Kirk Simpson, co-founder and CEO of Wave, explains financial metrics and unit economics in payments businesses to host Nathan Latka.
0:00 / 0:44exact quote · 44.6s
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“Essentially in our business, because we're paying out to Visa and MasterCard and Amex on our payments revenue,
It's important to not look at the gross revenue, but instead to the net, right?
And to like take lifetime times by your net revenue to get a true view of LTV.
Now, some people, listen, there's a lot of companies that are valuing growth at all costs, and they'll look at the gross revenue, and they'll paint a really nice picture of the LTV to CAC.
We just don't think that's sustainable, and so we look at that gross margin LTV, and then on the flip side, we also look at fully loaded CAC, so not just the cost of what we pay Google for SEM, but what about the salaries?
What about the content that we're producing?
All that kind of stuff, and that is what we view to be the important metric.”
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Insight
Marketing teams neglect organic acquisition once paid channels are introduced
“Once you allow your marketing team to start using paid marketing as a channel, you will watch them spend all of their time optimizing that paid channel. And almost no time optimizing on organic.”
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Disclosure
Kirk Simpson: Wave shifted from Stripe to in-house infrastructure as it scaled
“Our payments business, for instance, was built on top of Stripe. We get to a point of scale and quite frankly, our users want us to deeply integrate it. And so most of this stuff over time, we've been building ourselves.”
Kirk SimpsonMar 9, 2019▶ 3:101323 How FinTech Company Wave Is Deploying $100m in Capital, $25m+ in ARR
Insight
10% to 15% of SMB churn is uncontrollable business failure
“In small business, you're going to have, to your point before, you're going to have 10 to 15% that are going to naturally go out of business.”
Kirk SimpsonMar 9, 2019▶ 7:351323 How FinTech Company Wave Is Deploying $100m in Capital, $25m+ in ARR
Disclosure
Wave maintains monthly gross logo churn below 2%
“Yeah, we're seeing that we're below two percent.”
Kirk SimpsonMar 9, 2019▶ 8:101323 How FinTech Company Wave Is Deploying $100m in Capital, $25m+ in ARR
AssertionNot checkable as stated
Wave has nearly 200 employees and zero sales reps
“We're closing in on 200 people in the company. We don't have a single sales rep that works here. Not an inside sales rep, not an outside sales rep.”
Kirk SimpsonMar 9, 2019▶ 8:471323 How FinTech Company Wave Is Deploying $100m in Capital, $25m+ in ARR
AssertionNot checkable as stated
Wave freemium users sometimes take 24 months to convert to paid
“And you know, the interesting thing that we see Nathan is that we'll get some people to be paying in the first month. And then we'll have others who are using the free platform for 24 months, and on the 25th month, convert into pay.”
Kirk SimpsonMar 9, 2019▶ 10:391323 How FinTech Company Wave Is Deploying $100m in Capital, $25m+ in ARR
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