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Jul 20, 2018 · 18m · top-founders

1091 Founded in 1999, How He's Managed a 20+ Year "Overnight Success"

Daniel Nisan · 8m spoken Nathan Latka · 7m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The Top Entrepreneurs, host Nathan Latka interviews Daniel Nisan, founder and CEO of Structured Web, exploring how the enterprise channel marketing automation platform scaled to 8.4 million dollars in annual recurring revenue with strong net negative churn and capital-efficient operations across a 20-year journey.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 44.8% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 6.0 Guest teaching 2.5 Guest disagreement 1.3 Nathan pushing back 3.3
05100:0010:000:49–4:13 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Introducing Structured Web and the Enterprise SaaS Model Nathan digs into the business model, average contract values, and capital history. Daniel explains how Structured Web works with channel partners and why original equity investors from 1999 remain patiently on the cap table.4:13–8:50 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Current Scale, Monthly Revenue, and Growth Trajectory When Daniel hesitates to verify revenue calculations on a public podcast, Nathan presses him to confirm the arithmetic based on the numbers already provided. Nathan also dives into marketing payback and gross margin nuances.8:53–14:58 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship: Thinkific Course Platform Nathan evaluates customer acquisition efficiency and churn rates, ultimately correcting Daniel on the industry definition and mathematical mechanics of net negative revenue churn.14:58–18:20 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Serial Entrepreneurship, Market Timing, and Capital Generation Daniel explains his background as an early pioneer in VoIP and NetGrocer, explaining how earlier exits enabled his patience with Structured Web. Nathan then transitions to the Famous Five and gives a standard recap.0:49–4:13 · Guest teaching 3/10 Introducing Structured Web and the Enterprise SaaS Model Nathan digs into the business model, average contract values, and capital history. Daniel explains how Structured Web works with channel partners and why original equity investors from 1999 remain patiently on the cap table.4:13–8:50 · Guest teaching 2/10 Current Scale, Monthly Revenue, and Growth Trajectory When Daniel hesitates to verify revenue calculations on a public podcast, Nathan presses him to confirm the arithmetic based on the numbers already provided. Nathan also dives into marketing payback and gross margin nuances.8:53–14:58 · Guest teaching 1/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship: Thinkific Course Platform Nathan evaluates customer acquisition efficiency and churn rates, ultimately correcting Daniel on the industry definition and mathematical mechanics of net negative revenue churn.14:58–18:20 · Guest teaching 4/10 Serial Entrepreneurship, Market Timing, and Capital Generation Daniel explains his background as an early pioneer in VoIP and NetGrocer, explaining how earlier exits enabled his patience with Structured Web. Nathan then transitions to the Famous Five and gives a standard recap.0:49–4:13 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Introducing Structured Web and the Enterprise SaaS Model Nathan digs into the business model, average contract values, and capital history. Daniel explains how Structured Web works with channel partners and why original equity investors from 1999 remain patiently on the cap table.4:13–8:50 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Current Scale, Monthly Revenue, and Growth Trajectory When Daniel hesitates to verify revenue calculations on a public podcast, Nathan presses him to confirm the arithmetic based on the numbers already provided. Nathan also dives into marketing payback and gross margin nuances.8:53–14:58 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship: Thinkific Course Platform Nathan evaluates customer acquisition efficiency and churn rates, ultimately correcting Daniel on the industry definition and mathematical mechanics of net negative revenue churn.14:58–18:20 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Serial Entrepreneurship, Market Timing, and Capital Generation Daniel explains his background as an early pioneer in VoIP and NetGrocer, explaining how earlier exits enabled his patience with Structured Web. Nathan then transitions to the Famous Five and gives a standard recap.0:49–4:13 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Introducing Structured Web and the Enterprise SaaS Model Nathan digs into the business model, average contract values, and capital history. Daniel explains how Structured Web works with channel partners and why original equity investors from 1999 remain patiently on the cap table.4:13–8:50 · Nathan pushing back 6/10 Current Scale, Monthly Revenue, and Growth Trajectory When Daniel hesitates to verify revenue calculations on a public podcast, Nathan presses him to confirm the arithmetic based on the numbers already provided. Nathan also dives into marketing payback and gross margin nuances.8:53–14:58 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Mid-Roll Sponsorship: Thinkific Course Platform Nathan evaluates customer acquisition efficiency and churn rates, ultimately correcting Daniel on the industry definition and mathematical mechanics of net negative revenue churn.14:58–18:20 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Serial Entrepreneurship, Market Timing, and Capital Generation Daniel explains his background as an early pioneer in VoIP and NetGrocer, explaining how earlier exits enabled his patience with Structured Web. Nathan then transitions to the Famous Five and gives a standard recap.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 39.5% · guest 60.5%0:00 · Nathan 39.5% · guest 60.5%3:00 · Nathan 39.2% · guest 60.8%3:00 · Nathan 39.2% · guest 60.8%6:00 · Nathan 32.5% · guest 67.5%6:00 · Nathan 32.5% · guest 67.5%9:00 · Nathan 77.2% · guest 22.8%9:00 · Nathan 77.2% · guest 22.8%12:00 · Nathan 38.3% · guest 61.7%12:00 · Nathan 38.3% · guest 61.7%15:00 · Nathan 35.1% · guest 64.9%15:00 · Nathan 35.1% · guest 64.9%18:00 · Nathan 83.2% · guest 16.8%18:00 · Nathan 83.2% · guest 16.8%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 4:45 Hesitation over disclosing public metrics

