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Feb 18, 2021 · 32m · we-live-to-build

The Warm Intro Hierarchy Investors Won't Tell You About

Emily Lomban · 22m spoken Sean Weisbrot · 7m spoken
0:00 / 0:00
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In this episode of the 'We Live to Build' podcast, host Sean Weisbrot interviews Froget CEO and co-founder Emily to explore SaaS startup growth, fundraising strategies, the evolution of the Spanish tech ecosystem, and the experiences of female entrepreneurs in technology.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Sean holds 27.2% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Sean as informed peer 2.3 Guest teaching 3.2 Guest disagreement 0.4 Sean pushing back 0.4
05100:0010:0020:0030:002:10–5:01 · Sean as informed peer 1/10 Meet Emily and Understanding Froget's SaaS Solution Sean introduces Emily and asks conversational questions about the origins of Froget. Emily shares how she and her cofounders met at a Demium hackathon in Spain.5:01–7:56 · Sean as informed peer 2/10 The Evolution of the Spanish Startup Ecosystem Sean inquires about geographic hubs in Spain, while Emily outlines emerging tech ecosystems including Malaga, Bilbao, and Valencia alongside Madrid and Barcelona.7:56–12:07 · Sean as informed peer 3/10 Navigating Spanish and European Investor Landscapes Sean compares global round sizing between Silicon Valley and Southeast Asia. Emily explains standard Spanish seed rounds and lessons learned from an Israeli immersion program.12:11–14:47 · Sean as informed peer 2/10 Seed Round Outreach Strategy and Relationship Building Emily outlines her pipeline strategy, explaining why touching 80 to 100 investors is essential for closing seed rounds and building long-term relationships.14:48–18:26 · Sean as informed peer 4/10 The Warm Intro Hierarchy and Investor Prospecting Sean shares data from his 100 cold outreach emails. Emily educates him on Nathan Beckert's warm introduction hierarchy, demonstrating why cold emailing has low conversion compared to investor referrals.18:26–22:57 · Sean as informed peer 4/10 Navigating Lead Investor Signaling and Angel Dynamics Sean vents about investor herd mentality rejecting self-funded founders. Emily validates his frustration and explains how lead investors help syndicate partners dilute risk.22:57–27:59 · Sean as informed peer 3/10 Scrutiny and Opportunities for Female Founders in Tech Sean asks about the difficulties faced by female founders and offers sweeping generalizations about bias. Emily provides nuanced pushback, clarifying that scrutiny is subtle rather than overt and framing the situation as an opportunity.27:59–30:59 · Sean as informed peer 2/10 Improving Startup Ecosystems: Matching Efficiency and Policy Emily explains the productivity loss caused by lengthy fundraising cycles and advocates for state policies and automated matchmaking modeled after Israel.30:59–32:19 · Sean as informed peer 0/10 Guest Contact Channels and Host Concluding Remarks Emily shares her contact information and Twitter/LinkedIn channels before Sean delivers standard outro housekeeping.2:10–5:01 · Guest teaching 1/10 Meet Emily and Understanding Froget's SaaS Solution Sean introduces Emily and asks conversational questions about the origins of Froget. Emily shares how she and her cofounders met at a Demium hackathon in Spain.5:01–7:56 · Guest teaching 3/10 The Evolution of the Spanish Startup Ecosystem Sean inquires about geographic hubs in Spain, while Emily outlines emerging tech ecosystems including Malaga, Bilbao, and Valencia alongside Madrid and Barcelona.7:56–12:07 · Guest teaching 4/10 Navigating Spanish and European Investor Landscapes Sean compares global round sizing between Silicon Valley and Southeast Asia. Emily explains standard Spanish seed rounds and lessons learned from an Israeli immersion program.12:11–14:47 · Guest teaching 3/10 Seed Round Outreach Strategy and Relationship Building Emily outlines her pipeline strategy, explaining why touching 80 to 100 investors is essential for closing seed rounds and building long-term relationships.14:48–18:26 · Guest teaching 6/10 The Warm Intro Hierarchy and Investor Prospecting Sean shares data from his 100 cold outreach emails. Emily educates him on Nathan Beckert's warm introduction hierarchy, demonstrating why cold emailing has low conversion compared to investor referrals.18:26–22:57 · Guest teaching 4/10 Navigating Lead Investor Signaling and Angel Dynamics Sean vents about investor herd mentality rejecting self-funded founders. Emily validates his frustration and explains how lead investors help syndicate partners dilute risk.22:57–27:59 · Guest teaching 5/10 Scrutiny and Opportunities for Female Founders in Tech Sean asks about the difficulties faced by female founders and offers sweeping generalizations about bias. Emily provides nuanced pushback, clarifying that scrutiny is subtle rather than overt and framing the situation as an opportunity.27:59–30:59 · Guest teaching 3/10 Improving Startup Ecosystems: Matching Efficiency and Policy Emily explains the productivity loss caused by lengthy fundraising cycles