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Dec 28, 2016 · 15m · top-founders

EP 522: Delivra $15M 2017 Goal, $700k MRR Now, Helping 450+ Customers Sell Things with CEO Neil Berman

Nathan Latka · 8m spoken Neil Berman · 4m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

Host Nathan Latka interviews Delivra CEO Neil Berman to break down the email and multi-channel marketing company's $4.8 million annual run rate, unit economics, and capital financing strategy. The conversation explores customer acquisition payback dynamics, debt versus equity funding options, and key lessons from scaling a bootstrapped SaaS business over nearly two decades.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 66.2% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.8 Guest teaching 1.0 Guest disagreement 0.6 Nathan pushing back 1.8
05100:0010:000:58–3:42 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Product Spotlight: The Top Inbox Email Tool Nathan quickly computes recurring revenue metrics from customer count and average contract value, backing into an accurate MRR calculation that Neil confirms.3:42–6:30 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Customer Acquisition Channels, Churn Rates, and Cash Gap Dynamics Nathan drills into unit economics including churn, lifetime value, and CAC payback dynamics, pointing out the working capital constraints inherent in organic SaaS growth.6:31–9:29 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Fundraising Strategy, Debt Financing, and Equity Valuation Discussion Nathan challenges Neil on how growth rate ties into debt sizing rather than equity valuation, breaking down standard debt mechanics and offering valuation scenarios.9:30–12:17 · Nathan as informed peer 2/10 Delivra Multi-Channel Platform Capabilities and Online Presence Neil explains Delivra's multi-channel capabilities before the segment shifts into mid-roll sponsor spots and monologues.12:17–14:31 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Neil Berman Neil answers the Famous Five questions smoothly, playfully flipping the standard question about what he wishes he knew at age 20 before Nathan recaps the business numbers.0:58–3:42 · Guest teaching 1/10 Product Spotlight: The Top Inbox Email Tool Nathan quickly computes recurring revenue metrics from customer count and average contract value, backing into an accurate MRR calculation that Neil confirms.3:42–6:30 · Guest teaching 2/10 Customer Acquisition Channels, Churn Rates, and Cash Gap Dynamics Nathan drills into unit economics including churn, lifetime value, and CAC payback dynamics, pointing out the working capital constraints inherent in organic SaaS growth.6:31–9:29 · Guest teaching 0/10 Fundraising Strategy, Debt Financing, and Equity Valuation Discussion Nathan challenges Neil on how growth rate ties into debt sizing rather than equity valuation, breaking down standard debt mechanics and offering valuation scenarios.9:30–12:17 · Guest teaching 1/10 Delivra Multi-Channel Platform Capabilities and Online Presence Neil explains Delivra's multi-channel capabilities before the segment shifts into mid-roll sponsor spots and monologues.12:17–14:31 · Guest teaching 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Neil Berman Neil answers the Famous Five questions smoothly, playfully flipping the standard question about what he wishes he knew at age 20 before Nathan recaps the business numbers.0:58–3:42 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Product Spotlight: The Top Inbox Email Tool Nathan quickly computes recurring revenue metrics from customer count and average contract value, backing into an accurate MRR calculation that Neil confirms.3:42–6:30 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Customer Acquisition Channels, Churn Rates, and Cash Gap Dynamics Nathan drills into unit economics including churn, lifetime value, and CAC payback dynamics, pointing out the working capital constraints inherent in organic SaaS growth.6:31–9:29 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Fundraising Strategy, Debt Financing, and Equity Valuation Discussion Nathan challenges Neil on how growth rate ties into debt sizing rather than equity valuation, breaking down standard debt mechanics and offering valuation scenarios.9:30–12:17 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Delivra Multi-Channel Platform Capabilities and Online Presence Neil explains Delivra's multi-channel capabilities before the segment shifts into mid-roll sponsor spots and monologues.12:17–14:31 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Neil Berman Neil answers the Famous Five questions smoothly, playfully flipping the standard question about what he wishes he knew at age 20 before Nathan recaps the business numbers.0:58–3:42 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Product Spotlight: The Top Inbox Email Tool Nathan quickly computes recurring revenue metrics from customer count and average contract value, backing into an accurate MRR calculation that Neil confirms.3:42–6:30 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Customer Acquisition Channels, Churn Rates, and Cash Gap Dynamics Nathan drills into unit economics including churn, lifetime value, and CAC payback dynamics, pointing out the working capital constraints inherent in organic SaaS growth.6:31–9:29 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Fundraising Strategy, Debt Financing, and Equity Valuation Discussion Nathan challenges Neil on how growth rate ties into debt sizing rather than equity valuation, breaking down standard debt mechanics and offering valuation scenarios.9:30–12:17 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 Delivra Multi-Channel Platform Capabilities and Online Presence Neil explains Delivra's multi-channel capabilities before the segment shifts into mid-roll sponsor spots and monologues.12:17–14:31 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Neil Berman Neil answers the Famous Five questions smoothly, playfully flipping the standard question about what he wishes he knew at age 20 before Nathan recaps the business numbers.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 79.6% · guest 20.4%0:00 · Nathan 79.6% · guest 20.4%3:00 · Nathan 52.4% · guest 47.6%3:00 · Nathan 52.4% · guest 47.6%6:00 · Nathan 49.1% · guest 50.9%6:00 · Nathan 49.1% · guest 50.9%9:00 · Nathan 73.9% · guest 26.1%9:00 · Nathan 73.9% · guest 26.1%12:00 · Nathan 66.9% · guest 33.1%12:00 · Nathan 66.9% · guest 33.1%15:00 · Nathan 100% · guest 0%15:00 · Nathan 100% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 13:34 Flipping the standard reflection prompt

