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Dec 8, 2016 · 22m · top-founders

EP 502: 30% Annual Yield AirBNB Investing with Andrew Keene

Andrew Keene · 10m spoken Nathan Latka · 9m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In Episode 502 of 'The Top,' Nathan Latka interviews former CBOE floor trader and AlphaShark CEO Andrew Keene on his data-driven strategy for generating 35% annual cash-on-cash returns through Airbnb properties and building an integrated short-term rental fund.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 44.9% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.0 Guest teaching 3.7 Guest disagreement 1.4 Nathan pushing back 2.6
05100:0010:0020:000:28–3:55 · Nathan as informed peer 2/10 Top Tribe Weekly Giveaway Announcement The segment consists largely of the host's monologue, sponsor promotions, guest background introduction, and casual small talk about Austin real estate.3:55–7:02 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Economics of the San Diego Airbnb Unit Keene breaks down his 35 percent cash-on-cash yield and San Diego unit economics, while Latka actively synthesizes the investment metrics.7:02–10:24 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Navigating Short-Term Rental Regulations and HOA Rules Latka pushes Keene on regulatory and HOA risks before pressing into how Keene secured seed funding early in his trading career.10:24–14:45 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Long-Term Real Estate and Launching an Airbnb Fund Keene outlines plans for an Airbnb fund and software tools like AirDNA and Revestor, while Latka probes his audience size and capital strategy.14:46–17:46 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Three-Tiered Real Estate and Property Management Model Latka challenges Keene on charging a 30 percent property management fee compared to traditional 10 percent fees, prompting Keene to explain the labor intensity of short-term turnarounds.17:48–19:49 · Nathan as informed peer 1/10 Connecting with Andrew Keene Keene shares his contact details, followed by mid-roll sponsor ad reads delivered exclusively by Latka.19:50–21:40 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five rapid-fire format, gently correcting Keene on the authorship of 'The Automatic Customer' before closing.0:28–3:55 · Guest teaching 1/10 Top Tribe Weekly Giveaway Announcement The segment consists largely of the host's monologue, sponsor promotions, guest background introduction, and casual small talk about Austin real estate.3:55–7:02 · Guest teaching 5/10 Economics of the San Diego Airbnb Unit Keene breaks down his 35 percent cash-on-cash yield and San Diego unit economics, while Latka actively synthesizes the investment metrics.7:02–10:24 · Guest teaching 6/10 Navigating Short-Term Rental Regulations and HOA Rules Latka pushes Keene on regulatory and HOA risks before pressing into how Keene secured seed funding early in his trading career.10:24–14:45 · Guest teaching 5/10 Long-Term Real Estate and Launching an Airbnb Fund Keene outlines plans for an Airbnb fund and software tools like AirDNA and Revestor, while Latka probes his audience size and capital strategy.14:46–17:46 · Guest teaching 6/10 Three-Tiered Real Estate and Property Management Model Latka challenges Keene on charging a 30 percent property management fee compared to traditional 10 percent fees, prompting Keene to explain the labor intensity of short-term turnarounds.17:48–19:49 · Guest teaching 1/10 Connecting with Andrew Keene Keene shares his contact details, followed by mid-roll sponsor ad reads delivered exclusively by Latka.19:50–21:40 · Guest teaching 2/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five rapid-fire format, gently correcting Keene on the authorship of 'The Automatic Customer' before closing.0:28–3:55 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Top Tribe Weekly Giveaway Announcement The segment consists largely of the host's monologue, sponsor promotions, guest background introduction, and casual small talk about Austin real estate.3:55–7:02 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Economics of the San Diego Airbnb Unit Keene breaks down his 35 percent cash-on-cash yield and San Diego unit economics, while Latka actively synthesizes the investment metrics.7:02–10:24 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Navigating Short-Term Rental Regulations and HOA Rules Latka pushes Keene on regulatory and HOA risks before pressing into how Keene secured seed funding early in his trading career.10:24–14:45 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Long-Term Real Estate and Launching an Airbnb Fund Keene outlines plans for an Airbnb fund and software tools like AirDNA and Revestor, while Latka probes his audience size and capital strategy.14:46–17:46 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Three-Tiered Real Estate and Property Management Model Latka challenges Keene on charging a 30 percent property management fee compared to traditional 10 percent fees, prompting Keene to explain the labor intensity of short-term turnarounds.17:48–19:49 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Connecting with Andrew Keene Keene shares his contact details, followed by mid-roll sponsor ad reads delivered exclusively by Latka.19:50–21:40 · Guest disagreement 2/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five rapid-fire format, gently correcting Keene on the authorship of 'The Automatic Customer' before closing.0:28–3:55 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Top Tribe Weekly Giveaway Announcement The segment consists largely of the host's monologue, sponsor promotions, guest background introduction, and casual small talk about Austin real estate.3:55–7:02 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Economics of the San Diego Airbnb Unit Keene breaks down his 35 percent cash-on-cash yield and San Diego unit economics, while Latka actively synthesizes the investment metrics.7:02–10:24 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Navigating Short-Term Rental Regulations and HOA Rules Latka pushes Keene on regulatory and HOA risks before pressing into how Keene secured seed funding early in his trading career.10:24–14:45 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Long-Term Real Estate and Launching an Airbnb Fund Keene outlines plans for an Airbnb fund and software tools like AirDNA and Revestor, while Latka probes his audience size and capital strategy.14:46–17:46 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Three-Tiered Real Estate and Property Management Model Latka challenges Keene on charging a 30 percent property management fee compared to traditional 10 percent fees, prompting Keene to explain the labor intensity of short-term turnarounds.17:48–19:49 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 Connecting with Andrew Keene Keene shares his contact details, followed by mid-roll sponsor ad reads delivered exclusively by Latka.19:50–21:40 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five rapid-fire format, gently correcting Keene on the authorship of 'The Automatic Customer' before closing.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 93% · guest 7%0:00 · Nathan 93% · guest 7%3:00 · Nathan 14.4% · guest 85.6%3:00 · Nathan 14.4% · guest 85.6%6:00 · Nathan 11.6% · guest 88.4%6:00 · Nathan 11.6% · guest 88.4%9:00 · Nathan 18.7% · guest 81.3%9:00 · Nathan 18.7% · guest 81.3%12:00 · Nathan 22.1% · guest 77.9%12:00 · Nathan 22.1% · guest 77.9%15:00 · Nathan 38.9% · guest 61.1%15:00 · Nathan 38.9% · guest 61.1%18:00 · Nathan 91.5% · guest 8.5%18:00 · Nathan 91.5% · guest 8.5%21:00 · Nathan 96% · guest 4%21:00 · Nathan 96% · guest 4%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 15:36 Keene firmly refutes property management comparison

