China, every mention
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every year anyone Harry Stebbings 567Rory O'Driscoll 56Jonathan Ross 35Hans Tung 26Matteo Franceschetti 25Anastasios Angelopoulos 24Mitchell Green 22Jason Lemkin 22Crystal Huang 19Peter Singlehurst 17
Verbatim, from the transcripts: the passages where China comes up
Labour, Engineering, Social Media, GrokBots, Cybercabs: 7 Predictions for How AI Changes the World
- ▶ 0:28 Harry Stebbings hardware, having scaled the business to multi-billion dollar valuations, single-digit churn rates, incredible global businesses now open even in China.
- ▶ 18:51 Matteo Franceschetti At scale in 35 countries, including China, including Middle East, including Europe, where there are a lot of regulations in all of them, with a fairly tiny team.
- ▶ 22:13 Matteo Franceschetti And so the Eight Sleep Inc will probably own three, four, five, 10 different businesses, which if you think, and if you look at companies, Chinese companies, it's something they have been doing forever. 6 times in the scene
- ▶ 25:13 Matteo Franceschetti Even more about another factor, I think all the Chinese manufacturers, they will become robotic companies. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 27:51 Harry Stebbings You sell in China. 5 times in the scene
- ▶ 33:10 Matteo Franceschetti Same for China, right? 8 times in the scene
- ▶ 51:49 Matteo Franceschetti Do you know the story of when I had to move to China in the early days for manufacturing, or, or?
- ▶ 57:23 Matteo Franceschetti Tired of, you know, there is pressure at his sleep, and he does artwork, so he needs to go to China, Vietnam, travel all the time, and so he was becoming a personal choice, but he's a hardcore guy, and at the end of the day, he realized…
- ▶ 1:05:41 Matteo Franceschetti Well, China, because there is no, you don't, you don't sell on the website, so we have to reinvent everything.
Jensen Huang Declares AGI Has Arrived | Tesla Launches Cybercabs | Index Pulls Out of Town
- ▶ 29:59 Rory O'Driscoll That's probably, I don't know, the pyramids of the Great Wall of China,
- ▶ 32:44 Jason Lemkin Look, I think if the world was just the United States, it may have some merit, but the Chinese models and the Chinese vendors aren't going along with Sam's plan. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 1:19:25 Jason Lemkin It was hard to see at the time, but when Astra VI came out, the world changed, and it became this and us versus China, right?
ClickHouse CEO: AI Margins Need to Improve | Revenue Concentration Should be a Concern
- ▶ 23:22 Aaron Katz I don't, because I think it, especially in the enterprise, they want provisions and protections that potentially open weight models, especially those that come out of China, cannot provide.
- ▶ 24:47 Harry Stebbings I'm pleased that you said that that you don't agree with that, and actually there will be more concern around using open weight models and potentially Chinese models. 5 times in the scene
- ▶ 43:30 Aaron Katz I flew to China to launch a partnership with Alibaba.
Should American Enterprises Work With Open-Source Chinese Models? | Only 10% of Neo-labs survive
- ▶ 0:45 Eno Reyes Calling open source models Chinese models is a psyop by the Frontier Labs to basically
- ▶ 44:09 Harry Stebbings Um, we always hear about the Chinese open source ecosystem and the questions around security and everything that is in between. 8 times in the scene
- ▶ 51:05 Eno Reyes I think that a lot of people, you know, even with respect to what I said earlier on Chinese models, people are going to buy us.
Anthropic's $30T Assumption & OpenAI Confirms IPO | Why Customer Service & Robotics are Overinflated
- ▶ 6:45 Rory O'Driscoll But if you zoom out a level right now, there's a whole bunch of Chinese open source models that are getting a lot of the token volume, which means they're doing a lot of the compute, even if they're not getting a lot of the margin, right? 3 times in the scene
The AI Bubble WILL Burst | Should we be fearful of Chinese Open-Source | Jerry Murdock
- ▶ 0:28 Harry Stebbings Whether China will beat the frontier models.
- ▶ 51:23 Harry Stebbings Do you worry about the dominance of Chinese open source models and the ability for back doors to be introduced into their models? 2 times in the scene
Uber President on Travis, China & Self-Driving | Why Autonomy Is Existential | How to Beat DoorDash
- ▶ 0:03 Andrew Macdonald (Mac) We were burning fifty two million a week in China. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 27:44 Andrew Macdonald (Mac) And even if you look at what's happened in China, 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 28:09 Andrew Macdonald (Mac) Yeah, we exited our China business in 2016. 8 times in the scene
- ▶ 34:00 Harry Stebbings Speaking of wild and crazy and like China letting US companies do well, China competing, you blew through, what was it, a year's budget for AI in four months. 2 times in the scene
Canva Slashes Growth | Talent Exodus at Google | Revolut's $50B CEO Package | Musk's $55B Terrafab
- ▶ 14:48 Rory O'Driscoll China, obviously, in mobile, has a single super app for everything, and you do everything through WeChat, right?