Daniel pushes back against publicly disclosing calculated monthly revenue figures on the show.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 4:52 Insisting on confirming calculated revenue

Nathan rejects Daniel's reluctance to share revenue by pointing out Daniel already provided the underlying customer count and ACV figures.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 15:07 Reframing wealth generation and timing

Daniel educates Nathan that he built wealth in previous exits and intentionally kept Structured Web at low burn until the market timing aligned.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 14:13 Correcting the definition of revenue churn

Nathan demonstrates SaaS expertise by politely correcting Daniel's inversion of positive and net negative revenue churn metrics.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Structured Web and the Enterprise SaaS Model 5312 Nathan digs into the business model, average contract values, and capital history. Daniel explains how Structured Web works with channel partners and why original equity investors from 1999 remain patiently on the cap table.
Current Scale, Monthly Revenue, and Growth Trajectory 7226 When Daniel hesitates to verify revenue calculations on a public podcast, Nathan presses him to confirm the arithmetic based on the numbers already provided. Nathan also dives into marketing payback and gross margin nuances.
Mid-Roll Sponsorship: Thinkific Course Platform 7114 Nathan evaluates customer acquisition efficiency and churn rates, ultimately correcting Daniel on the industry definition and mathematical mechanics of net negative revenue churn.
Serial Entrepreneurship, Market Timing, and Capital Generation 5411 Daniel explains his background as an early pioneer in VoIP and NetGrocer, explaining how earlier exits enabled his patience with Structured Web. Nathan then transitions to the Famous Five and gives a standard recap.

Statements from this episode (14)

Disclosure
Structured Web operates a pure-play SaaS model subsidized by enterprise brands.
“It's a pure play SaaS model, and the channel partners get it as a service. At no cost, fully subsidized by their brands that provide them the service.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 1:33
Disclosure
Structured Web charges between $5,000 and $100,000 monthly based on partners.
“The prices vary based on the number of channel partners they have on the platform, and it can vary from anywhere from 5000 dollars a month to over a 100,000 dollars a month.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 1:49
Disclosure
Structured Web's average customer pays approximately $20,000 per month.
“I would say 20,000 dollars.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 2:02
Disclosure
StructuredWeb raised $5.7 million in equity plus a few million in debt.
“We raised the 5.7 million dollars in, in equity. And we have about a few million dollars in debt as well.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 3:28
Assertion Not checkable as stated
StructuredWeb's early 2000s equity investors remain on the company's cap table.
“Still on the cap table. Very supportive, very friendly investors.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 3:42
Assertion Not checkable as stated
StructuredWeb serves a few dozen enterprise customers and over 100,000 global businesses.
“We have a few dozen customers and global users of over 100,000 businesses using StructureWeb.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 4:18
Assertion Not checkable as stated
StructuredWeb achieved 30% revenue growth in 2017 and targeted 30% for 2018.
“Year over year, last year, and our plan for 20 18 is about 30, 30% growth year over year?”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 5:18
Assertion Not checkable as stated
StructuredWeb achieves a one-to-one first-year revenue return on marketing spend.
“We look at the amount of money we spend against new revenue that we generate. And typically it's about one to one. So for every dollar we invest, we would generate one dollar in the same year that we invested that.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 7:24
Assertion Not checkable as stated
StructuredWeb employs a total of 50 team members.
“We have total 50 people.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 8:22
Disclosure
StructuredWeb maintains a lean sales team of two directors and one SDR.
“We have the total sales team that we have is three people. Director of sales, two, and one is SDR, sales development rep.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 12:03
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Daniel Nisan says StructuredWeb lost only one enterprise customer in 2017.
“And very proud to say that we finished a 2017 and we lost a single customer. So we were almost a 99% retention rate.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 13:02
Disclosure
StructuredWeb is Daniel Nisan's fifth startup following prior successful exits.
“So this is my fifth startup, and we had successful exits before, and I think part of building a startup is to understand that not always it's an overnight success, and you can build wealth and you can build a successful company over time.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 15:10
Assertion Supported
Daniel Nisan founded NetGrocer as the first nationwide online supermarket.
“I was the founder and CEO of Ned Grocer, the first online nationwide supermarket back in.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 15:41
Assertion Not checkable as stated
CEO Daniel Nisan says StructuredWeb is profitable and generating capital.
“No, we're generating capital.”
Daniel Nisan Jul 20, 2018 ▶ 16:31
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