Keene directly rejects Latka's comparison between standard 10 percent long-term management fees and the high-touch operational reality of short-term rentals.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 15:28 Latka challenges 20-30% management fee structure

Latka interrupts and questions where Keene gets the justification for a 20 to 30 percent management fee when standard properties pay only 10 percent.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 15:40 Keene explains short-term rental management economics

Keene educates Latka on the intensive turnkey operations required for Airbnb management, justifying why 20 to 30 percent is the industry standard.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 5:42 Latka synthesizes pro-forma economics instantly

Latka demonstrates his financial acumen by instantly summarizing the unit's capital structure, PMI avoidance, and net cash flow dynamics.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Top Tribe Weekly Giveaway Announcement 2101 The segment consists largely of the host's monologue, sponsor promotions, guest background introduction, and casual small talk about Austin real estate.
Economics of the San Diego Airbnb Unit 5512 Keene breaks down his 35 percent cash-on-cash yield and San Diego unit economics, while Latka actively synthesizes the investment metrics.
Navigating Short-Term Rental Regulations and HOA Rules 5624 Latka pushes Keene on regulatory and HOA risks before pressing into how Keene secured seed funding early in his trading career.
Long-Term Real Estate and Launching an Airbnb Fund 5523 Keene outlines plans for an Airbnb fund and software tools like AirDNA and Revestor, while Latka probes his audience size and capital strategy.
Three-Tiered Real Estate and Property Management Model 6635 Latka challenges Keene on charging a 30 percent property management fee compared to traditional 10 percent fees, prompting Keene to explain the labor intensity of short-term turnarounds.
Connecting with Andrew Keene 1100 Keene shares his contact details, followed by mid-roll sponsor ad reads delivered exclusively by Latka.
The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions 4223 Latka runs through the Famous Five rapid-fire format, gently correcting Keene on the authorship of 'The Automatic Customer' before closing.

Statements from this episode (12)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Keene: San Diego and Miami are the most profitable Airbnb markets
“Basically San Diego and Miami are the most profitable places for Airbnb.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 4:26
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Keene: Smaller markets like Cleveland generate higher percentage Airbnb returns
“Profitability wise as a percentage, like smaller places, actually like a Kansas city and Cleveland are going to be better percentage wise, but I don't really want to be there or like own places there.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 4:42
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Keene: San Diego Airbnb condo will yield about 35% cash-on-cash in 2016
“My return on capital probably this year will be about 35% of the money that I put down. That's without even appreciation of the unit.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 4:53
Disclosure
Keene: San Diego Airbnb achieved 90% occupancy in first two months
“And we, the last two months, so it's only been a couple months, we've rented out like 28 and 27, 31 days. So our occupancy rate's about 90%, which is higher.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 6:09
Assertion Partly supported
Keene: Airbnb Superhost status doubles your chances of getting booked
“You're twice as much, quite as twice as a chance of renting your place out if you're a super host, because then they basically advertise for you.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 6:21
Assertion Supported
Keene: 80% of Airbnb hosts are not running it as a business
“80% of everybody that has a listing at Airbnb aren't doing it for business.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 6:44
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Keene: Most San Diego buildings ban short-term rentals through HOAs
“So most buildings in San Diego, you cannot do it because your HOA won't allow it.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 7:24
Assertion Supported
Keene: San Diego rejected proposed ban on short-term rentals
“So they're trying to ban all short-term rentals in San Diego, and that did not pass.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 7:48
Insight
Keene: Municipal bans represent biggest risk for short-term rentals
“Your biggest risk is the short-term bill passing in a certain city.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 7:55
Disclosure
Keene: Made approximately $5 million during trading career
“I think my trading account was probably around like five million dollars. I made trading.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 8:50
Opinion
Keene: Mashvisor MLS Data Sourcing Is Inaccurate
“I've been told that they are not that the way they get their MLS is, is not as accurate as it should be. So I've steered away from that one a little bit lately.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 14:25
Assertion Supported
Keene: Airbnb property management industry standard fees are 20% to 30%
“Industry standard is 20 to 30% on management companies based in, on Airbnb.”
Andrew Keene Dec 8, 2016 ▶ 15:51
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