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Mar 20, 2023 · 21m · top-founders

SaaS For Power Grids Hits $5m ARR Charging $5 Per Utility Meter

Jonas Danzeisen · 11m spoken Nathan Latka · 7m spoken
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Nathan Latka interviews Jonas Danzeisen, co-founder of Venios, exploring how the capital-efficient grid software company scaled to $5 million in ARR with zero customer churn while modernizing decentralized power infrastructure worldwide.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 38.5% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.8 Guest teaching 2.5 Guest disagreement 2.0 Nathan pushing back 4.3
05100:0010:0020:000:00–4:18 · Nathan as informed peer 3/10 Founderpath Valuation Tool Promotion Nathan introduces the company after a sponsorship monologue and inquires about target buyers and technical utility operations. Jonas provides an educational analogy about the champagne pyramid power grid transition.4:18–7:30 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Substation-Based Pricing and Implementation Model Nathan presses Jonas to simplify complex substation pricing and break out SaaS fees from one-time implementation costs. Jonas clarifies the exact pricing ranges across different utility sizes.7:30–10:48 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Zero Churn, Platform Architecture, and Global Scale When Jonas responds to a churn question with an architectural explanation, Nathan bluntly redirects him back to net retention and whether any customer has ever downgraded substations.10:49–15:25 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Team Composition and Capital-Efficient Funding History Nathan calculates MRR and revenue per employee while pressing Jonas on exact historical growth rates after Jonas struggles to recall past-year numbers immediately.15:25–19:24 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Expansion Plans, Target Valuation, and Global TAM Nathan catches an inconsistency in Jonas's team breakdown regarding engineers doing sales, challenges his valuation expectations, and counters his growth claims by citing his recent 20 percent growth rate.19:25–21:10 · Nathan as informed peer 2/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Standard Famous Five rapid-fire closing segment with quick questions on sleep, favorite CEO, and life lessons, conducted smoothly without friction.0:00–4:18 · Guest teaching 4/10 Founderpath Valuation Tool Promotion Nathan introduces the company after a sponsorship monologue and inquires about target buyers and technical utility operations. Jonas provides an educational analogy about the champagne pyramid power grid transition.4:18–7:30 · Guest teaching 3/10 Substation-Based Pricing and Implementation Model Nathan presses Jonas to simplify complex substation pricing and break out SaaS fees from one-time implementation costs. Jonas clarifies the exact pricing ranges across different utility sizes.7:30–10:48 · Guest teaching 2/10 Zero Churn, Platform Architecture, and Global Scale When Jonas responds to a churn question with an architectural explanation, Nathan bluntly redirects him back to net retention and whether any customer has ever downgraded substations.10:49–15:25 · Guest teaching 2/10 Team Composition and Capital-Efficient Funding History Nathan calculates MRR and revenue per employee while pressing Jonas on exact historical growth rates after Jonas struggles to recall past-year numbers immediately.15:25–19:24 · Guest teaching 3/10 Expansion Plans, Target Valuation, and Global TAM Nathan catches an inconsistency in Jonas's team breakdown regarding engineers doing sales, challenges his valuation expectations, and counters his growth claims by citing his recent 20 percent growth rate.19:25–21:10 · Guest teaching 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Standard Famous Five rapid-fire closing segment with quick questions on sleep, favorite CEO, and life lessons, conducted smoothly without friction.0:00–4:18 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Founderpath Valuation Tool Promotion Nathan introduces the company after a sponsorship monologue and inquires about target buyers and technical utility operations. Jonas provides an educational analogy about the champagne pyramid power grid transition.4:18–7:30 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Substation-Based Pricing and Implementation Model Nathan presses Jonas to simplify complex substation pricing and break out SaaS fees from one-time implementation costs. Jonas clarifies the exact pricing ranges across different utility sizes.7:30–10:48 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Zero Churn, Platform Architecture, and Global Scale When Jonas responds to a churn question with an architectural explanation, Nathan bluntly redirects him back to net retention and whether any customer has ever downgraded substations.10:49–15:25 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Team Composition and Capital-Efficient Funding History Nathan calculates MRR and revenue per employee while pressing Jonas on exact historical growth rates after Jonas struggles to recall past-year numbers immediately.15:25–19:24 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Expansion Plans, Target Valuation, and Global TAM Nathan catches an inconsistency in Jonas's team breakdown regarding engineers doing sales, challenges his valuation expectations, and counters his growth claims by citing his recent 20 percent growth rate.19:25–21:10 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Standard Famous Five rapid-fire closing segment with quick questions on sleep, favorite CEO, and life lessons, conducted smoothly without friction.0:00–4:18 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Founderpath Valuation Tool Promotion Nathan introduces the company after a sponsorship monologue and inquires about target buyers and technical utility operations. Jonas provides an educational analogy about the champagne pyramid power grid transition.4:18–7:30 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Substation-Based Pricing and Implementation Model Nathan presses Jonas to simplify complex substation pricing and break out SaaS fees from one-time implementation costs. Jonas clarifies the exact pricing ranges across different utility sizes.7:30–10:48 · Nathan pushing back 6/10 Zero Churn, Platform Architecture, and Global Scale When Jonas responds to a churn question with an architectural explanation, Nathan bluntly redirects him back to net retention and whether any customer has ever downgraded substations.10:49–15:25 · Nathan pushing back 6/10 Team Composition and Capital-Efficient Funding History Nathan calculates MRR and revenue per employee while pressing Jonas on exact historical growth rates after Jonas struggles to recall past-year numbers immediately.15:25–19:24 · Nathan pushing back 7/10 Expansion Plans, Target Valuation, and Global TAM Nathan catches an inconsistency in Jonas's team breakdown regarding engineers doing sales, challenges his valuation expectations, and counters his growth claims by citing his recent 20 percent growth rate.19:25–21:10 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Standard Famous Five rapid-fire closing segment with quick questions on sleep, favorite CEO, and life lessons, conducted smoothly without friction.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 77.7% · guest 22.3%0:00 · Nathan 77.7% · guest 22.3%3:00 · Nathan 15.7% · guest 84.3%3:00 · Nathan 15.7% · guest 84.3%6:00 · Nathan 29.6% · guest 70.4%6:00 · Nathan 29.6% · guest 70.4%9:00 · Nathan 33.9% · guest 66.1%9:00 · Nathan 33.9% · guest 66.1%12:00 · Nathan 42.5% · guest 57.5%12:00 · Nathan 42.5% · guest 57.5%15:00 · Nathan 35.2% · guest 64.8%15:00 · Nathan 35.2% · guest 64.8%18:00 · Nathan 25% · guest 75%18:00 · Nathan 25% · guest 75%21:00 · Nathan 73% · guest 27%21:00 · Nathan 73% · guest 27%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 18:00 Jonas rejects selling out and defends massive enterprise TAM

