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Jun 6, 2020 · 23m · how-i-built-this

How I Built Resilience: Live with Troy Carter

Troy Carter · 16m spoken Guy Raz · 5m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this live episode of How I Built Resilience, host Guy Raz interviews music executive and investor Troy Carter on navigating the dual crises of the COVID-19 pandemic and nationwide racial injustice protests. Carter shares candid insights on systemic racism, corporate diversity deficits, the evolution of the music industry, and the necessity of economic equity and empathy for lasting reform.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 25.1% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Guy as informed peer 2.1 Guest teaching 5.9 Guest disagreement 0.6 Guy pushing back 0.0
05100:0010:0020:001:19–3:50 · Guy as informed peer 1/10 Navigating Personal Realities and Racism as a Parent Raz opens warmly and asks how Carter is talking to his kids during the protests. Carter provides detailed personal stories about his daughter at protests and being physically assaulted by security in Mexico City despite being an executive, illustrating systemic racism vividly.3:51–6:17 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Systemic Bias and the Merger of the Left Behind Raz empathetically reflects on Carter's parental anxieties. Carter elaborates on driving through the American South and explains his concept of the protests representing a 'merger of the left behind' across racial lines facing systemic economic hurdles.6:17–8:54 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Technological Visibility, Privilege, and Demanding Systemic Reckoning Raz notes the frustration of little progress over the past decade. Carter analyses historical tech like the camcorder versus modern smartphones, dissecting the Central Park birdwatcher incident and dismissing media attempts to highlight credentials rather than basic human dignity.8:55–11:28 · Guy as informed peer 4/10 Historical Reckoning, Symbols of Oppression, and Midroll Break Raz brings in his personal experience reporting in Germany and their deliberate national reckoning with the past. Carter agrees and shares shocking stories of seeing Confederate flags while on tour with mainstream pop artists in Pennsylvania and Ohio.11:34–14:33 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Pandemic Disruption and Technological Shifts in Live Music Raz pivots to the music industry's handling of the pandemic. Carter delivers nuanced industry analysis, explaining why recorded music is insulated due to digital distribution while predicting touring will remain devastated until 2022 and how technology could improve live accessibility.14:34–17:34 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 The Role of Music and Art During Crisis Raz passes along audience questions regarding the appropriateness of releasing music and whether the industry is taking a hit. Carter explains that the music industry's executive diversity problem is far worse than the NFL's, pointing out white executives heading Black music divisions.17:34–20:23 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Capital Access, Equity, and Empowering Black Entrepreneurs When Raz suggests this moment could be a catalyst, Carter immediately reframes fairness versus equal start lines, pushing back against charity foundation approaches in favor of standard capital access and institutional support for Black founders.20:24–22:54 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Economic Divides, Automation Risks, and Demanding Empathy Raz asks Carter if he is hopeful for systemic change over a 5 to 10 year horizon. Carter notes that history suggests pessimism but stresses that emerging automation, education gaps, and economic divides across all demographics will force a broader awakening demanding empathy.1:19–3:50 · Guest teaching 6/10 Navigating Personal Realities and Racism as a Parent Raz opens warmly and asks how Carter is talking to his kids during the protests. Carter provides detailed personal stories about his daughter at protests and being physically assaulted by security in Mexico City despite being an executive, illustrating systemic racism vividly.3:51–6:17 · Guest teaching 5/10 Systemic Bias and the Merger of the Left Behind Raz empathetically reflects on Carter's parental anxieties. Carter elaborates on driving through the American South and explains his concept of the protests representing a 'merger of the left behind' across racial lines facing systemic economic hurdles.6:17–8:54 · Guest teaching 6/10 Technological Visibility, Privilege, and Demanding Systemic Reckoning Raz notes the frustration of little progress over the past decade. Carter analyses historical tech like the camcorder versus modern smartphones, dissecting the Central Park birdwatcher incident and dismissing media attempts to highlight credentials rather than basic human dignity.8:55–11:28 · Guest teaching 4/10 Historical Reckoning, Symbols of Oppression, and Midroll Break Raz brings in his personal experience reporting in Germany and their deliberate national reckoning with the past. Carter agrees and shares shocking stories of seeing Confederate flags while on tour with mainstream pop artists in Pennsylvania and Ohio.11:34–14:33 · Guest teaching 6/10 Pandemic Disruption and Technological Shifts in Live Music Raz pivots to the music industry's handling of the pandemic. Carter delivers nuanced industry analysis, explaining why recorded music is insulated due to digital distribution while predicting touring will remain devastated until 2022 and how technology could improve live accessibility.14:34–17:34 · Guest teaching 7/10 The Role of Music and Art During Crisis Raz passes along audience questions regarding the appropriateness of releasing music and whether the industry is taking a hit. Carter explains that the music industry's executive diversity problem is far worse than the NFL's, pointing out white executives heading Black music divisions.17:34–20:23 · Guest teaching 7/10 Capital Access, Equity, and Empowering Black Entrepreneurs When Raz suggests this moment could be a catalyst, Carter immediately reframes fairness versus equal start lines, pushing back against charity foundation approaches in favor of standard capital access and institutional support for Black founders.20:24–22:54 · Guest teaching 6/10 Economic Divides, Automation Risks, and Demanding