and advocates for state policies and automated matchmaking modeled after Israel.30:59–32:19 · Guest teaching 0/10 Guest Contact Channels and Host Concluding Remarks Emily shares her contact information and Twitter/LinkedIn channels before Sean delivers standard outro housekeeping.2:10–5:01 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Meet Emily and Understanding Froget's SaaS Solution Sean introduces Emily and asks conversational questions about the origins of Froget. Emily shares how she and her cofounders met at a Demium hackathon in Spain.5:01–7:56 · Guest disagreement 0/10 The Evolution of the Spanish Startup Ecosystem Sean inquires about geographic hubs in Spain, while Emily outlines emerging tech ecosystems including Malaga, Bilbao, and Valencia alongside Madrid and Barcelona.7:56–12:07 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Navigating Spanish and European Investor Landscapes Sean compares global round sizing between Silicon Valley and Southeast Asia. Emily explains standard Spanish seed rounds and lessons learned from an Israeli immersion program.12:11–14:47 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Seed Round Outreach Strategy and Relationship Building Emily outlines her pipeline strategy, explaining why touching 80 to 100 investors is essential for closing seed rounds and building long-term relationships.14:48–18:26 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Warm Intro Hierarchy and Investor Prospecting Sean shares data from his 100 cold outreach emails. Emily educates him on Nathan Beckert's warm introduction hierarchy, demonstrating why cold emailing has low conversion compared to investor referrals.18:26–22:57 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Navigating Lead Investor Signaling and Angel Dynamics Sean vents about investor herd mentality rejecting self-funded founders. Emily validates his frustration and explains how lead investors help syndicate partners dilute risk.22:57–27:59 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Scrutiny and Opportunities for Female Founders in Tech Sean asks about the difficulties faced by female founders and offers sweeping generalizations about bias. Emily provides nuanced pushback, clarifying that scrutiny is subtle rather than overt and framing the situation as an opportunity.27:59–30:59 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Improving Startup Ecosystems: Matching Efficiency and Policy Emily explains the productivity loss caused by lengthy fundraising cycles and advocates for state policies and automated matchmaking modeled after Israel.30:59–32:19 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Guest Contact Channels and Host Concluding Remarks Emily shares her contact information and Twitter/LinkedIn channels before Sean delivers standard outro housekeeping.2:10–5:01 · Sean pushing back 0/10 Meet Emily and Understanding Froget's SaaS Solution Sean introduces Emily and asks conversational questions about the origins of Froget. Emily shares how she and her cofounders met at a Demium hackathon in Spain.5:01–7:56 · Sean pushing back 0/10 The Evolution of the Spanish Startup Ecosystem Sean inquires about geographic hubs in Spain, while Emily outlines emerging tech ecosystems including Malaga, Bilbao, and Valencia alongside Madrid and Barcelona.7:56–12:07 · Sean pushing back 0/10 Navigating Spanish and European Investor Landscapes Sean compares global round sizing between Silicon Valley and Southeast Asia. Emily explains standard Spanish seed rounds and lessons learned from an Israeli immersion program.12:11–14:47 · Sean pushing back 0/10 Seed Round Outreach Strategy and Relationship Building Emily outlines her pipeline strategy, explaining why touching 80 to 100 investors is essential for closing seed rounds and building long-term relationships.14:48–18:26 · Sean pushing back 0/10 The Warm Intro Hierarchy and Investor Prospecting Sean shares data from his 100 cold outreach emails. Emily educates him on Nathan Beckert's warm introduction hierarchy, demonstrating why cold emailing has low conversion compared to investor referrals.18:26–22:57 · Sean pushing back 2/10 Navigating Lead Investor Signaling and Angel Dynamics Sean vents about investor herd mentality rejecting self-funded founders. Emily validates his frustration and explains how lead investors help syndicate partners dilute risk.22:57–27:59 · Sean pushing back 2/10 Scrutiny and Opportunities for Female Founders in Tech Sean asks about the difficulties faced by female founders and offers sweeping generalizations about bias. Emily provides nuanced pushback, clarifying that scrutiny is subtle rather than overt and framing the situation as an opportunity.27:59–30:59 · Sean pushing back 0/10 Improving Startup Ecosystems: Matching Efficiency and Policy Emily explains the productivity loss caused by lengthy fundraising cycles and advocates for state policies and automated matchmaking modeled after Israel.30:59–32:19 · Sean pushing back 0/10 Guest Contact Channels and Host Concluding Remarks Emily shares her contact information and Twitter/LinkedIn channels before Sean delivers standard outro housekeeping.

