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Aug 14, 2016 · 21m · top-founders

EP 386: Hurdlr Saves You Tax Money, 10,000+ Users

Nathan Latka · 11m spoken Raj Bhaskar · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

Nathan Latka interviews Hurdlr founder and CEO Raj Bhaskar about bootstrapping his mobile-first financial management platform for gig workers, transitioning from pre-revenue engagement to value-based monetization, and his previous $50 million SaaS exit.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 57.1% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.0 Guest teaching 2.3 Guest disagreement 1.3 Nathan pushing back 2.7
05100:0010:0020:001:02–3:23 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Raj Bhaskar's Background and Visual Homes Acquisition Nathan aggressively presses Raj to disclose the confidential acquisition price of Visual Homes, demanding a benchmark range when Raj demurs. Raj gently deflects before conceding it was slightly under fifty million.3:23–6:21 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Hurdlr's Core Features and Real-Time Tax Calculations Raj explains Hurdlr's automated real-time tax calculation engine and clarifies how it complements rather than directly competes with invoicing tools like FreshBooks. Nathan asks probing product workflow questions.6:21–8:28 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Mobile-Only Strategy and Forthcoming Monetization Nathan demonstrates SaaS domain knowledge by pointing out that app store transaction cuts will represent Hurdlr's largest cost of goods sold. Raj explains their deliberate mobile-only product philosophy.8:28–12:02 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Bootstrapping Capital, Team Expansion, and DC Roots Nathan invokes Paul Graham's startup thesis on staying free to capture market share and names several DC tech peers to contextualize Raj's 1.5 million dollar self-funding.12:02–14:26 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Value-Based Pricing Philosophy and User Engagement Raj details his value-based pricing strategy where users pay a fraction of money saved, while Nathan pushes on edge cases involving free-riding customers.14:28–16:05 · Nathan as informed peer 0/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Austin Live Event Promotion Solo host segment featuring an advertisement for HostGator and promotional pitch for Nathan's upcoming Austin live business event.1:02–3:23 · Guest teaching 2/10 Raj Bhaskar's Background and Visual Homes Acquisition Nathan aggressively presses Raj to disclose the confidential acquisition price of Visual Homes, demanding a benchmark range when Raj demurs. Raj gently deflects before conceding it was slightly under fifty million.3:23–6:21 · Guest teaching 4/10 Hurdlr's Core Features and Real-Time Tax Calculations Raj explains Hurdlr's automated real-time tax calculation engine and clarifies how it complements rather than directly competes with invoicing tools like FreshBooks. Nathan asks probing product workflow questions.6:21–8:28 · Guest teaching 3/10 Mobile-Only Strategy and Forthcoming Monetization Nathan demonstrates SaaS domain knowledge by pointing out that app store transaction cuts will represent Hurdlr's largest cost of goods sold. Raj explains their deliberate mobile-only product philosophy.8:28–12:02 · Guest teaching 2/10 Bootstrapping Capital, Team Expansion, and DC Roots Nathan invokes Paul Graham's startup thesis on staying free to capture market share and names several DC tech peers to contextualize Raj's 1.5 million dollar self-funding.12:02–14:26 · Guest teaching 3/10 Value-Based Pricing Philosophy and User Engagement Raj details his value-based pricing strategy where users pay a fraction of money saved, while Nathan pushes on edge cases involving free-riding customers.14:28–16:05 · Guest teaching 0/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Austin Live Event Promotion Solo host segment featuring an advertisement for HostGator and promotional pitch for Nathan's upcoming Austin live business event.1:02–3:23 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Raj Bhaskar's Background and Visual Homes Acquisition Nathan aggressively presses Raj to disclose the confidential acquisition price of Visual Homes, demanding a benchmark range when Raj demurs. Raj gently deflects before conceding it was slightly under fifty million.3:23–6:21 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Hurdlr's Core Features and Real-Time Tax Calculations Raj explains Hurdlr's automated real-time tax calculation engine and clarifies how it complements rather than directly competes with invoicing tools like FreshBooks. Nathan asks probing product workflow questions.6:21–8:28 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Mobile-Only Strategy and Forthcoming Monetization Nathan demonstrates SaaS domain knowledge by pointing out that app store transaction cuts will represent Hurdlr's largest cost of goods sold. Raj explains their deliberate mobile-only product philosophy.8:28–12:02 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Bootstrapping Capital, Team Expansion, and DC Roots Nathan invokes Paul Graham's startup thesis on staying free to capture market share and names several DC tech peers to contextualize Raj's 1.5 million dollar self-funding.12:02–14:26 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Value-Based Pricing Philosophy and User Engagement Raj details his value-based pricing strategy where users pay a fraction of money saved, while Nathan pushes on edge cases involving free-riding customers.14:28–16:05 · Guest disagreement 0/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Austin Live Event Promotion Solo host segment featuring an advertisement for HostGator and promotional pitch for Nathan's upcoming Austin live business event.1:02–3:23 · Nathan pushing back 6/10 Raj Bhaskar's Background and Visual Homes Acquisition Nathan aggressively presses Raj to disclose the confidential acquisition price of Visual Homes, demanding a benchmark range when Raj demurs. Raj gently deflects before conceding it was slightly under fifty million.3:23–6:21 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Hurdlr's Core Features and Real-Time Tax Calculations Raj explains Hurdlr's automated real-time tax calculation engine and clarifies how it complements rather than directly competes with invoicing tools like FreshBooks. Nathan asks probing product workflow questions.6:21–8:28 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Mobile-Only Strategy and Forthcoming Monetization Nathan demonstrates SaaS domain knowledge by pointing out that app store transaction cuts will represent Hurdlr's largest cost of goods sold. Raj explains their deliberate mobile-only product philosophy.8:28–12:02 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Bootstrapping Capital, Team Expansion, and DC Roots Nathan invokes Paul Graham's startup thesis on staying free to capture market share and names several DC tech peers to contextualize Raj's 1.5 million dollar self-funding.12:02–14:26 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Value-Based Pricing Philosophy and User Engagement Raj details his value-based pricing strategy where users pay a fraction of money saved, while Nathan pushes on edge cases involving free-riding customers.14:28–16:05 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 HostGator Sponsorship and Austin Live Event Promotion Solo host segment featuring an advertisement for HostGator and promotional pitch for Nathan's upcoming Austin live business event.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 90.9% · guest 9.1%0:00 · Nathan 90.9% · guest 9.1%3:00 · Nathan 27% · guest 73%3:00 · Nathan 27% · guest 73%6:00 · Nathan 34.5% · guest 65.5%6:00 · Nathan 34.5% · guest 65.5%9:00 · Nathan 50.1% · guest 49.9%9:00 · Nathan 50.1% · guest 49.9%12:00 · Nathan 33.7% · guest 66.3%12:00 · Nathan 33.7% · guest 66.3%15:00 · Nathan 76.8% · guest 23.2%15:00 · Nathan 76.8% · guest 23.2%18:00 · Nathan 75.3% · guest 24.7%18:00 · Nathan 75.3% · guest 24.7%21:00 · Nathan 100% · guest 0%21:00 · Nathan 100% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 2:19 Raj resists disclosing exit valuation

