May 27, 2024 · 1h 0m · how-i-built-this
Concept2 Rowing Machines: Dick and Peter Dreissigacker
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
In this episode of How I Built This, host Guy Raz interviews Concept2 founders Dick and Peter Dreissigacker about how they engineered composite oars and air-resistance indoor rowing machines from a rural Vermont barn. The brothers recount their technical innovations, early market setbacks against indoor spinning, the transformative CrossFit boom, and their enduring commitment to independent manufacturing.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 45.6% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Guy as informed peer 2.8 Guest teaching 1.5 Guest disagreement 0.0 Guy pushing back 0.0
speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 32:09 Peter rejects conventional market research framing
Peter dismisses Raz's inquiry into market research, stating they never approached product development from a business major's calculated perspective.
Hardest push from Guy ▶ 50:07 Raz presses on low-tech monitors versus Peloton screensRaz questions why Concept2 avoided high-definition screens and connected media content while rivals like Peloton and Hydrow emerged.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 18:04 Dick details the physics of swing arc and oar weightDick breaks down the rotational physics of oar stroke recovery and shaft wind resistance to explain why a 1.5-pound reduction matters in competitive racing.
Guy holds their own ▶ 56:07 Raz suggests employee-ownership precedent from Bob's Red MillRaz brings external business case knowledge citing Bob Moore of Bob's Red Mill transferring company ownership to employees when evaluating succession.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Guy as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Guy pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Pre-Show Announcement: Launching the New Show Newsletter | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Introduction and promo announcement by Guy Raz with brief audio snippets previewing the episode. Monologue / teaser style with zero friction. | |
| New England Roots and Dick's Collegiate Rowing Start | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Raz asks about their New England upbringing and Dick's introduction to collegiate rowing at Brown. Friendly, conversational biographical background. | |
| Olympic Trials, Field Events, and Early Rowing Struggles | 3 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Dick describes making the 1972 Munich Olympic team, while Peter explains throwing discus and shot put and his disastrous first experience rowing in Philadelphia. | |
| Stanford Engineering and Developing the Composite Oar Prototype | 4 | 3 | 0 | 0 | Peter and Dick explain Stanford graduate studies, designing the composite carbon fiber oar prototype, and how reducing weight creates distinct aerodynamic and mechanical advantages. | |
| Moving to Rural Vermont and Navigating Family Expectations | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | The brothers discuss moving to rural Vermont to set up a lifestyle workshop on a dairy farm and their parents' quiet bewilderment at their unconventional career choices. | |
| Mid-Roll Break: Teasing the Stationary Rowing Machine | 3 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Discussion of early oar production, origin of the Concept2 name, Yale beating Harvard with their oars, and the impact of Title IX on collegiate rowing demand. | |
| Inventing the Air-Resistance Model A Rowing Machine | 4 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Brothers describe building the Model A prototype from an inverted bicycle and air resistance fan blades, pricing it at 400 dollars, and launching the first indoor race in Boston. | |
| Direct Sales, Model B Enclosure, and Spinning Rivalry | 4 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Discussion of Model B enclosed flywheel safety improvements, refusal to sell through high-margin retail stores, and early studio rowing flop caused by the rise of spinning. | |
| Intermission: Listener Voice Memo and Episode Teaser | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Mid-roll break containing a listener voicemail from Paris and Guy Raz teasing the CrossFit chapter of the company history. | |
| Open Data Tech Philosophy and Purpose Trust Succession | 4 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Raz and guests discuss the CrossFit boom, keeping monitors low-tech with open-data API access, revenue size, avoiding private equity, and exploring purpose trust succession like Patagonia. |
Statements from this episode (15)
North Face Paid the Dreissigackers 35 Cents an Hour in Backpack Royalties
“They did actually produce it for a while, and they licensed some of the components that we were getting royalties from them... We figured the royalties, when all was said, amounted to about 35 cents an hour for our work.”
Reducing Oar Blade Weight Determines Competitive Rowing Race Outcomes
“First, when you're rowing at a high stroke rate, you're having to move, swing this, rotate this oar back and forth. Through this wide arc, and because there's weight, particularly the weight out at the end where the blade is, it takes effort to accelerate that…”
Concept2 Co-Founders Chose Their Rural Location Before Their Business Plan
“We had a clearer vision of the place that we wanted to move to live, to do this business than we had of what the business was going to be.”
Harvard Ordered Concept2 Oars Only After Losing to Yale
“After Yale beat Harvard, We got an order from Harvard for the oars.”
Concept2 Priced Early Products Based on Future Manufacturing Costs at Scale
“We tried to price it at what we thought we could eventually make it for. So we were projecting ahead that we could, you know, eventually get to the point where it was more profitable. And, you know, we use that philosophy all the time with other products now, …”
Concept2 Built Its Most Successful Products to Serve the Founders' Needs
“Most of the products that we've worked on and been successful with are products that That we want to use ourselves, you know, and the theory is that if we, you know, like the idea of having some way to train specifically for rowing without having to get to the…”
Concept2 Sold Out Its First 50 Indoor Rowers at a Regatta
“Well, at that point, we had, we were doing our first batch, I think it was like, 50, and I think we sold most of those, if not all of them, at that Masters, yeah, Championships regatta.”
Concept2 Launched Its First Rower at $400, Undercutting $3,000 Competitors
“400 dollars. Well, these rowing machines that the colleges would use, that they couldn't really afford to have a whole bunch of them in their gym, but they maybe have one or two, they were over 3000 at that point. Maybe 3500.”
Concept2 Chose Direct Sales Over Giving Retailers 40 Percent Margins
“I mean, I think when we first started out, you know, stores or retailers were demanding very large margins, you know, they had to have a We didn't want to raise our price so that we could give them a 40% margin.”
Concept2 Runs Its Global Hardware Operation With Just 130 Employees
“A 130, which includes about 40 overseas at subsidiaries.”