speaking balance: gold is Sean, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Sean 84% · guest 16%0:00 · Sean 84% · guest 16%3:00 · Sean 15.1% · guest 84.9%3:00 · Sean 15.1% · guest 84.9%6:00 · Sean 15.9% · guest 84.1%6:00 · Sean 15.9% · guest 84.1%9:00 · Sean 24.4% · guest 75.6%9:00 · Sean 24.4% · guest 75.6%12:00 · Sean 16.9% · guest 83.1%12:00 · Sean 16.9% · guest 83.1%15:00 · Sean 23.8% · guest 76.2%15:00 · Sean 23.8% · guest 76.2%18:00 · Sean 33.3% · guest 66.7%18:00 · Sean 33.3% · guest 66.7%21:00 · Sean 30.8% · guest 69.2%21:00 · Sean 30.8% · guest 69.2%24:00 · Sean 6.2% · guest 93.8%24:00 · Sean 6.2% · guest 93.8%27:00 · Sean 20.9% · guest 79.1%27:00 · Sean 20.9% · guest 79.1%30:00 · Sean 28.1% · guest 71.9%30:00 · Sean 28.1% · guest 71.9%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 25:41 Emily nuances host's claim on strict scrutiny

Emily gently rejects Sean's premise that investors are overtly strict or hostile to female founders, explaining that investor observation is subtle and focused on leadership dynamics rather than overt resistance.

 Hardest push from Sean ▶ 18:26 Sean challenges investor prejudice against bootstrapping

Sean strongly criticizes investor logic that demands prior institutional backing, arguing that penalizing self-funded founders who de-risked their own startup is illogical.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 15:43 The warm introduction hierarchy framework

After Sean describes cold emailing 100 investors with poor results, Emily teaches him Nathan Beckert's structured framework of warm introduction tiers that drastically improve conversion.

 Sean holds their own ▶ 14:47 Sean presents quantitative investor outreach metrics

