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Dec 1, 2016 · 23m · top-founders

EP 495: WebEx Killer +$5M In Revenue, 1.7M Users For Better Online Meetings with BusinessHangouts CEO Gary Guseinov

Gary Guseinov · 12m spoken Nathan Latka · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The Top Podcast, host Nathan Latka interviews Business Hangouts CEO Gary Guseinov about acquiring the platform for under $1 million and bootstrapping it to 10,000 paying customers. Gary shares his SaaS metrics, freemium conversion playbook, and the strategic advantages of running a capital-efficient, remote company after leading a NASDAQ-listed public firm.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 41.3% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 6.0 Guest teaching 5.0 Guest disagreement 3.0 Nathan pushing back 5.0
05100:0010:0020:001:24–5:35 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Introducing Gary Guseinov and Business Hangouts Platform Gary recounts his entrepreneurial background, including taking US Tech Support public on NASDAQ and scaling AnchorFree. Nathan asks inquisitive questions about the public listing process, allowing Gary to detail the hidden legal and accounting burdens of an IPO.5:35–9:01 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Acquisition of Business Hangouts and Freemium Conversion Strategy Nathan probes into the acquisition metrics and presses Gary to state his paying customer count when Gary tries to be vague. Gary explains his product packaging strategy of bundling web conferencing and webinars to remove buyer friction.9:01–14:37 · Nathan as informed peer 7/10 Pricing Models, MRR Estimation, and Stealth Competitive Positioning Nathan calculates an estimated $700K MRR and repeatedly pushes back when Gary demurs due to investor inquiries and stealth competitive reasons. Gary firmly defends staying below the radar while Nathan argues that transparency attracts better deals and partnerships.14:37–19:18 · Nathan as informed peer 8/10 Unit Economics, Sales Demos, and Distributed Team Operations Nathan scrutinizes the unit economics of offering live demos on low-ACV subscriptions and directly calls out Gary when he claims a customer acquisition cost of zero. Nathan forces a fully weighted calculation including sales salaries, bringing CAC to $30-40.1:24–5:35 · Guest teaching 5/10 Introducing Gary Guseinov and Business Hangouts Platform Gary recounts his entrepreneurial background, including taking US Tech Support public on NASDAQ and scaling AnchorFree. Nathan asks inquisitive questions about the public listing process, allowing Gary to detail the hidden legal and accounting burdens of an IPO.5:35–9:01 · Guest teaching 5/10 Acquisition of Business Hangouts and Freemium Conversion Strategy Nathan probes into the acquisition metrics and presses Gary to state his paying customer count when Gary tries to be vague. Gary explains his product packaging strategy of bundling web conferencing and webinars to remove buyer friction.9:01–14:37 · Guest teaching 6/10 Pricing Models, MRR Estimation, and Stealth Competitive Positioning Nathan calculates an estimated $700K MRR and repeatedly pushes back when Gary demurs due to investor inquiries and stealth competitive reasons. Gary firmly defends staying below the radar while Nathan argues that transparency attracts better deals and partnerships.14:37–19:18 · Guest teaching 4/10 Unit Economics, Sales Demos, and Distributed Team Operations Nathan scrutinizes the unit economics of offering live demos on low-ACV subscriptions and directly calls out Gary when he claims a customer acquisition cost of zero. Nathan forces a fully weighted calculation including sales salaries, bringing CAC to $30-40.1:24–5:35 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Introducing Gary Guseinov and Business Hangouts Platform Gary recounts his entrepreneurial background, including taking US Tech Support public on NASDAQ and scaling AnchorFree. Nathan asks inquisitive questions about the public listing process, allowing Gary to detail the hidden legal and accounting burdens of an IPO.5:35–9:01 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Acquisition of Business Hangouts and Freemium Conversion Strategy Nathan probes into the acquisition metrics and presses Gary to state his paying customer count when Gary tries to be vague. Gary explains his product packaging strategy of bundling web conferencing and webinars to remove buyer friction.9:01–14:37 · Guest disagreement 5/10 Pricing Models, MRR Estimation, and Stealth Competitive Positioning Nathan calculates an estimated $700K MRR and repeatedly pushes back when Gary demurs due to investor inquiries and stealth competitive reasons. Gary firmly defends staying below the radar while Nathan argues that transparency attracts better deals and partnerships.14:37–19:18 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Unit Economics, Sales Demos, and Distributed Team Operations Nathan scrutinizes the unit economics of offering live demos on low-ACV subscriptions and directly calls out Gary when he claims a customer acquisition cost of zero. Nathan forces a fully weighted calculation including sales salaries, bringing CAC to $30-40.1:24–5:35 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Introducing Gary Guseinov and Business Hangouts Platform Gary recounts his entrepreneurial background, including taking US Tech Support public on NASDAQ and scaling AnchorFree. Nathan asks inquisitive questions about the public listing process, allowing Gary to detail the hidden legal and accounting burdens of an IPO.5:35–9:01 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Acquisition of Business Hangouts and Freemium Conversion Strategy Nathan probes into the acquisition metrics and presses Gary to state his paying customer count when Gary tries to be vague. Gary explains his product packaging strategy of bundling web conferencing and webinars to remove buyer friction.9:01–14:37 · Nathan pushing back 8/10 Pricing Models, MRR Estimation, and Stealth Competitive Positioning Nathan calculates an estimated $700K MRR and repeatedly pushes back when Gary demurs due to investor inquiries and stealth competitive reasons. Gary firmly defends staying below the radar while Nathan argues that transparency attracts better deals and partnerships.14:37–19:18 · Nathan pushing back 7/10 Unit Economics, Sales Demos, and Distributed Team Operations Nathan scrutinizes the unit economics of offering live demos on low-ACV subscriptions and directly calls out Gary when he claims a customer acquisition cost of zero. Nathan forces a fully weighted calculation including sales salaries, bringing CAC to $30-40.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 72.3% · guest 27.7%0:00 · Nathan 72.3% · guest 27.7%3:00 · Nathan 13.9% · guest 86.1%3:00 · Nathan 13.9% · guest 86.1%6:00 · Nathan 16.7% · guest 83.3%6:00 · Nathan 16.7% · guest 83.3%9:00 · Nathan 30.3% · guest 69.7%9:00 · Nathan 30.3% · guest 69.7%12:00 · Nathan 33% · guest 67%12:00 · Nathan 33% · guest 67%15:00 · Nathan 35.3% · guest 64.7%15:00 · Nathan 35.3% · guest 64.7%18:00 · Nathan 73.7% · guest 26.3%18:00 · Nathan 73.7% · guest 26.3%21:00 · Nathan 63.8% · guest 36.2%21:00 · Nathan 63.8% · guest 36.2%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 12:50 Gary refuses revenue disclosure citing competitive secrecy

