Apr 29, 2019 · 20m · saastr
How we did it: Gender Equality, Equal Pay, and Racial Equality with Salesforce
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
Salesforce leaders Leila Seka and Molly Ford share the inside story of how grassroots employee initiatives and executive courage transformed Salesforce into an industry pioneer for corporate equality, equal pay, and actionable allyship.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. How this is scored →
Jason as informed peer 0.0 Guest teaching 0.0 Guest disagreement 0.3 Jason pushing back 0.0
speaking balance: gold is Jason, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 11:40 Challenging leaders on passive privilege
Seka directly confronts the audience, asserting that staying quiet and avoiding difficult diversity conversations is the exact definition of privilege.
Hardest push from Jason ▶ 3:15 Recounting Benioff's initial pushbackSeka recounts Marc Benioff's initial defensive disbelief that Salesforce could possibly have pay disparities within its culture.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 4:41 Ford defining true sponsorshipFord instructs the audience on genuine executive sponsorship, emphasizing the need to carry colleagues' ideas into closed rooms while ensuring their names remain attached.
Jason holds their own ▶ 3:35 Agreeing to pop the hood on pay dataSeka highlights the pivotal leadership response where executive leadership agreed to open the data and address whatever disparities were uncovered.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Jason as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Jason pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| The Train Ride Pitch and Proposing Equal Pay to Marc Benioff | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Leila Seka and Molly Ford deliver a collaborative stage presentation detailing their initial conversation on a train and pitching an equal pay audit to Marc Benioff. The podcast host is not actively participating in the dialogue. | |
| Sponsorship in Action, the 2015 Women's Summit, and Hiring a Chief Equality Officer | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Ford explains the critical difference between mentorship and sponsorship, recounting the execution of the 2015 Women's Summit and hiring Salesforce's first Chief Equality Officer without host interaction. | |
| Executive Sponsoring BOLDforce and Defining the Four Pillars of Allyship | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | The speakers describe Seka becoming the executive sponsor for BOLDforce and Ford breaks down the four actionable pillars of allyship (Ask, Listen, Show up, Speak up). | |
| Navigating Language, Confronting Privilege, and Speaking Up | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | Seka passionately challenges the audience of tech leaders on white male privilege and the necessity of speaking up and adopting correct terminology around race and gender. | |
| Starting Equality Early and Sustaining Multi-Million Dollar Pay Audits | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Ford and Seka advise startup leaders to institute pay equity audits early, sharing that Salesforce continually uncovered multi-million dollar disparities across consecutive yearly audits. | |
| Embedding Equality as a Core Value and Final Call to Action | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | The co-presenters conclude their keynote with an appeal to the audience to embed equality as an ongoing organizational value and stand up for others. |
Statements from this episode (10)
Benioff initially dismissed pay gap claims before approving compensation audit
“Cindy had a one-on-one with Mark, and she invited me, and we got all ready, and we went to the one-on-one, and we sat there, and you know, the crux of the conversation was about equal pay and it really was us sort of saying to him, hey, you know, we think ther…”
Ford: Sponsorship means pitching colleagues' ideas while keeping their names attached
“So it's about advocating for people when they're not physically in that room, taking their ideas forward and keeping their name on it, right? And making sure they're getting the credit for what they did.”
Ford: Actionable allyship requires asking, listening, showing up, and speaking up
“We have four steps to being an ally. Ally is actionable. It's ask, ask people about their journey, right? What's it like to be a black woman? Listen, listen with empathy and respect. Show up. So when there's a South Asia force, Diwali festival, show up, right?…”
Seka: Leaders ignoring diversity issues will lose their roles within five years
“That type of leadership where you stand back and are like I'm gonna see what happens, you won't be a leader in five years if that's the way you decide to do it.”
Seka: White men hold the most impactful voices in diversity advocacy
“If you are a white person, and my god, if you are a white man, which I love white men, I'm married to one, I'm made to, I'm down with it, right? I like them, but you have the most important voice in this, because no one expects you to say anything.”
Ford: Correcting pay gaps is easier at 200 employees than 40,000
“It's easier to ride a ship when you've got a couple hundred employees, to do that equal pay audit now, to think about diversity in your hiring and your recruiting practices now versus, oh, let me fix things when I'm 40,000 employees in.”
Benioff regrets not prioritizing equal pay from Salesforce's inception
“He will openly say, if I'd known, I would have done this in the beginning too. I would have done equal pay and equality, and I would have had a chief equality officer. The second I hired the chief philanthropy officer, like he, Miss Mark Benioff, like the lege…”
Salesforce spent over $8M across three years fixing compensation disparities
“We did the equal pay audit the first year, and we found about a three million dollar issue. And then we did it the second year, and we found another three million dollar issue. And then we did it the third year, and we found another, I mean, it's north of eigh…”
First Salesforce equal pay audit adjusted salaries for almost as many men
“That first year we did the audit, we almost paid as many men as we did women to balance the salaries, and no one actually gets a pay cut.”
Seka: Corporate equality requires continuous commitment rather than one-off audits
“This is not a one and done. You can't be like, oh, I went to the Bold Force meeting, I went to the Martin Luther King march, I did one pay audit. We're equal. Like, this is something that you decide to commit yourself to, and commit your company to”