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Mar 25, 2019 · 21m · top-founders

1339 $3m ARR Org Chart Company CEO Uses "Touch Zero" Operating Model to Manage Cash

Bill Boebel · 12m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this interview, Pingboard co-founder and CEO Bill Boebel explains how the company pivoted from office kiosks to dynamic org chart software, scaling past $3 million in ARR across 1,200 mid-market customers. He details his capital-efficient 'Touch Zero' operating model, unit economics, and strategies for scaling without aggressive venture capital dilution.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 34.6% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 6.3 Guest teaching 2.3 Guest disagreement 0.7 Nathan pushing back 1.3
05100:0010:0020:002:17–10:53 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Product Value Proposition and Pricing Structure Nathan demonstrates strong SaaS fluency by drilling into fully weighted CAC payback periods, expansion revenue drivers, and net churn calculations. Bill explains the nuance of their mid-market pricing and integration-driven retention collaboratively without any tension.10:53–16:51 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Customer Milestones and the Touch Zero Operating Model Nathan validates Pingboard's revenue run rate through live calculations on customer count and ARPU before discussing capital efficiency. Bill details his unique 'touch zero' operating model designed to avoid the traditional venture treadmill.16:52–20:16 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Financing Options and the Famous Five Nathan displays deep knowledge of venture debt mechanics, listing specific providers, term structures, revenue-share models, and warrant covenants. The exchange then wraps smoothly into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions.2:17–10:53 · Guest teaching 2/10 Product Value Proposition and Pricing Structure Nathan demonstrates strong SaaS fluency by drilling into fully weighted CAC payback periods, expansion revenue drivers, and net churn calculations. Bill explains the nuance of their mid-market pricing and integration-driven retention collaboratively without any tension.10:53–16:51 · Guest teaching 3/10 Customer Milestones and the Touch Zero Operating Model Nathan validates Pingboard's revenue run rate through live calculations on customer count and ARPU before discussing capital efficiency. Bill details his unique 'touch zero' operating model designed to avoid the traditional venture treadmill.16:52–20:16 · Guest teaching 2/10 Financing Options and the Famous Five Nathan displays deep knowledge of venture debt mechanics, listing specific providers, term structures, revenue-share models, and warrant covenants. The exchange then wraps smoothly into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions.2:17–10:53 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Product Value Proposition and Pricing Structure Nathan demonstrates strong SaaS fluency by drilling into fully weighted CAC payback periods, expansion revenue drivers, and net churn calculations. Bill explains the nuance of their mid-market pricing and integration-driven retention collaboratively without any tension.10:53–16:51 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Customer Milestones and the Touch Zero Operating Model Nathan validates Pingboard's revenue run rate through live calculations on customer count and ARPU before discussing capital efficiency. Bill details his unique 'touch zero' operating model designed to avoid the traditional venture treadmill.16:52–20:16 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Financing Options and the Famous Five Nathan displays deep knowledge of venture debt mechanics, listing specific providers, term structures, revenue-share models, and warrant covenants. The exchange then wraps smoothly into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions.2:17–10:53 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Product Value Proposition and Pricing Structure Nathan demonstrates strong SaaS fluency by drilling into fully weighted CAC payback periods, expansion revenue drivers, and net churn calculations. Bill explains the nuance of their mid-market pricing and integration-driven retention collaboratively without any tension.10:53–16:51 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Customer Milestones and the Touch Zero Operating Model Nathan validates Pingboard's revenue run rate through live calculations on customer count and ARPU before discussing capital efficiency. Bill details his unique 'touch zero' operating model designed to avoid the traditional venture treadmill.16:52–20:16 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Financing Options and the Famous Five Nathan displays deep knowledge of venture debt mechanics, listing specific providers, term structures, revenue-share models, and warrant covenants. The exchange then wraps smoothly into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 45.1% · guest 54.9%0:00 · Nathan 45.1% · guest 54.9%3:00 · Nathan 28.8% · guest 71.2%3:00 · Nathan 28.8% · guest 71.2%6:00 · Nathan 34.8% · guest 65.2%6:00 · Nathan 34.8% · guest 65.2%9:00 · Nathan 25.1% · guest 74.9%9:00 · Nathan 25.1% · guest 74.9%12:00 · Nathan 16.5% · guest 83.5%12:00 · Nathan 16.5% · guest 83.5%15:00 · Nathan 33.3% · guest 66.7%15:00 · Nathan 33.3% · guest 66.7%18:00 · Nathan 50.9% · guest 49.1%18:00 · Nathan 50.9% · guest 49.1%21:00 · Nathan 96.3% · guest 3.7%21:00 · Nathan 96.3% · guest 3.7%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 15:34 Bill criticizes standard Series A VC incentives

