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Nov 2, 2023 · 41m · how-i-built-this

The art of letting go with Vincent and Andrew Kitirattragarn of Dang Foods

Guy Raz · 13m spoken Vincent Kitirattragarn · 12m spoken Andrew Kitirattragarn · 9m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

Dang Foods co-founders Vincent and Andrew Kitirattragarn join Guy Raz to provide an honest post-mortem on how pandemic-induced shipping surges forced the liquidation of their snack company, detailing their emotional recovery and the serendipitous deal that preserved their brand's legacy.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 39.2% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Guy as informed peer 2.8 Guest teaching 2.6 Guest disagreement 0.4 Guy pushing back 0.4
05100:0015:0030:000:01–7:03 · Guy as informed peer 4/10 Listener Callout: Sharing Favorite Show Episodes Raz demonstrates industry awareness by discussing keto trends and comparing Dang's initial sales to Clif Bar's pandemic pantry loading. Vincent clarifies that after an initial panic-buying spike, on-the-go snack demand plummeted.7:04–14:19 · Guy as informed peer 3/10 Skyrocketing Freight Costs and Failed Rescue Efforts The guests educate Raz on the exact economic shock of container freight jumping from $5K to $22K and the reality of attempting M&A with SPACs during distress. Raz probes into investor recovery and wind-down decisions with supportive framing.14:28–20:59 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Sponsor Break: NetSuite by Oracle Business Management Raz opens with an ad read and transitions into exploring the logistics of winding down. Andrew explains the compounding port delay issue from 7 to 14 weeks before both founders share emotional vulnerabilities.21:00–26:24 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Mila Soup Dumplings and a Serendipitous Acquisition Raz facilitates the narrative as Vincent explains investing in Mila dumplings and the serendipitous encounter at an 80s holiday party that saved the Dang brand through Safe Catch.26:42–40:36 · Guy as informed peer 3/10 Post-Mortem Lessons, Startup Advising, and Brand Legacy Raz connects the founders' lessons to broader entrepreneurial frameworks and parenting analogies. The guests reflect openly on lessons in product-market fit, packaging errors, and internal disagreements.0:01–7:03 · Guest teaching 3/10 Listener Callout: Sharing Favorite Show Episodes Raz demonstrates industry awareness by discussing keto trends and comparing Dang's initial sales to Clif Bar's pandemic pantry loading. Vincent clarifies that after an initial panic-buying spike, on-the-go snack demand plummeted.7:04–14:19 · Guest teaching 3/10 Skyrocketing Freight Costs and Failed Rescue Efforts The guests educate Raz on the exact economic shock of container freight jumping from $5K to $22K and the reality of attempting M&A with SPACs during distress. Raz probes into investor recovery and wind-down decisions with supportive framing.14:28–20:59 · Guest teaching 3/10 Sponsor Break: NetSuite by Oracle Business Management Raz opens with an ad read and transitions into exploring the logistics of winding down. Andrew explains the compounding port delay issue from 7 to 14 weeks before both founders share emotional vulnerabilities.21:00–26:24 · Guest teaching 2/10 Mila Soup Dumplings and a Serendipitous Acquisition Raz facilitates the narrative as Vincent explains investing in Mila dumplings and the serendipitous encounter at an 80s holiday party that saved the Dang brand through Safe Catch.26:42–40:36 · Guest teaching 2/10 Post-Mortem Lessons, Startup Advising, and Brand Legacy Raz connects the founders' lessons to broader entrepreneurial frameworks and parenting analogies. The guests reflect openly on lessons in product-market fit, packaging errors, and internal disagreements.0:01–7:03 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Listener Callout: Sharing Favorite Show Episodes Raz demonstrates industry awareness by discussing keto trends and comparing Dang's initial sales to Clif Bar's pandemic pantry loading. Vincent clarifies that after an initial panic-buying spike, on-the-go snack demand plummeted.7:04–14:19 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Skyrocketing Freight Costs and Failed Rescue Efforts The guests educate Raz on the exact economic shock of container freight jumping from $5K to $22K and the reality of attempting M&A with SPACs during distress. Raz probes into investor recovery and wind-down decisions with supportive framing.14:28–20:59 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Sponsor Break: NetSuite by Oracle Business Management Raz opens with an ad read and transitions into exploring the logistics of winding down. Andrew explains the compounding port delay issue from 7 to 14 weeks before both founders share emotional vulnerabilities.21:00–26:24 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Mila Soup Dumplings and a Serendipitous Acquisition Raz facilitates the narrative as Vincent explains investing in Mila dumplings and the serendipitous encounter at an 80s holiday party that saved the Dang brand through Safe Catch.26:42–40:36 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Post-Mortem Lessons, Startup Advising, and Brand Legacy Raz connects the founders' lessons to broader entrepreneurial frameworks and parenting analogies. The guests reflect openly on lessons in product-market fit, packaging errors, and internal disagreements.0:01–7:03 · Guy pushing back 1/10 Listener Callout: Sharing Favorite Show Episodes Raz demonstrates industry awareness by discussing keto trends and comparing Dang's initial sales to Clif Bar's pandemic pantry loading. Vincent clarifies that after an initial panic-buying spike, on-the-go snack demand plummeted.7:04–14:19 · Guy pushing back 1/10 Skyrocketing Freight Costs and Failed Rescue Efforts The guests educate Raz on the exact economic shock of container freight jumping from $5K to $22K and the reality of attempting M&A with SPACs during distress. Raz probes into investor recovery and wind-down decisions with supportive framing.14:28–20:59 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Sponsor Break: NetSuite by Oracle Business Management Raz opens with an ad read and transitions into exploring the logistics of winding down. Andrew explains the compounding port delay issue from 7 to 14 weeks before both founders share emotional vulnerabilities.21:00–26:24 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Mila Soup Dumplings and a Serendipitous Acquisition Raz facilitates the narrative as Vincent explains investing in Mila dumplings and the serendipitous encounter at an 80s holiday party that saved the Dang brand through Safe Catch.26:42–40:36 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Post-Mortem Lessons, Startup Advising, and Brand Legacy Raz connects the founders' lessons to broader entrepreneurial frameworks and parenting analogies. The guests reflect openly on lessons in product-market fit, packaging errors, and internal disagreements.

speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Guy 100% · guest 0%0:00 · Guy 100% · guest 0%3:00 · Guy 46.5% · guest 53.5%3:00 · Guy 46.5% · guest 53.5%6:00 · Guy 56.8% · guest 43.2%6:00 · Guy 56.8% · guest 43.2%9:00 · Guy 27.8% · guest 72.2%9:00 · Guy 27.8% · guest 72.2%12:00 · Guy 43.5% · guest 56.5%12:00 · Guy 43.5% · guest 56.5%15:00 · Guy 62.1% · guest 37.9%15:00 · Guy 62.1% · guest 37.9%18:00 · Guy 18.8% · guest 81.2%18:00 · Guy 18.8% · guest 81.2%21:00 · Guy 36% · guest 64%21:00 · Guy 36% · guest 64%24:00 · Guy 38.8% · guest 61.2%24:00 · Guy 38.8% · guest 61.2%27:00 · Guy 15.7% · guest 84.3%27:00 · Guy 15.7% · guest 84.3%30:00 · Guy 33.2% · guest 66.8%30:00 · Guy 33.2% · guest 66.8%33:00 · Guy 9.7% · guest 90.3%33:00 · Guy 9.7% · guest 90.3%36:00 · Guy 23.2% · guest 76.8%36:00 · Guy 23.2% · guest 76.8%39:00 · Guy 33.7% · guest 66.3%39:00 · Guy 33.7% · guest 66.3%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 7:15 Explaining the impossibility of 400% price hikes

Andrew firmly clarifies that when container rates increase by over 400%, a company cannot simply pass that on to consumers on grocery shelves.