Sean demonstrates domain knowledge by presenting exact funnel statistics from his own seed round outreach, breaking down the 100 pitches into distinct response categories.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicSean as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementSean pushing backWhy
Meet Emily and Understanding Froget's SaaS Solution 1100 Sean introduces Emily and asks conversational questions about the origins of Froget. Emily shares how she and her cofounders met at a Demium hackathon in Spain.
The Evolution of the Spanish Startup Ecosystem 2300 Sean inquires about geographic hubs in Spain, while Emily outlines emerging tech ecosystems including Malaga, Bilbao, and Valencia alongside Madrid and Barcelona.
Navigating Spanish and European Investor Landscapes 3400 Sean compares global round sizing between Silicon Valley and Southeast Asia. Emily explains standard Spanish seed rounds and lessons learned from an Israeli immersion program.
Seed Round Outreach Strategy and Relationship Building 2300 Emily outlines her pipeline strategy, explaining why touching 80 to 100 investors is essential for closing seed rounds and building long-term relationships.
The Warm Intro Hierarchy and Investor Prospecting 4610 Sean shares data from his 100 cold outreach emails. Emily educates him on Nathan Beckert's warm introduction hierarchy, demonstrating why cold emailing has low conversion compared to investor referrals.
Navigating Lead Investor Signaling and Angel Dynamics 4412 Sean vents about investor herd mentality rejecting self-funded founders. Emily validates his frustration and explains how lead investors help syndicate partners dilute risk.
Scrutiny and Opportunities for Female Founders in Tech 3522 Sean asks about the difficulties faced by female founders and offers sweeping generalizations about bias. Emily provides nuanced pushback, clarifying that scrutiny is subtle rather than overt and framing the situation as an opportunity.
Improving Startup Ecosystems: Matching Efficiency and Policy 2300 Emily explains the productivity loss caused by lengthy fundraising cycles and advocates for state policies and automated matchmaking modeled after Israel.
Guest Contact Channels and Host Concluding Remarks 0000 Emily shares her contact information and Twitter/LinkedIn channels before Sean delivers standard outro housekeeping.

Statements from this episode (12)

Opinion
Lomban: Barcelona Leads Spanish Startups as Regional Hubs Rise
“For sure, Barcelona, but I would say it's like the most startup city of Spain, but it's true that, of course, Madrid has a lot of, I mean, is a big area for startups, but more and more, there are all the cities like Valencia, which is also Spain on the, and th…”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 7:02
Assertion Supported
Lomban: Most startup investors in Spain are domestic
“Basically, I would say that most of the investors ecosystem here is from Spain itself.”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 8:13
Assertion Supported
Lomban: Post-early-stage Spanish startup capital comes from pan-European funds
“And then afterwards is more pan-European funds or funds which are very related to the other European countries.”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 9:21
Assertion Partly supported
Lomban: Spanish Seed Rounds Typically Range From €150k to €500k
“It is true that if we are based in Spain, we normally rise to 150 to 500, maybe a seed round.”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 10:54
Insight
Lomban: Founders Must Pitch 80 to 100 Investors to Close a Round
“Top of the funnel, which is the number of inverses. That we should be touching in order to get these three, four yeses at the very end and closing the round. Yeah, at least those 80 to 100 or a little bit more than that, I think is the right number.”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 12:58
Disclosure
Lomban: Froged contacted over 100 investors during its funding round
“Yes, 100, around 100. So we contacted a bit more than that, but knowing that some of them are mostly for the next round”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 14:30
Disclosure
Weisbrot: 75 of 100 Cold-Emailed VCs Ignored Three Successive Emails
“I cold emailed like a hundred of them. I would say about 75 of them. They didn't answer the first email. They didn't answer the second email. They didn't answer the third email. I stopped emailing.”
Sean Weisbrot Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 15:14
Insight
Lomban: The Best VC Intro Comes From a Successful Co-Investor
“The best introduction that you can get is from another investor who has co-invested with them and has been successful in that investment. Then the next is an investor, which they are close with, but you can also be introduced for sample by another startup. Whi…”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 16:28
Insight
Lomban: Founders Must Engage Investors in Parallel Cohorts
“You should be moving like groups of investors, not just one investor and another one individually, because they normally look for who else is investing or who is leading the investment round.”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 21:20
Insight
Lomban: Angel Investors Give Founders Far More Freedom Than VCs
“And you have more freedom because that's also another big difference from, you know, when you have business angels or private investors versus VCs that normally are more, you know, you have more limitations or you are, you have more rules to follow. And as an …”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 22:29
Insight
Lomban: Female founders stand out and stay top of mind for investors
“Because it's easier being a female. At least they remember you know, and this is something I value very much. You know, at least you're in, you could be top of the mind because they know you.”
Emily Lomban Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 23:44
Opinion
Weisbrot: Female Founders Are Much Better at Running Companies Than Men
“Like it is evident to me that female founders are much better at running companies than men.”
Sean Weisbrot Feb 18, 2021 ▶ 25:35
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