst-case and target monthly churn rates.
Distributed Team Operations and Monthly Headcount Burn 6112 Nathan estimates net monthly cash burn based on payroll expenses and asks precise questions regarding convertible note caps and terms.
Sponsor Message: FreshBooks Mobile Expense Tracking 2111 Nathan reads sponsor promos for FreshBooks and HostGator before moving through the rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire.
Interview Recap and Final Thoughts with Finn Kelly 0000 Nathan delivers a monologue wrap-up summarizing Finn Kelly's business statistics, previous exit, and funding goals.

Statements from this episode (15)

Assertion Not publicly verifiable
We Love Numbers charges $395 to $1,695 monthly for accounting packages
“So we have four different packages ranging from three 95 To 16 95 a month, and then we have some add-ons for payroll and a finance team.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 2:41
Disclosure
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers targets F&B, post-raise tech, and professional services
“We also have three target markets that we work with. So food and beverage tech companies, which are post raise and product market fit and innovative professional services.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 5:50
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers has 50 customers and 900 pipeline leads
“We're currently working with over 50 customers, but we've got about 900 in the pipeline.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 6:28
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers averages over $1,000 per customer monthly
“The average we would say is just over a thousand dollars a month.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 7:15
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Finn Kelly sold his prior wealth management firm for $1M to $5M
“So we sold that for multiple million. Not in the eight figures, but in the between a 1,000,05 million, something like that.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 8:43
Disclosure
Finn Kelly has built six bootstrapped businesses and sold two
“We've now had six businesses between Sarah and I, and we've actually sold a couple, still got a few more going, and we've built them all through our own funding.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 9:18
Opinion
Finn Kelly: No brand dominates entrepreneurial accounting
“No one's really established the brand for entrepreneurial accounting.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 9:35
Insight
Finn Kelly: Pure service-based accounting business models fail to scale
“It's very important that we focus on that model because that's how you scale where everyone else is trying to compete in service-based businesses and they just don't work.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 10:07
Disclosure
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers is seeking to raise $750,000
“So we're looking to raise probably about seven 50 K.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 10:23
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers hit a peak 10% monthly churn rate
“Oh, the worst we've had would be we had a 10% month one time.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 11:14
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Finn Kelly targets $40,000 in average customer lifetime value for his startup
“And we actually believe we'll be able to get the lifetime customer value a lot higher. We actually believe. Yeah. We'll be able to get sort of an average of that 40,000 dollars. We believe.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 11:46
Disclosure
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers operates with a 10-person global team
“So at the moment we've got 10 people in the team and we run a global team. So we actually have people in Australia, Philippines, America South Africa, and we do everything online and it works really well.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 12:20
Disclosure
Finn Kelly: We Love Numbers spends $60,000 to $70,000 monthly on headcount
“Yeah, it's about 60, 70 at the moment.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 12:45
Disclosure
Finn Kelly targets $6 million pre-money valuation for We Love Numbers
“I'm looking and I haven't fully finalized the terms, but I'm looking at sort of a six million valuation at the moment.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 13:39
Disclosure
Finn Kelly rejects VC funding in favor of strategic angel investors
“Like I don't want VC money or anything like that. I'm looking for actual people who can add strategic value. So whether it's entrepreneurs or people in like EO and YEC with myself or YPO and then, like, influences, partner referrals, and advisors.”
Finn Kelly Jun 14, 2016 ▶ 14:02
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