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Jun 19, 2016 · 20m · top-founders

EP 330: She Cranks $1 EPC 3x Per Day with 25,000 List in Dating Niche

Nathan Latka · 10m spoken Heather Ann Havenwood · 7m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The Top, host Nathan Latka interviews entrepreneur and copywriter Heather Ann Havenwood, who reveals how she generated $250,000 in revenue in 2015 by monetizing a 25,000-subscriber email list through daily affiliate broadcasts earning $1 EPC.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 59.7% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 3.3 Guest teaching 1.5 Guest disagreement 1.0 Nathan pushing back 2.2
05100:0010:0020:001:30–4:41 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Introducing Guest Heather Ann Havenwood Latka immediately probes Havenwood's conversion metrics and unit economics, calculating her lifetime front-end revenue from her $47 product. Havenwood readily answers while clarifying that the front-end product primarily serves as an entry point for back-end monetization.4:41–9:04 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Email Frequency and Affiliate EPC Monetization Latka runs the math on Havenwood's email open rates, click-through rates, and EPC earnings, stepping in to define EPC and fact-check partner domains live. Havenwood explains and defends her high email frequency of sending two to three broadcasts daily by framing emails as entertainment.9:04–13:53 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 2015 Revenue, List Growth, and Market Perspectives Latka probes Havenwood's total 2015 revenue, profit margins, and list-growth mechanics through reciprocal affiliate launches. Havenwood details her launch partnerships and shares why she promotes proven third-party funnels rather than building complex offers herself.13:53–16:02 · Nathan as informed peer 0/10 Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Cloud Invoicing Platform Solo host commercial break featuring sponsored advertisements for FreshBooks invoicing software and HostGator web hosting.16:03–18:08 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the standard Famous Five questions while Havenwood gives sharp, decisive answers advocating against college and student loans. Latka wraps up by summarizing her core business metrics for the audience.18:12–20:05 · Nathan as informed peer 0/10 Post-Show Promotions and Austin Live Event Solo outro where Latka promotes upcoming episodes, Google AdWords promotions via HostGator, and ticket sales for the upcoming Austin Live conference.1:30–4:41 · Guest teaching 2/10 Introducing Guest Heather Ann Havenwood Latka immediately probes Havenwood's conversion metrics and unit economics, calculating her lifetime front-end revenue from her $47 product. Havenwood readily answers while clarifying that the front-end product primarily serves as an entry point for back-end monetization.4:41–9:04 · Guest teaching 3/10 Email Frequency and Affiliate EPC Monetization Latka runs the math on Havenwood's email open rates, click-through rates, and EPC earnings, stepping in to define EPC and fact-check partner domains live. Havenwood explains and defends her high email frequency of sending two to three broadcasts daily by framing emails as entertainment.9:04–13:53 · Guest teaching 3/10 2015 Revenue, List Growth, and Market Perspectives Latka probes Havenwood's total 2015 revenue, profit margins, and list-growth mechanics through reciprocal affiliate launches. Havenwood details her launch partnerships and shares why she promotes proven third-party funnels rather than building complex offers herself.13:53–16:02 · Guest teaching 0/10 Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Cloud Invoicing Platform Solo host commercial break featuring sponsored advertisements for FreshBooks invoicing software and HostGator web hosting.16:03–18:08 · Guest teaching 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the standard Famous Five questions while Havenwood gives sharp, decisive answers advocating against college and student loans. Latka wraps up by summarizing her core business metrics for the audience.18:12–20:05 · Guest teaching 0/10 Post-Show Promotions and Austin Live Event Solo outro where Latka promotes upcoming episodes, Google AdWords promotions via HostGator, and ticket sales for the upcoming Austin Live conference.1:30–4:41 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Introducing Guest Heather Ann Havenwood Latka immediately probes Havenwood's conversion metrics and unit economics, calculating her lifetime front-end revenue from her $47 product. Havenwood readily answers while clarifying that the front-end product primarily serves as an entry point for back-end monetization.4:41–9:04 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Email Frequency and Affiliate EPC Monetization Latka runs the math on Havenwood's email open rates, click-through rates, and EPC earnings, stepping in to define EPC and fact-check partner domains live. Havenwood explains and defends her high email frequency of sending two to three broadcasts daily by framing emails as entertainment.9:04–13:53 · Guest disagreement 1/10 2015 Revenue, List Growth, and Market Perspectives Latka probes Havenwood's total 2015 revenue, profit margins, and list-growth mechanics through reciprocal affiliate launches. Havenwood details her launch partnerships and shares why she promotes proven third-party funnels rather than building complex offers herself.13:53–16:02 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Cloud Invoicing Platform Solo host commercial break featuring sponsored advertisements for FreshBooks invoicing software and HostGator web hosting.16:03–18:08 · Guest disagreement 2/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the standard Famous Five questions while Havenwood gives sharp, decisive answers advocating against college and student loans. Latka wraps up by summarizing her core business metrics for the audience.18:12–20:05 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Post-Show Promotions and Austin Live Event Solo outro where Latka promotes upcoming episodes, Google AdWords promotions via HostGator, and ticket sales for the upcoming Austin Live conference.1:30–4:41 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Introducing Guest Heather Ann Havenwood Latka immediately probes Havenwood's conversion metrics and unit economics, calculating her lifetime front-end revenue from her $47 product. Havenwood readily answers while clarifying that the front-end product primarily serves as an entry point for back-end monetization.4:41–9:04 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Email Frequency and Affiliate EPC Monetization Latka runs the math on Havenwood's email open rates, click-through rates, and EPC earnings, stepping in to define EPC and fact-check partner domains live. Havenwood explains and defends her high email frequency of sending two to three broadcasts daily by framing emails as entertainment.9:04–13:53 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 2015 Revenue, List Growth, and Market Perspectives Latka probes Havenwood's total 2015 revenue, profit margins, and list-growth mechanics through reciprocal affiliate launches. Havenwood details her launch partnerships and shares why she promotes proven third-party funnels rather than building complex offers herself.13:53–16:02 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Cloud Invoicing Platform Solo host commercial break featuring sponsored advertisements for FreshBooks invoicing software and HostGator web hosting.16:03–18:08 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the standard Famous Five questions while Havenwood gives sharp, decisive answers advocating against college and student loans. Latka wraps up by summarizing her core business metrics for the audience.18:12–20:05 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 Post-Show Promotions and Austin Live Event Solo outro where Latka promotes upcoming episodes, Google AdWords promotions via HostGator, and ticket sales for the upcoming Austin Live conference.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 90.1% · guest 9.9%0:00 · Nathan 90.1% · guest 9.9%3:00 · Nathan 37.6% · guest 62.4%3:00 · Nathan 37.6% · guest 62.4%6:00 · Nathan 38.1% · guest 61.9%6:00 · Nathan 38.1% · guest 61.9%9:00 · Nathan 38.1% · guest 61.9%9:00 · Nathan 38.1% · guest 61.9%12:00 · Nathan 51.8% · guest 48.2%12:00 · Nathan 51.8% · guest 48.2%15:00 · Nathan 74.1% · guest 25.9%15:00 · Nathan 74.1% · guest 25.9%18:00 · Nathan 99.4% · guest 0.6%18:00 · Nathan 99.4% · guest 0.6%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 8:25 Havenwood rejects the premise that frequent emailing annoys subscribers

