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Sep 24, 2020 · 17m · top-founders

Checkli Launches Enterprise Plan To Get Past $5k in MRR

Marvin Russell · 10m spoken Nathan Latka · 5m spoken Eric Yuan · 4s spoken Frank Bien · 4s spoken Vivek Bhaskaran · 2s spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this interview with Nathan Latka, founder Marvin Russell explains how he pivoted Checkli from a low-ticket consumer checklist app into a B2B recurring workflow platform, doubling monthly recurring revenue to nearly $4,000 through organic SEO while balancing his role as Head of Growth at SureSwift Capital.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 31.9% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.6 Guest teaching 3.0 Guest disagreement 2.2 Nathan pushing back 3.8
05100:0010:001:32–6:02 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Marvin Russell's Background and Checkli's Early Monetization Challenges Nathan breaks down Checkli's pricing and revenue math based on customer counts. Marvin is agreeable and admits Nathan had previously warned him that growing a checklist app would be tough.6:03–9:18 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 SaaS Moats, Big Tech Competition, and Bootstrapping Roots Nathan directly challenges the defensibility of the product, sharing how he closed down his own 100k ARR plugin because of Google competition. Marvin respectfully counters by arguing that hyper-focus is a solo founder's moat against big tech.9:20–12:30 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Sponsor Segment: Exit Multiples and Flippa Valuation Calculator Following a sponsor ad read on company valuation, Nathan interrogates churn rates and the lack of upsell potential. Marvin explains his zero-CAC acquisition strategy driven by top-ranking SEO.12:30–14:31 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Evaluating Data Monetization Potential Versus Strategic Acquisitions Nathan suggests selling the SEO asset to Canva for a low multiple and dismisses Marvin's data monetization idea. Marvin corrects Nathan's inaccurate assumption about his prior exit numbers.14:31–17:34 · Nathan as informed peer 3/10 Playbooks for Portfolio Growth at SureSwift Capital Marvin details SureSwift's Robert Smith-inspired growth playbook across their SaaS portfolio before moving into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire segment.1:32–6:02 · Guest teaching 1/10 Marvin Russell's Background and Checkli's Early Monetization Challenges Nathan breaks down Checkli's pricing and revenue math based on customer counts. Marvin is agreeable and admits Nathan had previously warned him that growing a checklist app would be tough.6:03–9:18 · Guest teaching 4/10 SaaS Moats, Big Tech Competition, and Bootstrapping Roots Nathan directly challenges the defensibility of the product, sharing how he closed down his own 100k ARR plugin because of Google competition. Marvin respectfully counters by arguing that hyper-focus is a solo founder's moat against big tech.9:20–12:30 · Guest teaching 2/10 Sponsor Segment: Exit Multiples and Flippa Valuation Calculator Following a sponsor ad read on company valuation, Nathan interrogates churn rates and the lack of upsell potential. Marvin explains his zero-CAC acquisition strategy driven by top-ranking SEO.12:30–14:31 · Guest teaching 6/10 Evaluating Data Monetization Potential Versus Strategic Acquisitions Nathan suggests selling the SEO asset to Canva for a low multiple and dismisses Marvin's data monetization idea. Marvin corrects Nathan's inaccurate assumption about his prior exit numbers.14:31–17:34 · Guest teaching 2/10 Playbooks for Portfolio Growth at SureSwift Capital Marvin details SureSwift's Robert Smith-inspired growth playbook across their SaaS portfolio before moving into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire segment.1:32–6:02 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Marvin Russell's Background and Checkli's Early Monetization Challenges Nathan breaks down Checkli's pricing and revenue math based on customer counts. Marvin is agreeable and admits Nathan had previously warned him that growing a checklist app would be tough.6:03–9:18 · Guest disagreement 3/10 SaaS Moats, Big Tech Competition, and Bootstrapping Roots Nathan directly challenges the defensibility of the product, sharing how he closed down his own 100k ARR plugin because of Google competition. Marvin respectfully counters by arguing that hyper-focus is a solo founder's moat against big tech.9:20–12:30 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Sponsor Segment: Exit Multiples and Flippa Valuation Calculator Following a sponsor ad read on company valuation, Nathan interrogates churn rates and the lack of upsell potential. Marvin explains his zero-CAC acquisition strategy driven by top-ranking SEO.12:30–14:31 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Evaluating Data Monetization Potential Versus Strategic Acquisitions Nathan suggests selling the SEO asset to Canva for a low multiple and dismisses Marvin's data monetization idea. Marvin corrects Nathan's inaccurate assumption about his prior exit numbers.14:31–17:34 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Playbooks for Portfolio Growth at SureSwift Capital Marvin details SureSwift's Robert Smith-inspired growth playbook across their SaaS portfolio before moving into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire segment.1:32–6:02 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Marvin Russell's Background and Checkli's Early Monetization Challenges Nathan breaks down Checkli's pricing and revenue math based on customer counts. Marvin is agreeable and admits Nathan had previously warned him that growing a checklist app would be tough.6:03–9:18 · Nathan pushing back 6/10 SaaS Moats, Big Tech Competition, and Bootstrapping Roots Nathan directly challenges the defensibility of the product, sharing how he closed down his own 100k ARR plugin because of Google competition. Marvin respectfully counters by arguing that hyper-focus is a solo founder's moat against big tech.9:20–12:30 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Sponsor Segment: Exit Multiples and Flippa Valuation Calculator Following a sponsor ad read on company valuation, Nathan interrogates churn rates and the lack of upsell potential. Marvin explains his zero-CAC acquisition strategy driven by top-ranking SEO.12:30–14:31 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Evaluating Data Monetization Potential Versus Strategic Acquisitions Nathan suggests selling the SEO asset to Canva for a low multiple and dismisses Marvin's data monetization idea. Marvin corrects Nathan's inaccurate assumption about his prior exit numbers.14:31–17:34 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Playbooks for Portfolio Growth at SureSwift Capital Marvin details SureSwift's Robert Smith-inspired growth playbook across their SaaS portfolio before moving into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire segment.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 56.6% · guest 43.4%0:00 · Nathan 56.6% · guest 43.4%3:00 · Nathan 7.1% · guest 92.9%3:00 · Nathan 7.1% · guest 92.9%6:00 · Nathan 26% · guest 74%6:00 · Nathan 26% · guest 74%9:00 · Nathan 56.4% · guest 43.6%9:00 · Nathan 56.4% · guest 43.6%12:00 · Nathan 18.2% · guest 81.8%12:00 · Nathan 18.2% · guest 81.8%15:00 · Nathan 27% · guest 73%15:00 · Nathan 27% · guest 73%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 14:14 Marvin refutes Nathan's exit valuation assumption