 Hardest push from Guy ▶ 5:30 Probing on initial pandemic pantry-loading surges

Raz questions the immediate drop in energy bar sales by citing how competitor brands like Clif Bar surged due to stockpiling.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 16:43 Explaining port lag and resulting inventory whiplash

Andrew details how port dwell times doubling to 100 days forced over-ordering, resulting in nine months of trapped capital.

 Guy holds their own ▶ 4:44 Contextualizing the keto diet and market timing

Raz demonstrates industry domain knowledge by citing Bulletproof and articulating why launching a keto bar in 2019 was a strategic move.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicGuy as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementGuy pushing backWhy
Listener Callout: Sharing Favorite Show Episodes 4311 Raz demonstrates industry awareness by discussing keto trends and comparing Dang's initial sales to Clif Bar's pandemic pantry loading. Vincent clarifies that after an initial panic-buying spike, on-the-go snack demand plummeted.
Skyrocketing Freight Costs and Failed Rescue Efforts 3311 The guests educate Raz on the exact economic shock of container freight jumping from $5K to $22K and the reality of attempting M&A with SPACs during distress. Raz probes into investor recovery and wind-down decisions with supportive framing.
Sponsor Break: NetSuite by Oracle Business Management 2300 Raz opens with an ad read and transitions into exploring the logistics of winding down. Andrew explains the compounding port delay issue from 7 to 14 weeks before both founders share emotional vulnerabilities.
Mila Soup Dumplings and a Serendipitous Acquisition 2200 Raz facilitates the narrative as Vincent explains investing in Mila dumplings and the serendipitous encounter at an 80s holiday party that saved the Dang brand through Safe Catch.
Post-Mortem Lessons, Startup Advising, and Brand Legacy 3200 Raz connects the founders' lessons to broader entrepreneurial frameworks and parenting analogies. The guests reflect openly on lessons in product-market fit, packaging errors, and internal disagreements.

Statements from this episode (10)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Dang Foods' freight costs jumped from 5% to 30% of COGS
“Because two of our three product lines are imported from Thailand. And so when your cost of goods, the freight, you know, goes from five percent to 30% that's a big increase.”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 3:07
Assertion Contradicted
Vincent Kitirattragarn claims no keto bars existed on the market in 2019
“At the time, there were no keto bars on the market. We're like, wow, this is such a big opportunity.”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 5:01
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Dang Foods' container costs surged from $5,000 to $22,000 in one month
“So with the container prices going up from five K to 22 K in one month, you can't increase your price on shelf by 400%.”
Andrew Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 7:22
Disclosure
Dang Foods pitched up to 72 potential investors during financial distress
“We went to, I want to say five or six dozen potential investors.”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 9:58
Disclosure
Dang Foods held acquisition talks with nearly 100 brands
“And, you know, we had talked with probably another, you know, close to a hundred brands.”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 12:00
Disclosure
Dang Foods raised over $10 million before its distress sale
“Yeah, so the, you know, we had raised a little above ten million, and the goal was, you know, to try to make them whole, or have that Equity roll over into another entity.”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 13:09
Disclosure
Dang Foods halted inventory orders in 2022 to pay off creditors
“What we decided to do is, with the board's permission, we stopped ordering inventory. Because we didn't see a path forward and that the supply chain at that time was not being alleviated. So we decided that we were going to sell off our assets and have this ti…”
Andrew Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 16:11
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Dang Foods' average port times spiked from 50 to 100 days
“The average time in port also spiked during that time from 50 days to a hundred days, or seven weeks to 14 weeks.”
Andrew Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 16:43
Disclosure
Vincent Kitirattragarn invested in MìLà in 2021 before joining in 2022
“So I actually wrote a check and invested in the company back in 20, 21. And then towards the middle of 2022 I got an update from the founders that, Hey, you know, we're doing really well. We grew 500%. And we're next, we're looking at going into retail. And so…”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 22:26
Assertion Supported
Safe Catch's founder acquired Dang Foods' assets to keep it alive
“It ended up working out where he took over the operations, he bought the assets and he's able to keep the brand going.”
Vincent Kitirattragarn Nov 2, 2023 ▶ 25:01
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