Jun 7, 2022 · 21m · top-founders

He hated his remote guitar lessons then spent $8m on new SaaS MVP, 5 patents later he's preparing for launch.

Amir Ashkenazi · 11m spoken Nathan Latka · 6m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

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Serial entrepreneur Amir Ashkenazi joins Nathan Latka to discuss building Switchboard, an interactive cloud co-working workspace developed through $8 million in stealth R&D following frustrations with remote guitar lessons. Ashkenazi shares strategic insights on raising venture capital, managing remote teams, and reflections from his multi-hundred-million-dollar exits.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 37.6% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 3.8 Guest teaching 2.2 Guest disagreement 1.6 Nathan pushing back 1.6
05100:0010:0020:000:48–2:59 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Introducing Amir Ashkenazi and the Vision for Switchboard Nathan contextualizes Switchboard against competitors like Zoom Whiteboard and ClickUp, questioning whether the winner will be determined by technical moats or distribution. Amir clarifies how cloud browsers create persistent collaborative canvas environments.3:01–10:02 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 The Technical Moat and Guitar Lesson Origins Nathan pushes back when Amir talks about partnerships, pointing out that Amir is listed as the sole founder on corporate filings. Amir surprises Nathan by revealing that they spent $8 million in development before launch to secure five granted patents.10:05–14:51 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Sponsor Segment: Remote.com for Global Hiring Following a sponsor read for Remote.com, Nathan asks detailed questions about talent acquisition and the specific analytics stack used to measure early product activation and virality. Amir details their usage of Snowflake, Amplitude, and Datadog.14:52–18:28 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Venture Capital Strategy and Multi-Million Dollar Exits Nathan probes Amir's previous major exits at Shopping.com and Adapt.tv and asks for current beta numbers. Amir resists disclosing private user figures, prompting Nathan to push back that other founders frequently share them.18:30–20:59 · Nathan as informed peer 2/10 Famous Five Questions and Episode Conclusion Nathan moves through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions covering reading habits, sleep, and historical career reflections in an agreeable and straightforward wrap-up.0:48–2:59 · Guest teaching 2/10 Introducing Amir Ashkenazi and the Vision for Switchboard Nathan contextualizes Switchboard against competitors like Zoom Whiteboard and ClickUp, questioning whether the winner will be determined by technical moats or distribution. Amir clarifies how cloud browsers create persistent collaborative canvas environments.3:01–10:02 · Guest teaching 4/10 The Technical Moat and Guitar Lesson Origins Nathan pushes back when Amir talks about partnerships, pointing out that Amir is listed as the sole founder on corporate filings. Amir surprises Nathan by revealing that they spent $8 million in development before launch to secure five granted patents.10:05–14:51 · Guest teaching 1/10 Sponsor Segment: Remote.com for Global Hiring Following a sponsor read for Remote.com, Nathan asks detailed questions about talent acquisition and the specific analytics stack used to measure early product activation and virality. Amir details their usage of Snowflake, Amplitude, and Datadog.14:52–18:28 · Guest teaching 3/10 Venture Capital Strategy and Multi-Million Dollar Exits Nathan probes Amir's previous major exits at Shopping.com and Adapt.tv and asks for current beta numbers. Amir resists disclosing private user figures, prompting Nathan to push back that other founders frequently share them.18:30–20:59 · Guest teaching 1/10 Famous Five Questions and Episode Conclusion Nathan moves through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions covering reading habits, sleep, and historical career reflections in an agreeable and straightforward wrap-up.0:48–2:59 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Introducing Amir Ashkenazi and the Vision for Switchboard Nathan contextualizes Switchboard against competitors like Zoom Whiteboard and ClickUp, questioning whether the winner will be determined by technical moats or distribution. Amir clarifies how cloud browsers create persistent collaborative canvas environments.3:01–10:02 · Guest disagreement 2/10 The Technical Moat and Guitar Lesson Origins Nathan pushes back when Amir talks about partnerships, pointing out that Amir is listed as the sole founder on corporate filings. Amir surprises Nathan by revealing that they spent $8 million in development before launch to secure five granted patents.10:05–14:51 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Sponsor Segment: Remote.com for Global Hiring Following a sponsor read for Remote.com, Nathan asks detailed questions about talent acquisition and the specific analytics stack used to measure early product activation and virality. Amir details their usage of Snowflake, Amplitude, and Datadog.14:52–18:28 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Venture Capital Strategy and Multi-Million Dollar Exits Nathan probes Amir's previous major exits at Shopping.com and Adapt.tv and asks for current beta numbers. Amir resists disclosing private user figures, prompting Nathan to push back that other founders frequently share them.18:30–20:59 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Famous Five Questions and Episode Conclusion Nathan moves through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions covering reading habits, sleep, and historical career reflections in an agreeable and straightforward wrap-up.0:48–2:59 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Introducing Amir Ashkenazi and the Vision for Switchboard Nathan contextualizes Switchboard against competitors like Zoom Whiteboard and ClickUp, questioning whether the winner will be determined by technical moats or distribution. Amir clarifies how cloud browsers create persistent collaborative canvas environments.3:01–10:02 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 The Technical Moat and Guitar Lesson Origins Nathan pushes back when Amir talks about partnerships, pointing out that Amir is listed as the sole founder on corporate filings. Amir surprises Nathan by revealing that they spent $8 million in development before launch to secure five granted patents.10:05–14:51 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Sponsor Segment: Remote.com for Global Hiring Following a sponsor read for Remote.com, Nathan asks detailed questions about talent acquisition and the specific analytics stack used to measure early product activation and virality. Amir details their usage of Snowflake, Amplitude, and Datadog.14:52–18:28 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Venture Capital Strategy and Multi-Million Dollar Exits Nathan probes Amir's previous major exits at Shopping.com and Adapt.tv and asks for current beta numbers. Amir resists disclosing private user figures, prompting Nathan to push back that other founders frequently share them.18:30–20:59 · Nathan pushing back 0/10 Famous Five Questions and Episode Conclusion Nathan moves through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions covering reading habits, sleep, and historical career reflections in an agreeable and straightforward wrap-up.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 55% · guest 45%0:00 · Nathan 55% · guest 45%3:00 · Nathan 21.2% · guest 78.8%3:00 · Nathan 21.2% · guest 78.8%6:00 · Nathan 24.9% · guest 75.1%6:00 · Nathan 24.9% · guest 75.1%9:00 · Nathan 68.9% · guest 31.1%9:00 · Nathan 68.9% · guest 31.1%12:00 · Nathan 26.3% · guest 73.7%12:00 · Nathan 26.3% · guest 73.7%15:00 · Nathan 37.9% · guest 62.1%15:00 · Nathan 37.9% · guest 62.1%18:00 · Nathan 28.1% · guest 71.9%18:00 · Nathan 28.1% · guest 71.9%21:00 · Nathan 0% · guest 0%21:00 · Nathan 0% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 17:39 Amir shuts down questions regarding beta user counts