OpenRouter CEO: Why Chinese Open Models Are Beating the US | Why Enterprises Fear OpenAI & Anthropic
- ▶ 23:26 Harry Stebbings Because a lot of people, when I say, oh, the top five models, when I look at open router are all Chinese.
- ▶ 30:54 Alex Atallah That's not Chinese, um, which will then probably create more American Neolabs. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 33:54 Harry Stebbings Like, these are, these are incredibly secretive organizations in the depths of China.
- ▶ 38:00 Harry Stebbings In 12 months, will the chasm between US open source and Chinese open source be bigger or smaller than it is today? 7 times in the scene
- ▶ 54:34 Harry Stebbings What would you do to encourage, incentivize the open US ecosystem to compete more vociferously with the Chinese?
- ▶ 54:43 Alex Atallah I think I would spend time talking to the current American labs a little bit more to figure out what distilling the Chinese models looks like for them and how effective it is. 4 times in the scene
The AI Boom Will Create Enormous Roadkill: Who Wins & Loses? | David Frankel
- ▶ 1:14:07 David Frankel By the way, what's so fascinating is in the 18 twenties, China was the economic superpower of the world. 6 times in the scene
- ▶ 1:17:06 David Frankel If you look at the amount of money that's being spent in China on energy efficiency and energy research now, I don't think we're spending enough. 3 times in the scene
Leo Aschenbrenner's Situational Awareness Blows Up | Moonshot AI Raises $3.5B at $35B
- ▶ 33:38 Harry Stebbings We said open, we said China, uh, whether we have comment on it, Moonshot closes three and a half billion at a thirty-five billion valuation, and if it's free, you're the product.
Arena CEO: There Will be a $100BN US Open-Source Model & Data is a Trillion Dollar Market
- ▶ 2:54 Anastasios Angelopoulos But what seems to be happening is that the open source models, especially from China, 5 times in the scene
- ▶ 5:56 Anastasios Angelopoulos It's not, you know, it's not like they're being completely cannibalized right now by Chinese open source models. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 12:58 Anastasios Angelopoulos And then they've come up with, yes, the number one American open source, but there's nine Chinese models on top of them. 6 times in the scene
- ▶ 15:30 Anastasios Angelopoulos That value, basically money into America and then crush competition in China?
- ▶ 15:57 Anastasios Angelopoulos China 10 times in the scene
- ▶ 19:02 Harry Stebbings In three years time, will we have restrictions around access to Chinese open models?
- ▶ 22:52 Harry Stebbings We were talking about like Chinese models and fear and security and everything in between.
Jensen's Open-Weights Letter | Google Cloud Grows 82% But The Market Tanks
- ▶ 3:54 Rory O'Driscoll The open, open weight stuff is real, and while in public, um, anthropic are saying we don't want to ban open weight, the truth is the combination of saying we don't want to sell stuff to China, 4 times in the scene
- ▶ 9:28 Rory O'Driscoll The Chinese open source, open rate models were available, and I think they use Kimi or Kuan or one of the newest models to help them figure out what happened, right? 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 14:09 Rory O'Driscoll I'm just trying to disaggregate open weight versus China versus the versus frontier. 4 times in the scene
- ▶ 19:48 Rory O'Driscoll One is don't sell chips to China. 10 times in the scene
- ▶ 37:29 Jason Lemkin It's worries about China.
Mercor Head of Product on Revenue Concentration from Frontier Labs
- ▶ 4:36 Harry Stebbings Am I the only one who sees the irony and we put the sensitive, sensitive data on open source, most likely Chinese models, and we put the HR and procurement data on the closed model?
Should the US Ban Chinese Open-Source Models | OpenRouter's Chance To Sell | Stripe Buying PayPal
- ▶ 0:12 Harry Stebbings So kicking us off, China ships two near-frontier open models in a week, with Kimmy absolutely crushing it.
