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Mar 21, 2017 · 21m · top-founders

EP 605: Demandbase Will Break $100M ARR 2017 Helping 400 Customers With Account Based Marketing with CEO Chris Golec

Nathan Latka · 9m spoken Chris Golec · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The Top, host Nathan Latka interviews Demandbase founder and CEO Chris Golec on pioneering the Account-Based Marketing category and scaling the company past $100M in ARR. Golec shares insights into enterprise B2B unit economics, customer expansion strategies, sales team structure, and the shift from early contact data sales to enterprise SaaS.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 52.6% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 5.3 Guest teaching 3.3 Guest disagreement 1.0 Nathan pushing back 2.2
05100:0010:0020:001:31–4:02 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Introducing Chris Golec and the Demandbase Business Model Nathan introduces Chris Golec and navigates through Demandbase's enterprise business model. Nathan demonstrates familiarity with SaaS metrics by steering away from deep cohort analysis toward monthly average contract values.4:02–6:23 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Venture Capital Raised and Defining Account-Based Marketing Nathan asks if Chris invented B2B SaaS and probes the historical ASP business model. Chris provides nuance, clarifying that the ABM methodology existed long before the modern software tooling made it scalable.6:23–8:58 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Consulting Origins, Revenue Alignment, and Software Transition Chris breaks down why traditional marketing qualified leads create revenue risk due to lack of quality filters. Nathan clarifies industry acronyms for listeners while probing the transition dynamics from consulting to SaaS.8:58–11:50 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Initial Contact Data Product and Series A Fundraising Nathan compares early Demandbase data products to modern platforms like Clearbit and Mattermark. Chris outlines the evolution from commoditized contact data to enterprise ABM software alongside early fundraising rounds.11:51–15:44 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Scaling to $100M ARR: Unit Economics, Team Structure, and Retention Nathan conducts live mental math to estimate Demandbase's run-rate near $100M ARR and examines sales quotas and net retention. Chris pushes back on Nathan's CAC payback calculation, noting first-year deals are much smaller than mature average contract values.15:45–19:42 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Mid-Roll Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Accounting and Invoicing Nathan leads the sponsor break and rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire. Chris gives candid answers about not following business books or CEOs, which Nathan humorously acknowledges before summarizing the company's metrics.1:31–4:02 · Guest teaching 1/10 Introducing Chris Golec and the Demandbase Business Model Nathan introduces Chris Golec and navigates through Demandbase's enterprise business model. Nathan demonstrates familiarity with SaaS metrics by steering away from deep cohort analysis toward monthly average contract values.4:02–6:23 · Guest teaching 4/10 Venture Capital Raised and Defining Account-Based Marketing Nathan asks if Chris invented B2B SaaS and probes the historical ASP business model. Chris provides nuance, clarifying that the ABM methodology existed long before the modern software tooling made it scalable.6:23–8:58 · Guest teaching 5/10 Consulting Origins, Revenue Alignment, and Software Transition Chris breaks down why traditional marketing qualified leads create revenue risk due to lack of quality filters. Nathan clarifies industry acronyms for listeners while probing the transition dynamics from consulting to SaaS.8:58–11:50 · Guest teaching 3/10 Initial Contact Data Product and Series A Fundraising Nathan compares early Demandbase data products to modern platforms like Clearbit and Mattermark. Chris outlines the evolution from commoditized contact data to enterprise ABM software alongside early fundraising rounds.11:51–15:44 · Guest teaching 6/10 Scaling to $100M ARR: Unit Economics, Team Structure, and Retention Nathan conducts live mental math to estimate Demandbase's run-rate near $100M ARR and examines sales quotas and net retention. Chris pushes back on Nathan's CAC payback calculation, noting first-year deals are much smaller than mature average contract values.15:45–19:42 · Guest teaching 1/10 Mid-Roll Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Accounting and Invoicing Nathan leads the sponsor break and rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire. Chris gives candid answers about not following business books or CEOs, which Nathan humorously acknowledges before summarizing the company's metrics.1:31–4:02 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Introducing Chris Golec and the Demandbase Business Model Nathan