Empathy Raz asks Carter if he is hopeful for systemic change over a 5 to 10 year horizon. Carter notes that history suggests pessimism but stresses that emerging automation, education gaps, and economic divides across all demographics will force a broader awakening demanding empathy.1:19–3:50 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Navigating Personal Realities and Racism as a Parent Raz opens warmly and asks how Carter is talking to his kids during the protests. Carter provides detailed personal stories about his daughter at protests and being physically assaulted by security in Mexico City despite being an executive, illustrating systemic racism vividly.3:51–6:17 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Systemic Bias and the Merger of the Left Behind Raz empathetically reflects on Carter's parental anxieties. Carter elaborates on driving through the American South and explains his concept of the protests representing a 'merger of the left behind' across racial lines facing systemic economic hurdles.6:17–8:54 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Technological Visibility, Privilege, and Demanding Systemic Reckoning Raz notes the frustration of little progress over the past decade. Carter analyses historical tech like the camcorder versus modern smartphones, dissecting the Central Park birdwatcher incident and dismissing media attempts to highlight credentials rather than basic human dignity.8:55–11:28 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Historical Reckoning, Symbols of Oppression, and Midroll Break Raz brings in his personal experience reporting in Germany and their deliberate national reckoning with the past. Carter agrees and shares shocking stories of seeing Confederate flags while on tour with mainstream pop artists in Pennsylvania and Ohio.11:34–14:33 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Pandemic Disruption and Technological Shifts in Live Music Raz pivots to the music industry's handling of the pandemic. Carter delivers nuanced industry analysis, explaining why recorded music is insulated due to digital distribution while predicting touring will remain devastated until 2022 and how technology could improve live accessibility.14:34–17:34 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Role of Music and Art During Crisis Raz passes along audience questions regarding the appropriateness of releasing music and whether the industry is taking a hit. Carter explains that the music industry's executive diversity problem is far worse than the NFL's, pointing out white executives heading Black music divisions.17:34–20:23 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Capital Access, Equity, and Empowering Black Entrepreneurs When Raz suggests this moment could be a catalyst, Carter immediately reframes fairness versus equal start lines, pushing back against charity foundation approaches in favor of standard capital access and institutional support for Black founders.20:24–22:54 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Economic Divides, Automation Risks, and Demanding Empathy Raz asks Carter if he is hopeful for systemic change over a 5 to 10 year horizon. Carter notes that history suggests pessimism but stresses that emerging automation, education gaps, and economic divides across all demographics will force a broader awakening demanding empathy.1:19–3:50 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Navigating Personal Realities and Racism as a Parent Raz opens warmly and asks how Carter is talking to his kids during the protests. Carter provides detailed personal stories about his daughter at protests and being physically assaulted by security in Mexico City despite being an executive, illustrating systemic racism vividly.3:51–6:17 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Systemic Bias and the Merger of the Left Behind Raz empathetically reflects on Carter's parental anxieties. Carter elaborates on driving through the American South and explains his concept of the protests representing a 'merger of the left behind' across racial lines facing systemic economic hurdles.6:17–8:54 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Technological Visibility, Privilege, and Demanding Systemic Reckoning Raz notes the frustration of little progress over the past decade. Carter analyses historical tech like the camcorder versus modern smartphones, dissecting the Central Park birdwatcher incident and dismissing media attempts to highlight credentials rather than basic human dignity.8:55–11:28 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Historical Reckoning, Symbols of Oppression, and Midroll Break Raz brings in his personal experience reporting in Germany and their deliberate national reckoning with the past. Carter agrees and shares shocking stories of seeing Confederate flags while on tour with mainstream pop artists in Pennsylvania and Ohio.11:34–14:33 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Pandemic Disruption and Technological Shifts in Live Music Raz pivots to the music industry's handling of the pandemic. Carter delivers nuanced industry analysis, explaining why recorded music is insulated due to digital distribution while predicting touring will remain devastated until 2022 and how technology could improve live accessibility.14:34–17:34 · Guy pushing back 0/10 The Role of Music and Art During Crisis Raz passes along audience questions regarding the appropriateness of releasing music and whether the industry is taking a hit. Carter explains that the music industry's executive diversity problem is far worse than the NFL's, pointing out white executives heading Black music divisions.17:34–20:23 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Capital Access, Equity, and Empowering Black Entrepreneurs When Raz suggests this moment could be a catalyst, Carter immediately reframes fairness versus equal start lines, pushing back against charity foundation approaches in favor of standard capital access and institutional support for Black founders.20:24–22:54 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Economic Divides, Automation Risks, and Demanding Empathy Raz asks Carter if he is hopeful for systemic change over a 5 to 10 year horizon. Carter notes that history suggests pessimism but stresses that emerging automation, education gaps, and economic divides across all demographics will force a broader awakening demanding empathy.

speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Guy 46.4% · guest 53.6%0:00 · Guy 46.4% · guest 53.6%3:00 · Guy 11.5% · guest 88.5%3:00 · Guy 11.5% · guest 88.5%6:00 · Guy 13.3% · guest 86.7%6:00 · Guy 13.3% · guest 86.7%9:00 · Guy 48.3% · guest 51.7%9:00 · Guy 48.3% · guest 51.7%12:00 · Guy 27.3% · guest 72.7%12:00 · Guy 27.3% · guest 72.7%15:00 · Guy 8.8% · guest 91.2%15:00 · Guy 8.8% · guest 91.2%18:00 · Guy 13.8% · guest 86.2%18:00 · Guy 13.8% · guest 86.2%21:00 · Guy 31.6% · guest 68.4%21:00 · Guy 31.6% · guest 68.4%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 17:40 Direct pushback against foundation-style handouts

Carter forcefully reframes Raz's kick-in-the-butt premise to specify that Black founders do not want patronizing foundation handouts, but rather standard venture capital investment with equitable access.

 Hardest push from Guy ▶ 20:49 Hesitation over the hopeful framing

Raz qualifies his own question by expressing reluctance to use typical cliché optimism before asking if this moment will truly move the needle.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 16:25 Carter details music industry executive disparity

Carter delivers an eye-opening reality check that the music industry's executive suite diversity is far worse than the NFL, noting white executives holding titled positions as heads of Black music.

 Guy holds their own ▶ 8:55 Raz draws comparative historical analysis with Germany