- ▶ 1:29 Harry Stebbings But I'm gonna start on, uh, the two near frontier open weight models that we saw in the last seven days from China. 5 times in the scene
- ▶ 11:19 Jason Lemkin So having said that, I don't think you're going to convince me there aren't some data export risks with China-based models. 6 times in the scene
- ▶ 33:12 Rory O'Driscoll this is because this is how you access those because I can tell you one thing we can going back to the discussion about open weight models from China. 2 times in the scene
The Open-Source AI Reality | How Token Costs Will Fall 10X & Usage Will Explode 100X | Lin Qiao
- ▶ 19:29 Harry Stebbings When you look at Open Rooster, I think the top six models today are Chinese models, and they're incredible quality. 3 times in the scene
- ▶ 21:18 Harry Stebbings We saw in the last week actually reports that China were looking at actually restricting access to their open models because they were seeing the development being so fast and so good. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 59:30 Harry Stebbings Is that not where you would bet long on China with the greatest of respects? 4 times in the scene
We Built Our Own Salesforce in Months. Here's Why We're Cancelling the $600K Contract | Curative CEO
- ▶ 29:05 Fred Turner But there's this other way of doing it with filter plates, which is more scalable because it's basically just glass and plastic, and you can scale that up faster than you can scale up magnetic beads, where they all come from basically two…
- ▶ 1:21:49 Fred Turner Uh, the only one that is under, like, active construction of those systems is in China, based on a US design from the twenty-tenths that the US stopped working on after Fukushima.
Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Glean Founder · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 12:15 Harry Stebbings Do you not think we're seeing the ultimate commoditization of the model layer when you speak about anthropic open air and the rise of the model layer and the speed with which new models are coming out, especially running from open source… 3 times in the scene
- ▶ 14:06 Harry Stebbings Why would they not be okay with the Chinese model? 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 50:00 unnamed speaker Country in the world, you know, that has produced models outside of US is China. 2 times in the scene
Enterprises Fear Frontier Models | Sam Altman Offers Trump 5% of OpenAI | DeepSeek Builds Own Chips · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 13:55 Harry Stebbings And if I'm going to ask you to regulate, or as you said, Rory, last week, I think quite wisely, maybe tax Chinese or open source models, maybe it'd be helpful if we had alignment beforehand. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 51:33 unnamed speaker For startup foundation, if valuations, AI valuations are, and I don't know this to be true, are going to be meaningfully higher in China than US. 9 times in the scene
Why Now is the Time for the App Layer | Why Startups Should be TokenMaxxing | Mike Mignano, USV · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 25:53 Harry Stebbings China have the best open source models.
Open Models vs Frontier Models: Who Actually Wins? | The $100K Token Budget Every Engineer Will Need · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 14:53 Harry Stebbings We see Chinese models being unbelievably advanced and impressive. 3 times in the scene
Coinbase Cuts AI Spend by 50% | Kalshi's $40B Valuation & Impending IPO | The Year for SaaS Roll-Ups · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 17:23 Harry Stebbings And Rory did not say that Dario has criticized Chinese 12 times in the scene
Bloom Energy CEO: Why We Aren’t in an AI Capex Bubble | Energy Sovereignty & The Future of Power · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 17:45 Harry Stebbings Is there a chance that the US will be left behind because of the regulatory permitting provisions that are in place when viewed in context against, uh, Asia or China in particular, where they have amazing model development,
- ▶ 1:03:37 K.R. Shridhar I was in China.
DeepSeek Raises at $50B | The Rise of Open Source vs OpenAI & Anthropic | OpenAI Builds Own Chip · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 0:00 unnamed speaker Open source is a bit of a fake because China's paying for all the trading, okay? 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 1:07 Harry Stebbings It is so good to have you back from China. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 15:12 unnamed speaker There's so much innovation in open source that number three just might get swamped by all the subsidies of the Chinese government, everything else subsidizing open source, because open source is a bit of a fake because China's paying for… 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 18:40 unnamed speaker Well, we'll answer sovereignty first, and then the impact of China. 13 times in the scene
- ▶ 42:55 unnamed speaker I think why would, listen, obviously coding is uniquely well suited, but we just built an AI VP of finance while we were in China and it's already better than any of the humans on our team. 4 times in the scene
- ▶ 1:27:45 Harry Stebbings It's so good to have you back from China, Jason.
Nikesh Arora on the Frontier Model Problem: Breadth vs Depth | The Future of Token Costs · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 59:22 Harry Stebbings You said the word bad guys is China in many people's eyes, and we see a huge amount of incredible open source models, which are being used extensively today at a much cheaper cost. 3 times in the scene
Flexport CEO: Two Questions Every Founder Needs to Ask · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 0:20 Harry Stebbings I don't think he's ever had a conversation as open and honest as this, where we touched on everything from Chinese open source models, is the CCP a risk?
- ▶ 7:14 Ryan Petersen And one of my tricks actually was I moved to China when I was 25 years old for this company and my rent was 120 dollars a month.
- ▶ 28:50 Harry Stebbings And that essentially is giving a window into Silicon Valley for China. 7 times in the scene
- ▶ 30:37 Harry Stebbings And when I think about China, I, sadly, these days, I think about a mutual friend of ours, Keith Reboig, given his very open concerns around China, and it goes to something you said to me before, which was, going back to kind of venture… 2 times in the scene
Anthropic's Fable Banned by US Government | Wix & Adobe Hit All-Time Lows | Mistral Raising at $20BN · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 0:43 Everett Randle Outside of China, there are basically no good open source models.