introduces Chris Golec and navigates through Demandbase's enterprise business model. Nathan demonstrates familiarity with SaaS metrics by steering away from deep cohort analysis toward monthly average contract values.4:02–6:23 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Venture Capital Raised and Defining Account-Based Marketing Nathan asks if Chris invented B2B SaaS and probes the historical ASP business model. Chris provides nuance, clarifying that the ABM methodology existed long before the modern software tooling made it scalable.6:23–8:58 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Consulting Origins, Revenue Alignment, and Software Transition Chris breaks down why traditional marketing qualified leads create revenue risk due to lack of quality filters. Nathan clarifies industry acronyms for listeners while probing the transition dynamics from consulting to SaaS.8:58–11:50 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Initial Contact Data Product and Series A Fundraising Nathan compares early Demandbase data products to modern platforms like Clearbit and Mattermark. Chris outlines the evolution from commoditized contact data to enterprise ABM software alongside early fundraising rounds.11:51–15:44 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Scaling to $100M ARR: Unit Economics, Team Structure, and Retention Nathan conducts live mental math to estimate Demandbase's run-rate near $100M ARR and examines sales quotas and net retention. Chris pushes back on Nathan's CAC payback calculation, noting first-year deals are much smaller than mature average contract values.15:45–19:42 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Mid-Roll Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Accounting and Invoicing Nathan leads the sponsor break and rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire. Chris gives candid answers about not following business books or CEOs, which Nathan humorously acknowledges before summarizing the company's metrics.1:31–4:02 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Introducing Chris Golec and the Demandbase Business Model Nathan introduces Chris Golec and navigates through Demandbase's enterprise business model. Nathan demonstrates familiarity with SaaS metrics by steering away from deep cohort analysis toward monthly average contract values.4:02–6:23 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Venture Capital Raised and Defining Account-Based Marketing Nathan asks if Chris invented B2B SaaS and probes the historical ASP business model. Chris provides nuance, clarifying that the ABM methodology existed long before the modern software tooling made it scalable.6:23–8:58 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Consulting Origins, Revenue Alignment, and Software Transition Chris breaks down why traditional marketing qualified leads create revenue risk due to lack of quality filters. Nathan clarifies industry acronyms for listeners while probing the transition dynamics from consulting to SaaS.8:58–11:50 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Initial Contact Data Product and Series A Fundraising Nathan compares early Demandbase data products to modern platforms like Clearbit and Mattermark. Chris outlines the evolution from commoditized contact data to enterprise ABM software alongside early fundraising rounds.11:51–15:44 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Scaling to $100M ARR: Unit Economics, Team Structure, and Retention Nathan conducts live mental math to estimate Demandbase's run-rate near $100M ARR and examines sales quotas and net retention. Chris pushes back on Nathan's CAC payback calculation, noting first-year deals are much smaller than mature average contract values.15:45–19:42 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Mid-Roll Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Accounting and Invoicing Nathan leads the sponsor break and rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire. Chris gives candid answers about not following business books or CEOs, which Nathan humorously acknowledges before summarizing the company's metrics.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 69.9% · guest 30.1%0:00 · Nathan 69.9% · guest 30.1%3:00 · Nathan 46.1% · guest 53.9%3:00 · Nathan 46.1% · guest 53.9%6:00 · Nathan 32.8% · guest 67.2%6:00 · Nathan 32.8% · guest 67.2%9:00 · Nathan 30.2% · guest 69.8%9:00 · Nathan 30.2% · guest 69.8%12:00 · Nathan 41.5% · guest 58.5%12:00 · Nathan 41.5% · guest 58.5%15:00 · Nathan 67.8% · guest 32.2%15:00 · Nathan 67.8% · guest 32.2%18:00 · Nathan 83.1% · guest 16.9%18:00 · Nathan 83.1% · guest 16.9%21:00 · Nathan 0% · guest 0%21:00 · Nathan 0% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 15:15 Correcting initial ACV assumption

Chris explicitly rejects Nathan's assumption that CAC is easily covered by the $240k average ACV, pointing out that new customer land sizes are far smaller at $50k to $100k.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 6:00 Challenging historical SaaS terminology