Amir bluntly deflects Nathan's request for user numbers by stating they are private and asserting Nathan should already know that.

Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 5:42 Nathan challenges Amir's partnership narrative

Nathan calls out Amir for talking about the importance of partners when research shows Amir incorporated as a sole founder with no co-founders.

Biggest teaching moment ▶ 6:47 Amir reveals the massive $8M pre-launch development cost

Amir corrects Nathan's assumption of a typical MVP development budget by revealing an $8 million spend and five granted patents required to build the core tech.

Nathan holds their own ▶ 16:25 Nathan analyzes Amir's past exit timelines and multiples

Nathan demonstrates command of venture exit mechanics by calculating timelines, capital raised, and earn-out structures across Shopping.com, Adapt.tv, and Tokio.

the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Amir Ashkenazi and the Vision for Switchboard 4211 Nathan contextualizes Switchboard against competitors like Zoom Whiteboard and ClickUp, questioning whether the winner will be determined by technical moats or distribution. Amir clarifies how cloud browsers create persistent collaborative canvas environments.
The Technical Moat and Guitar Lesson Origins 4423 Nathan pushes back when Amir talks about partnerships, pointing out that Amir is listed as the sole founder on corporate filings. Amir surprises Nathan by revealing that they spent $8 million in development before launch to secure five granted patents.
Sponsor Segment: Remote.com for Global Hiring 4111 Following a sponsor read for Remote.com, Nathan asks detailed questions about talent acquisition and the specific analytics stack used to measure early product activation and virality. Amir details their usage of Snowflake, Amplitude, and Datadog.
Venture Capital Strategy and Multi-Million Dollar Exits 5333 Nathan probes Amir's previous major exits at Shopping.com and Adapt.tv and asks for current beta numbers. Amir resists disclosing private user figures, prompting Nathan to push back that other founders frequently share them.
Famous Five Questions and Episode Conclusion 2110 Nathan moves through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions covering reading habits, sleep, and historical career reflections in an agreeable and straightforward wrap-up.

Statements from this episode (7)

Assertion Supported
Ashkenazi: Switchboard's cloud browsers make any web app collaboratively interactive
“So what we did is we developed cloud browsers. Those are essential elements that allow you to bring any tool that you already use, things like Google Docs and Figma and Trello and Jira, and they become immediately collaborative. Even the regular website become…”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 2:28
Disclosure
Ashkenazi: Switchboard began as remote guitar lesson software before pivoting
“I think it took us six months to understand that this is actually not for guitar lessons, but this is the core problem that every remote and hybrid team is facing.”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 4:38
Disclosure
Ashkenazi: Switchboard spent about $8M on stealth development before beta
“About eight.”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 6:58
Assertion Partly supported
Ashkenazi: Switchboard secured five granted patents within two years
“So in two years, we already have five granted patents for the work that we do.”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 7:14
Insight
Ashkenazi: Fundraising ability is the ultimate determinant of startup success
“I think it's absolutely critical to raise money from external investors, even if you can fund it, or you think that you can fund it, your ability to raise money is the number one thing that will determine your future success.”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 15:17
Opinion
Ashkenazi regrets selling his three previous startups too early
“In total, I sold three companies, and in general, I regret not holding each one of them a bit longer.”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 16:15
Assertion Supported
Ashkenazi: Adap.tv raised $48M and was acquired by AOL for over $400M
“Adapt TV also raised money. I think it totally raised forty eight million dollars and that was acquired by AOL for about 400 and something million dollars.”
Amir Ashkenazi Jun 7, 2022 ▶ 16:54
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