Jonas firmly rejects Nathan's buyout scenario by citing a multi-trillion-dollar global grid infrastructure investment pipeline to justify independent scale.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 9:06 Nathan refuses architectural detour to focus on customer downgrades

Nathan explicitly cuts through Jonas's explanation of product value and return on investment to restate his specific question about substation downgrades.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 2:58 Jonas describes the reverse champagne pyramid problem in power grids

Jonas educates Nathan on how renewable energy transforms top-down electrical distribution into a complex bottom-up decentralized network.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 19:05 Nathan checks Jonas's doubling claim against reported metrics

Nathan immediately catches Jonas claiming annual doubling and directly reminds him that he just admitted to 20 percent growth over the last 12 months.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Founderpath Valuation Tool Promotion 3411 Nathan introduces the company after a sponsorship monologue and inquires about target buyers and technical utility operations. Jonas provides an educational analogy about the champagne pyramid power grid transition.
Substation-Based Pricing and Implementation Model 5325 Nathan presses Jonas to simplify complex substation pricing and break out SaaS fees from one-time implementation costs. Jonas clarifies the exact pricing ranges across different utility sizes.
Zero Churn, Platform Architecture, and Global Scale 6226 When Jonas responds to a churn question with an architectural explanation, Nathan bluntly redirects him back to net retention and whether any customer has ever downgraded substations.
Team Composition and Capital-Efficient Funding History 6226 Nathan calculates MRR and revenue per employee while pressing Jonas on exact historical growth rates after Jonas struggles to recall past-year numbers immediately.
Expansion Plans, Target Valuation, and Global TAM 7347 Nathan catches an inconsistency in Jonas's team breakdown regarding engineers doing sales, challenges his valuation expectations, and counters his growth claims by citing his recent 20 percent growth rate.
The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions 2111 Standard Famous Five rapid-fire closing segment with quick questions on sleep, favorite CEO, and life lessons, conducted smoothly without friction.

Statements from this episode (12)

Disclosure
Danzeisen: Venios operates across Europe, South America, and India
“We started in Germany, then rather fast went into Netherlands, Austria, and Switzerland. Now we do have activities are in whole Europe and also first activities in South America and also in India.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 2:27
Disclosure
Danzeisen: Venios annual SaaS contracts range from $50k to $300k
“Depending on the size, it's between 50 to 300. Nathan Latka: 300,000 dollars per year. Jonas Danzeisen: Yeah. Nathan Latka: Okay. Nathan Latka: Okay. Jonas Danzeisen: Got it. Jonas Danzeisen: 50 to 300,000.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 5:49
Disclosure
Danzeisen: Venios charges $150k-$200k implementation on $50k SaaS contracts
“If 50,000 is SAS fee, then you have an implementation project of roughly a 150 to 200.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 7:13
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Venios maintains zero customer churn rate
“That's so we do have so we don't have a churn rate. Churn rate is zero.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 7:39
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Roughly 100 power grid operators use Venios
“Roughly a hundred.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 10:11
Assertion Partly supported
Danzeisen: Venios contracts two of three distribution system operators in Delhi
“We have two of three DSOs in Delhi and in India, and one DSO one sheet of Delhi is roughly Like, 80%, 90% of Scandinavia.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 10:24
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Venios employs roughly 30 full-time staff
“Roughly 30, 30 people.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 10:53
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Venios has raised less than $1 million in total capital
“So all in, there was investment of less than one million into the company.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 12:07
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Venios monthly recurring revenue is slightly under $400K
“It's a little less, but the region is, is correct.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 12:47
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Venios grew 250% in 2021 and roughly 10-20% in 2022
“Last 12 months was so we did have upgrows of 250% in 2021. And restructured and yeah, restructured the company last year. So there was a growth of roughly 10, 20%. I have to check the numbers in detail.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 13:35
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Danzeisen: Venios completes utility implementations in under 10 days
“Normally we could do an implementation of a customer up to 10,000 substations was is roughly a million counting points within less than less than 10 days, including all the infrastructure.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 14:36
Disclosure
Danzeisen: Venios will expand sales team to 4-5 reps within 12 months
“Sales team will grow up to four to five people within the next 12 months.”
Jonas Danzeisen Mar 20, 2023 ▶ 16:31
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