Raz leverages his experience as a foreign correspondent in Germany to contrast their decades-long national reckoning against America's failure to address centuries of slavery.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicGuy as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementGuy pushing backWhy
Navigating Personal Realities and Racism as a Parent 1600 Raz opens warmly and asks how Carter is talking to his kids during the protests. Carter provides detailed personal stories about his daughter at protests and being physically assaulted by security in Mexico City despite being an executive, illustrating systemic racism vividly.
Systemic Bias and the Merger of the Left Behind 2500 Raz empathetically reflects on Carter's parental anxieties. Carter elaborates on driving through the American South and explains his concept of the protests representing a 'merger of the left behind' across racial lines facing systemic economic hurdles.
Technological Visibility, Privilege, and Demanding Systemic Reckoning 2610 Raz notes the frustration of little progress over the past decade. Carter analyses historical tech like the camcorder versus modern smartphones, dissecting the Central Park birdwatcher incident and dismissing media attempts to highlight credentials rather than basic human dignity.
Historical Reckoning, Symbols of Oppression, and Midroll Break 4400 Raz brings in his personal experience reporting in Germany and their deliberate national reckoning with the past. Carter agrees and shares shocking stories of seeing Confederate flags while on tour with mainstream pop artists in Pennsylvania and Ohio.
Pandemic Disruption and Technological Shifts in Live Music 2600 Raz pivots to the music industry's handling of the pandemic. Carter delivers nuanced industry analysis, explaining why recorded music is insulated due to digital distribution while predicting touring will remain devastated until 2022 and how technology could improve live accessibility.
The Role of Music and Art During Crisis 2710 Raz passes along audience questions regarding the appropriateness of releasing music and whether the industry is taking a hit. Carter explains that the music industry's executive diversity problem is far worse than the NFL's, pointing out white executives heading Black music divisions.
Capital Access, Equity, and Empowering Black Entrepreneurs 2720 When Raz suggests this moment could be a catalyst, Carter immediately reframes fairness versus equal start lines, pushing back against charity foundation approaches in favor of standard capital access and institutional support for Black founders.
Economic Divides, Automation Risks, and Demanding Empathy 2610 Raz asks Carter if he is hopeful for systemic change over a 5 to 10 year horizon. Carter notes that history suggests pessimism but stresses that emerging automation, education gaps, and economic divides across all demographics will force a broader awakening demanding empathy.

Statements from this episode (9)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Troy Carter was attacked by hotel security during a YPO retreat
“Recently I was on a trip probably five months ago with my YPO forum, which is, you know, Young Presidents Organization, and we did a retreat to Mexico City, and it's 10 of us, We get out of our SUV to pull up to the hotel. All of the guys go in the back to get…”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 2:47
Opinion
Troy Carter viewed 2020 protests as a multiracial coalition of the left-behind
“I think what we've seen that's different with these protests, this is what I consider just a merger of the left behind, where this, these are white, black, Asian, Hispanic people that have been, you know, saddled with student debt, people who, Can't pursue the…”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 5:43
Insight
Black victims shouldn't need elite credentials to be presumed innocent
“He shouldn't have to have a Harvard degree or be a bird watcher to be an innocent person being accused of something like that, that could have ended up in, in him being arrested or his death.”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 8:03
Assertion Open · timeframe Jun 2020
Charlie Puth refused to soundcheck until a Confederate flag was removed
“And on stage, it was a Confederate flag right behind the stage, and Charlie Puth, Refused to go on for his soundcheck until they took that flag down.”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 10:40
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Troy Carter: America will never achieve true racial reconciliation
“So we're still reminded of our place in, in, in this country, so you'll never get to reconciliation. We all know the truth, but we'll never get to reconciliation.”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 10:56
Prediction Held up
Carter predicted in 2020 that live touring wouldn't normalize until 2022
“On the touring side, it's catastrophic, and the reality is we probably won't see this look normal until twenty-twenty-two, in my opinion.”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 13:02
Opinion
Music industry executive diversity is far worse than the NFL
“The music industry is much, much worse than the NFL. What black music has contributed financially to the music industry, What black culture has contributed, you know, financially to the music industry, and when you look at the ratio of actual black executives …”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 16:33
Assertion Supported
White executives hold 'Head of Black Music' titles at some labels
“You actually, believe it or not, have white people that are the heads of black music with a title at some of these companies. You know, it's, and literally you have qualified black executives in the company, but actual white people with a title, the head of bl…”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 16:53
Opinion
Black founders need equal capital access and standard ROI expectations, not charity
“Like those black businesses should be held to the same standard of return on capital. It's just the opportunity to have access to that capital. Have access to the support and training that Y Combinator companies may get, or that, you know, first-round capital …”
Troy Carter Jun 6, 2020 ▶ 18:47
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