When Nathan refuses to accept non-disclosure of the Visual Homes sale, Raj pushes back cautiously before providing a bounded range.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 2:21 Nathan rejects acquisition secrecy

Nathan explicitly rejects Raj's refusal to disclose sale figures, arguing the deal happened six years ago and forcing a 50 million benchmark.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 5:58 Raj clarifies FreshBooks integration mechanics

Raj educates Nathan on why Hurdlr is not an invoicing competitor to FreshBooks, detailing how FreshBooks provides top-line revenue that feeds Hurdlr's post-tax net profit calculation.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 7:00 Nathan highlights app store margins

Nathan demonstrates financial acumen by immediately identifying that running a mobile-first SaaS via app stores will make platform fees Hurdlr's largest cost of goods sold.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Raj Bhaskar's Background and Visual Homes Acquisition 5236 Nathan aggressively presses Raj to disclose the confidential acquisition price of Visual Homes, demanding a benchmark range when Raj demurs. Raj gently deflects before conceding it was slightly under fifty million.
Hurdlr's Core Features and Real-Time Tax Calculations 4412 Raj explains Hurdlr's automated real-time tax calculation engine and clarifies how it complements rather than directly competes with invoicing tools like FreshBooks. Nathan asks probing product workflow questions.
Mobile-Only Strategy and Forthcoming Monetization 6312 Nathan demonstrates SaaS domain knowledge by pointing out that app store transaction cuts will represent Hurdlr's largest cost of goods sold. Raj explains their deliberate mobile-only product philosophy.
Bootstrapping Capital, Team Expansion, and DC Roots 5213 Nathan invokes Paul Graham's startup thesis on staying free to capture market share and names several DC tech peers to contextualize Raj's 1.5 million dollar self-funding.
Value-Based Pricing Philosophy and User Engagement 4323 Raj details his value-based pricing strategy where users pay a fraction of money saved, while Nathan pushes on edge cases involving free-riding customers.
HostGator Sponsorship and Austin Live Event Promotion 0000 Solo host segment featuring an advertisement for HostGator and promotional pitch for Nathan's upcoming Austin live business event.

Statements from this episode (10)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bhaskar: Visual Homes sold to Yardi Systems for just under $50M
“Ah, less, a little less than that.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 2:31
Assertion Supported
Hurdlr built a real-time tax engine for all 50 states and DC
“And so we built, we actually built a real time income tax calculation engine for all 50 states in DC.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 3:54
Disclosure
Bhaskar: Hurdlr is pre-revenue and launching mobile subscriptions in the fall
“So eventually so in the fall, we're going to turn revenue on. We're actually pre revenue right now. And we've been testing out models and we're turning that on in the fall and it'll be it's basically a mobile SAS business, right? So it'll be monthly, monthly o…”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 6:32
Disclosure
Bhaskar: Hurdlr is strictly mobile-only with no desktop version available
“We're actually mobile only. It's not even mobile first. So we don't have a desktop product that we've made available.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 7:42
Disclosure
Bhaskar: Founders invested over $1.5M cash into Hurdlr pre-revenue
“All in cash wise has been quite a bit. It's a little over one and a half million plus a few of us don't take any compensation. For several years.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 9:16
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bhaskar: Hurdlr employs 16 full-time team members as of July 2016
“16 full time.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 9:54
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bhaskar: Hurdlr has signed up tens of thousands of total users
“Tens of thousands.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 11:34
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bhaskar: 60% to 70% of Hurdlr users are monthly active
“Very high percentage. I think it's like. 60 to 70%.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 11:40
Disclosure
Hurdlr only prompts upgrades after users hit verified dollar savings thresholds
“So what we're looking at is tying into, so our system tracks your savings through deductions, right? So we want to hit a certain mark that you save X amount of dollars. And once you hit that, then we'll ask you if you feel like you got value to upgrade.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 13:09
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bhaskar: Hurdlr survey showed users will pay $20 to save $200 monthly
“We've pulled a lot of our active users and they don't seem to have any problem paying 20 if we were to save them 200 a month.”
Raj Bhaskar Aug 14, 2016 ▶ 13:49
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