Bill firmly rejects the conventional Silicon Valley VC path, pointing out that typical institutional venture funds push founders onto a high-risk treadmill that removes operational optionality.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 11:19 Nathan checks and clarifies exact MRR calculations

Nathan presses on the math by multiplying 1,200 customers by the $220 average price point to pin down Pingboard's actual monthly recurring revenue baseline.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 14:00 Bill details the Touch Zero philosophy

Bill educates the host on how he tunes Pingboard's financial model every few weeks so cash hits zero exactly at the threshold of profitability rather than holding excess reserves.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 17:16 Nathan demonstrates venture debt expertise

Nathan displays domain authority by breaking down specific lending mechanics, comparing revenue-based financing repayment caps with conventional venture debt covenants and naming specialized debt providers.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Product Value Proposition and Pricing Structure 6211 Nathan demonstrates strong SaaS fluency by drilling into fully weighted CAC payback periods, expansion revenue drivers, and net churn calculations. Bill explains the nuance of their mid-market pricing and integration-driven retention collaboratively without any tension.
Customer Milestones and the Touch Zero Operating Model 6312 Nathan validates Pingboard's revenue run rate through live calculations on customer count and ARPU before discussing capital efficiency. Bill details his unique 'touch zero' operating model designed to avoid the traditional venture treadmill.
Financing Options and the Famous Five 7201 Nathan displays deep knowledge of venture debt mechanics, listing specific providers, term structures, revenue-share models, and warrant covenants. The exchange then wraps smoothly into the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions.

Statements from this episode (12)

Disclosure
Boebel: Pingboard originated as a front-desk visitor directory for Capital Factory
“So we built that initially, actually, out of a need we had at Capital Factory. We needed basically a member directory and something sitting at the front door so that a visitor could, Browse the, or search the directory, and ping the person they were there to s…”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 1:30
Opinion
Boebel: Org chart software is an overlooked need dominated by PowerPoint and Visio
“I think it's an interesting combination of something every company needs, but something that is overlooked, and Really, there's no solid software for it out there. Everybody can still build org charts in PowerPoint and Visio.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 1:50
Disclosure
Pingboard generates about 3,500 monthly signups
“We like, for example, with our product today, we generate about 3500 signups per month.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 4:17
Assertion Contradicted
Webmail.us had 80,000 customers when sold to Rackspace
“We, when we sold that business to Rackspace, we had, like, around 80,000 customers, and I think the average price point there was closer to 20 dollars.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 4:52
Disclosure
Pingboard's $150 initial monthly deal sizes expand to $220 over time
“Across the board, it's 220 dollars average customer size, but when a deal first closes, it's about a 150 dollars.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 6:46
Disclosure
Boebel: Pingboard churns 1.5% monthly, offset by expansion
“We churn about a percent and a half a month, which isn't too bad because it's actually offset by expansion revenue almost exactly.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 8:28
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Boebel: Pingboard scales to approximately 1,200 customers
“So earlier this year we crossed a thousand customers. I believe we're around 1200 now.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 11:02
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Boebel: Pingboard crosses $3 million ARR threshold
“We crossed into two million in January of this year. We're crossing three right now.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 11:48
Disclosure
Boebel: Pingboard raised $7.5 million across three separate seed rounds
“We've raised three separate seed rounds that were each two and a half million dollars, which is very different. Seven and a half million total.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 12:53
Insight
Boebel: 'Touch Zero' model aligns running out of cash with reaching profitability
“I always operate to where, you know, every few weeks we're tuning our financial model to try to make sure we touch zero in the bank account, which by that, I mean, we spend every dollar, but the moment we run out of money is the moment we hit profitability.”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 14:23
Opinion
Boebel: Bay Area Series A funds force startups onto a venture treadmill
“I went out and talked to a lot of Bay Area investors, you know, at the typical Series A funds, and just found that all of them, for their funds to work, they really want companies that are going to spend more than what you can in the top zero model. You're rea…”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 15:35
Insight
Boebel: Revenue-based financing adds two months to customer payback period
“Most likely the percentage of revenue route, the from what I've seen, you can get better terms that way. And it's actually easier to model and it's easier to plug into the touch zero operating model than I have. Which I already have. And basically the way it w…”
Bill Boebel Mar 25, 2019 ▶ 17:51
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