Marvin directly pushes back against Nathan's low exit estimate, correcting him that MySiteAuditor sold for north of seven figures rather than sub-million.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 6:03 Nathan challenges the point of building against Google

Nathan bluntly refuses the premise of investing heavy time into a checklist tool that Google could release for free overnight.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 14:14 Marvin sets the record straight on past transaction history

Marvin corrects Nathan's erroneous claim that his exit was sub-seven figures by detailing his actual agency and software sales figures.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 6:03 Nathan brings personal founder experience shutting down competing tech

Nathan demonstrates operational expertise by citing his own hundred-thousand-dollar ARR Google plugin shutdown to pressure Marvin on defensibility.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Marvin Russell's Background and Checkli's Early Monetization Challenges 5113 Nathan breaks down Checkli's pricing and revenue math based on customer counts. Marvin is agreeable and admits Nathan had previously warned him that growing a checklist app would be tough.
SaaS Moats, Big Tech Competition, and Bootstrapping Roots 6436 Nathan directly challenges the defensibility of the product, sharing how he closed down his own 100k ARR plugin because of Google competition. Marvin respectfully counters by arguing that hyper-focus is a solo founder's moat against big tech.
Sponsor Segment: Exit Multiples and Flippa Valuation Calculator 4213 Following a sponsor ad read on company valuation, Nathan interrogates churn rates and the lack of upsell potential. Marvin explains his zero-CAC acquisition strategy driven by top-ranking SEO.
Evaluating Data Monetization Potential Versus Strategic Acquisitions 5645 Nathan suggests selling the SEO asset to Canva for a low multiple and dismisses Marvin's data monetization idea. Marvin corrects Nathan's inaccurate assumption about his prior exit numbers.
Playbooks for Portfolio Growth at SureSwift Capital 3222 Marvin details SureSwift's Robert Smith-inspired growth playbook across their SaaS portfolio before moving into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire segment.

Statements from this episode (12)

Insight
Russell: Low-price checklist apps cannot achieve sustainable revenue
“There's a ton of free checklist apps, and I thought, you know, we had really cool features that set us apart, and even then, with those really cool features, you know, the price point was like five or six bucks a month, and just even 203 hundred customers just…”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 2:16
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Checkli has 500 paying customers, including 36 on its business plan
“We have about 500 people paying for Checkly. Most of them are still on the, just paying us monthly for making checklists. It's like between five and seven bucks, depending on what part of the year they signed up. But now just in the last two months, we've sign…”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 4:08
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Checkli grew MRR from $2,000 to nearly $4,000 in two months
“We're growing up until two months ago, we were at like 2000. Now we're closing in on 4000 and we're growing.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 5:55
Disclosure
Nathan Latka shut down a $100K ARR Google plugin over platform risk
“I used to have a plugin that did sort of the same thing inside Google and I just shut it down. It was doing a hundred grand in ARR. Just shut it down. Cause I'm like, I can't keep up with Google and they're going to release this for free anyway soon.”
Nathan Latka Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 6:16
Disclosure
Checkli raised about $50,000 in total outside funding
“Oh, we raised like 50,000 dollars.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 7:23
Assertion Supported
SureSwift Capital had acquired roughly 36 companies by September 2020
“You know, they've acquired like, I think, 36 companies right now.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 7:44
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Russell: Checkli's monthly customer churn rate is 3.4%
“Right now it's at 3.4%, and it's dropped a little bit, so it's not bad.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 10:46
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Checkli generated 100,000 monthly website visitors as of September 2020
“Like I have a 100,000 people coming to my website every single month, but most of them are on the free plan.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 11:14
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Checkli achieves zero CAC through top Google rankings for checklist terms
“It's honestly free because I think we talked about this in the past, like with my site auditor, I have a massive SEO background. Like if you Google free checklist maker or checklist or any of those things, I'm number one for almost everything related to checkl…”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 11:54
Assertion Partly supported
AddThis generates millions purely by selling user data, says Marvin Russell
“I know they have, you know, they went a hundred percent free and they're making millions off just, you know, selling your data.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 13:26
Disclosure
Marvin Russell exited his agency for $300K and MySiteAuditor for $1M+
“No, my first exit was my agency. I built a small agency and that was a 300,000 dollar exit. My company was north of seven figures. I won't give the exact number, but it was over a million dollars.”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 14:15
Disclosure
SureSwift Capital targets bootstrapped SaaS firms with $1M–$5M revenue
“So there, so there's a team of acquisition people that are, we're looking to acquire, you know, SaaS bootstrap SaaS companies, people with zero investors, right? So bootstrap SaaS companies, and we're looking for, you know, companies that are in the one to fiv…”
Marvin Russell Sep 24, 2020 ▶ 14:39
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