- ▶ 26:41 Everett Randle If we think about how powerful a lot of people think AI is going to be and the power of the government to either give or restrict access on a country by country basis or a citizen by citizen basis, it gets pretty freaky from a, from a,…
- ▶ 37:38 Everett Randle Or China or Russia having those capabilities?
- ▶ 42:00 Everett Randle They should, well, I, I, I don't know, I don't know if this is real or not, but I saw in the timeline that Rio, like the city of Rio, uh, in Brazil, apparently, um, you know, like post-trained or fine-tuned, um, a Chinese open-source… 4 times in the scene
- ▶ 1:24:05 unnamed speaker Because, I mean, I know I'm riffing on this now, but someone did a translation, the Unitary, there's a humanoid company, Unitary, that's going public in China, and it's doing five hundred million, it's a real company, it's profitable.
Perplexity CEO: Micron Will Be More Valuable Than Meta & How Export Controls Helped Not Hurt China · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 11:18 Aravind Srinivas Um, it, it works out in China in WeChat because there's no other way for them to fund the whole thing, you know?
- ▶ 44:56 Aravind Srinivas And so, um, but you, you, you gotta make a leap of faith assumption that, you know, like the, the models from China or NVIDIA is making good progress on their models in Lemotron. 2 times in the scene
- ▶ 54:30 Aravind Srinivas But, um, there is a chance that because of that, they now get really good at the physical layer. 5 times in the scene
- ▶ 56:21 Harry Stebbings Given the capabilities of China that we just mentioned that really articulately, I know it's a ridiculous question, but, um, if I were to say to you, your job is to make sure America stays competitive, what would you do to ensure that you… 2 times in the scene
OpenAI vs Anthropic vs Open-Source | Token Maxing, AI Hangovers & The Coming ROI Reckoning · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 1:09:01 Harry Stebbings Should be allowed to operate so extensively on Chinese open source models. 2 times in the scene
SpaceX Launches Largest Ever IPO | OpenAI Files to Go Public | Uber Cuts 23% of HR · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 1:12:58 unnamed speaker I mean, that and the, you know, where are the, I mean, one of the big questions is between Microsoft and then the open source vendors, are the open source vendors, especially, is it going to be a non-Chinese US open source vendor that's…
Nebius Co-Founder on AI Infrastructure Bubbles | How Price Elastic is Demand for Compute · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 50:49 Harry Stebbings Does not have anywhere near the model build out that we've seen both in the U S and in China.
Inside Legora's Tech Stack: Why Token Maxing is Failing Enterprise Startups | Legora CTO · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 28:20 Harry Stebbings A lot of people are worried about open source Chinese models, which is why I was kind of thinking about it.
Anthropic Files to Go Public | Cognition Raises $1BN at $26BN Valuation | The 996 Work Ethic · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 1:33:28 unnamed speaker I was reading the Apple in China book, and then the fifth year history of Apple.
Mercor CEO: Why Application Layer Companies Have No Moat & The Cost of Hiring AI Researchers · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 5:23 Brendan Foody You know, think of one person that's very prominent who's invested in multiple competitors and just, like, made this tweet about how all of our data was getting accessed by China when it was totally untrue.
- ▶ 49:29 Harry Stebbings One, shit, we should just invest all of our money into open AI and Anthropic, and then the realization dawned on me that the majority of startups, and you can shoot me down, again, shoot me down, um, is the majority of startups today,…
- ▶ 1:01:56 Harry Stebbings Do you buy the sovereignty argument of we need sovereign models because we don't want our data going to US or China or wherever that is?
OpenAI & SpaceX S1 Drops | Layoffs at Cloudflare & ClickUp | OpenRouter & Polsia Raise Mega Rounds · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 59:45 unnamed speaker Like we did when the test, the roadster came out, but no one can, outside of China, no one can approach what he's done in EVs.
Cerebras CEO on the Future of Data Centres, Token Costs & Memory | Should US Companies Sell to China · 20VC with Harry Stebbings
- ▶ 0:27 Harry Stebbings Today, we deep dive on the future of chips, the future of US-China relations, the future of data centers and energy.
- ▶ 43:08 Andrew Feldman This is made doubly worse by some of the best open source models were made by Chinese companies.
- ▶ 44:00 Harry Stebbings Do you think we should be selling chips to China as a result? 10 times in the scene
- ▶ 47:18 Harry Stebbings With that, how important is it that we onshore TSMC-like capabilities in companies given Taiwan's vulnerability to China? 3 times in the scene
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