Nathan interrupts to drill down into whether Chris's previous company Supplybase was genuinely SaaS and presses him on what the older ASP acronym actually represented.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 7:33 The flaw in MQL metrics

Chris educates Nathan on why conventional marketing lead metrics fail enterprise sales teams and how focusing on account-based alignment fixes revenue risk.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 12:14 Rapid calculation of $100M run-rate

Nathan quickly computes 400 customers multiplied by $20k monthly spend to accurately deduce Demandbase's $8M monthly revenue and approaching $100M ARR milestone.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Chris Golec and the Demandbase Business Model 5101 Nathan introduces Chris Golec and navigates through Demandbase's enterprise business model. Nathan demonstrates familiarity with SaaS metrics by steering away from deep cohort analysis toward monthly average contract values.
Venture Capital Raised and Defining Account-Based Marketing 5423 Nathan asks if Chris invented B2B SaaS and probes the historical ASP business model. Chris provides nuance, clarifying that the ABM methodology existed long before the modern software tooling made it scalable.
Consulting Origins, Revenue Alignment, and Software Transition 6512 Chris breaks down why traditional marketing qualified leads create revenue risk due to lack of quality filters. Nathan clarifies industry acronyms for listeners while probing the transition dynamics from consulting to SaaS.
Initial Contact Data Product and Series A Fundraising 5301 Nathan compares early Demandbase data products to modern platforms like Clearbit and Mattermark. Chris outlines the evolution from commoditized contact data to enterprise ABM software alongside early fundraising rounds.
Scaling to $100M ARR: Unit Economics, Team Structure, and Retention 7634 Nathan conducts live mental math to estimate Demandbase's run-rate near $100M ARR and examines sales quotas and net retention. Chris pushes back on Nathan's CAC payback calculation, noting first-year deals are much smaller than mature average contract values.
Mid-Roll Sponsor Break: FreshBooks Accounting and Invoicing 4102 Nathan leads the sponsor break and rapid-fire Famous Five questionnaire. Chris gives candid answers about not following business books or CEOs, which Nathan humorously acknowledges before summarizing the company's metrics.

Statements from this episode (10)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Golec: Demandbase Average Customer Pays Roughly $220K Annually
“Our average customer is spending about 220,000 dollars per year or about 20,000 dollars per month.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 3:43
Disclosure
Golec: Demandbase has raised $90 million to date
“We've raised ninety million dollars to date.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 4:08
Insight
Golec: Sales teams ignore half of MQLs due to misalignment
“You know, the sales team doesn't care about MQLs. That's why they don't follow up on half of them because the leads are from the wrong companies, meaning companies are too small. They're in the wrong industries. So there's this huge misalignment between sales …”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 7:54
Insight
Golec: Consulting firms transitioning into software face severe structural struggles
“I do think a lot of consulting firms that try and go into software really struggle because it's a totally different effort in terms of building a company and getting in finance and hiring their team. There's just a lot more risk involved, and Building a softwa…”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 8:33
Insight
Golec: For Every Startup Funded, 200 Attempt to Raise and Fail
“For every one of those, there's 200 companies that don't get funded that go out and do it.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 11:24
Insight
Golec: Startups Likely Need $500K to $1M in Revenue to Raise
“So you gotta have number one, the experience, you gotta have probably 500,000 to a million in revenue already. Yeah. So it's, you know, it's the hurdle gets higher and higher.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 11:37
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Golec: Demandbase will probably exceed $100M ARR in 2017
“We're, you know, we'll be above probably a hundred million this year.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 12:27
Insight
Golec: Enterprise deals over $100K require an in-person meeting
“Companies just generally don't buy from other companies for a 100,000 dollars without seeing somebody in person at one time or the other.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 12:54
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Golec: Demandbase maintains 110% net dollar retention
“We're at about a 110% net dollar retention.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 13:50
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Golec: Demandbase customer acquisition payback is under 12 months
“Our payback is less than you know, we're definitely less than 12 months from now.”
Chris Golec Mar 21, 2017 ▶ 15:02
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