Neil playfully resists the premise of Nathan's retrospective question, declaring that he wishes he knew as much now as he thought he did back at age 20.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 7:20 Pushing back on debt vs equity rationale

Nathan directly questions Neil's logic linking debt facility size to growth rate, noting that growth formulas matter for equity valuations rather than debt terms.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 5:20 Clarifying the CAC payback unit ratio

Neil clarifies his customer acquisition cost structure by explaining he spends a dollar and eight cents per dollar of annual contract value after Nathan misinterprets the figure.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 7:20 Explaining venture debt mechanics and valuations

Nathan demonstrates financial expertise by laying out typical debt parameters like interest rates, caps, and discounts, guiding the bootstrapped founder on capital options.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Product Spotlight: The Top Inbox Email Tool 5101 Nathan quickly computes recurring revenue metrics from customer count and average contract value, backing into an accurate MRR calculation that Neil confirms.
Customer Acquisition Channels, Churn Rates, and Cash Gap Dynamics 6212 Nathan drills into unit economics including churn, lifetime value, and CAC payback dynamics, pointing out the working capital constraints inherent in organic SaaS growth.
Fundraising Strategy, Debt Financing, and Equity Valuation Discussion 7015 Nathan challenges Neil on how growth rate ties into debt sizing rather than equity valuation, breaking down standard debt mechanics and offering valuation scenarios.
Delivra Multi-Channel Platform Capabilities and Online Presence 2100 Neil explains Delivra's multi-channel capabilities before the segment shifts into mid-roll sponsor spots and monologues.
The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Neil Berman 4111 Neil answers the Famous Five questions smoothly, playfully flipping the standard question about what he wishes he knew at age 20 before Nathan recaps the business numbers.

Statements from this episode (9)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Berman: Delivra has 500 direct paying clients and thousands via resellers
“500 direct paying clients and we have a couple thousand extra through resellers.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 2:24
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Berman: Delivra customers pay an average of $10,000 per year
“So they're paying us 10,000 a year, so I guess that's what, but somewhere between eight, 900 dollars per month.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 2:35
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Berman: Delivra will generate $4.8M in revenue in 2016
“We're doing 4.8 million a year. That's what we're going to do this year.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 3:03
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Berman: Delivra generated $4.2M to $4.3M in 2015 revenue
“I think we did four two to four three. So, we've had you know, a reasonably good increase over the year.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 3:34
Disclosure
Berman: Delivra's 2016 monthly gross churn was 1.5%
“This year it was 1.5% and our goal for next year is one percent.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 4:29
Disclosure
Berman: Delivra spends $1.08 to acquire $1.00 in ACV
“We're, we spent a dollar eight this year and our goal is one dollar. And eight cents. To get one dollar of ACB revenue, annual contract value.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 5:12
Insight
Berman: Organic SaaS growth is limited by working capital constraints
“So there's a limit to how fast we can grow organically. Because at some point when that that line gets too steep, you run out of working capital.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 6:22
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Berman: Delivra has never raised capital and is currently debt-free
“We have not. And we're currently debt free, but we're looking at options.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 6:33
Disclosure
Berman: Delivra explores financing options with Key Capital Markets
“So our local banker is has contacted the capital markets team and we're scheduled to talk with them later this month or early next year.”
Neil Berman Dec 28, 2016 ▶ 8:22
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