Gary rejects Nathan's attempts to validate a $700K MRR figure, standing firm that disclosing numbers to competitors like GoToMeeting could jeopardize his business.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 12:34 Nathan challenges Gary's refusal to validate MRR

Nathan directly calls out Gary's conflicting statements about investor interest and presses him to confirm where his $700K MRR estimate is wrong.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 4:29 Gary breaks down the realities of going public

Gary educates Nathan on the unforeseen complexities of IPO preparation, including massive legal fees, internal controls, and tight SEC scrutiny.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 18:19 Nathan corrects Gary's customer acquisition cost assertion

Nathan immediately catches the flaw in Gary claiming a $0 CAC while employing staff to conduct product demos, forcing Gary to concede a fully weighted figure of $30 to $40.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Gary Guseinov and Business Hangouts Platform 4511 Gary recounts his entrepreneurial background, including taking US Tech Support public on NASDAQ and scaling AnchorFree. Nathan asks inquisitive questions about the public listing process, allowing Gary to detail the hidden legal and accounting burdens of an IPO.
Acquisition of Business Hangouts and Freemium Conversion Strategy 5524 Nathan probes into the acquisition metrics and presses Gary to state his paying customer count when Gary tries to be vague. Gary explains his product packaging strategy of bundling web conferencing and webinars to remove buyer friction.
Pricing Models, MRR Estimation, and Stealth Competitive Positioning 7658 Nathan calculates an estimated $700K MRR and repeatedly pushes back when Gary demurs due to investor inquiries and stealth competitive reasons. Gary firmly defends staying below the radar while Nathan argues that transparency attracts better deals and partnerships.
Unit Economics, Sales Demos, and Distributed Team Operations 8447 Nathan scrutinizes the unit economics of offering live demos on low-ACV subscriptions and directly calls out Gary when he claims a customer acquisition cost of zero. Nathan forces a fully weighted calculation including sales salaries, bringing CAC to $30-40.

Statements from this episode (12)

Assertion Contradicted
Gary Guseinov raised nearly $100 million for U.S. Tech Support
“I've raised close to seventy million plus, about close to a hundred million actually for this company.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 2:51
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Gary Guseinov scaled AnchorFree revenue to $20 million in 18 months
“I helped them go from three hundred million users to four hundred million users. Grew revenues from zero to twenty million a year in about 18 months.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 4:04
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Preparing for an IPO costs $500,000 to $1 million in upfront fees
“You've spent probably close to half a million to a million dollars just getting the company ready to go public.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 4:37
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Business Hangouts had 1.7 million users when Gary Guseinov acquired it
“It had over 1.7 million enterprise users, so these are people who, who've downloaded the application, installed it in their Google account. And it had, has over 700,000 registered users and has 70,000 enterprise users.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 5:52
Insight
Separating webinar and conferencing tiers frustrates customers despite boosting ARPU
“Our competitors separate products such as web webinars and web conferencing are usually two different subscriptions. And there's also a lot of limitation. There's a lot of limitation on participants, limitation on presenters, and so they bifurcate the, you kno…”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 7:05
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Most Business Hangouts customers choose the $63 to $79 Pro Plan
“Most of our customers choose the, ah, what's called the Business Hangouts Pro Plan, which is 63 dollars per month if it's billed annually, and, ah, if it's billed on a month-to-month basis, it's only 79 dollars, and that allows you to have up to a hundred atte…”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 9:09
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Business Hangouts maintains an annual customer churn rate under 10 percent
“Our churn is less than 10%.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 14:54
Disclosure
Gary Guseinov acquired Business Hangouts for less than $1 million
“No, it's, it was less than a million dollars.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 15:32
Disclosure
Business Hangouts is entirely self-funded with zero outside capital
“We're so purely self-funded. No, no outside capital.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 17:35
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Fully weighted customer acquisition cost for Business Hangouts is under $40
“It's minimal. It's an, you know, less than, it's a less than 30 to 40 dollars.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 18:35
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Business Hangouts acquires 100 percent of its users organically without paid marketing
“All of our users are acquired organically. We don't go out any marketing.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 18:42
Disclosure
Business Hangouts operates with a total team of fewer than 10 employees
“We're less than 10.”
Gary Guseinov Dec 1, 2016 ▶ 18:54
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