When Latka expresses disbelief that she emails 2-3 times per day and asks if people complain, Havenwood forcefully reframes email marketing as daily entertainment akin to a TV guide.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 8:20 Latka challenges heavy email send frequency

Latka directly confronts Havenwood on whether blasting subscribers multiple times a day leads to high unsubscriptions and complaints.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 9:45 Havenwood breaks down the leverage of affiliate promotions over proprietary funnels

Havenwood explains the strategic advantage of specializing in subscriber relationships and promoting expert funnels rather than spending resources building complex funnels herself.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 7:45 Latka clarifies EPC definition and models email revenue on the fly

When Havenwood hesitates on the exact acronym for EPC, Latka immediately defines 'earnings per click' and computes the exact dollar output per 300 clicks.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Guest Heather Ann Havenwood 5213 Latka immediately probes Havenwood's conversion metrics and unit economics, calculating her lifetime front-end revenue from her $47 product. Havenwood readily answers while clarifying that the front-end product primarily serves as an entry point for back-end monetization.
Email Frequency and Affiliate EPC Monetization 6324 Latka runs the math on Havenwood's email open rates, click-through rates, and EPC earnings, stepping in to define EPC and fact-check partner domains live. Havenwood explains and defends her high email frequency of sending two to three broadcasts daily by framing emails as entertainment.
2015 Revenue, List Growth, and Market Perspectives 5314 Latka probes Havenwood's total 2015 revenue, profit margins, and list-growth mechanics through reciprocal affiliate launches. Havenwood details her launch partnerships and shares why she promotes proven third-party funnels rather than building complex offers herself.
Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Cloud Invoicing Platform 0000 Solo host commercial break featuring sponsored advertisements for FreshBooks invoicing software and HostGator web hosting.
The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions 4122 Latka runs through the standard Famous Five questions while Havenwood gives sharp, decisive answers advocating against college and student loans. Latka wraps up by summarizing her core business metrics for the audience.
Post-Show Promotions and Austin Live Event 0000 Solo outro where Latka promotes upcoming episodes, Google AdWords promotions via HostGator, and ticket sales for the upcoming Austin Live conference.

Statements from this episode (8)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Havenwood: DatingTriggers.com achieves a 20% to 25% opt-in conversion rate
“Oh, I would say 20 to 25. Because usually I market to people that really want it, not like random. So my marketing is pretty, my paid marketing and my affiliate marketing is pretty focused.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 3:02
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Havenwood: DatingTriggers.com email list has 25,000 subscribers
“Yeah, 25,000.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 3:15
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Havenwood: Dating email list achieves 15% to 25% open rates
“Depending on my list, depending on the day, it's between 15 to 25%, and I say that because on Sundays I get a higher open rate.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 7:03
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Havenwood: Dating affiliate offers generate $1 earnings per click
“The amount of clicks I send to them, I get a dollar per the click I send to them.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 8:05
Disclosure
Havenwood: Broadcasts one to three emails per day to subscriber list
“I send them between one to three emails a day, depending on the day.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 8:56
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Havenwood generated roughly $250,000 in 2015 revenue from her dating list
“I would say two 50.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 9:26
Disclosure
Havenwood: 80% of revenue comes from affiliate marketing
“God, I would say 80%.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 9:43
Prediction Didn’t hold up
Havenwood predicted in 2016 that the Austin real estate bubble would pop
“You know that the market here to me is about to pop. I come from real estate investing. So to me, I'm like, there's no way I would invest right now in Austin.”
Heather Ann Havenwood Jun 19, 2016 ▶ 13:14
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