Oct 27, 2018 · 16m · top-founders

1190 The 1 Metric GitLab CEO Follows Thats Driven $10m+ in ARR

Nathan Latka · 7m spoken Sid Sijbrandij · 6m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this interview with Nathan Latka, GitLab CEO Sid Sijbrandij details how the company scales between $10 million and $100 million in ARR by doubling Incremental ACV, maintaining an all-remote workforce, and leveraging an open-core DevOps business model.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 51.6% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.2 Guest teaching 4.8 Guest disagreement 2.6 Nathan pushing back 3.8
05100:0010:001:34–4:02 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Founding GitLab and Open Source Stewardship Nathan probes Sid about whether GitLab is really his baby given the employee count timeline. Sid clarifies that while his co-founder Dimitri started the open-source project, Sid founded the commercial entity from employee one. The rest of the exchange is collaborative as they discuss open-source stewardship and Matt Mullenweg joining the board.4:03–7:35 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 GitLab Open-Core Model and Tiered Pricing Nathan drills into the tiering structure, average monthly seat price, and organization sizes. Sid walks through the hybrid sales motion, explaining that seat counts skew small while enterprise contracts over 1,000 seats drive the bulk of revenue. The tone remains polite and informative.7:35–10:26 · Nathan as informed peer 3/10 Focusing on Incremental ACV Over ARR Nathan estimates GitLab is doing $10M/month based on multiplying seat counts, which Sid immediately dismisses as not even in the same ballpark. Sid then educates Nathan on why GitLab ignores ARR as a vanity metric in favor of tracking and doubling incremental ACV year-over-year.10:28–13:18 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Measuring Incremental ACV in Enterprise Sales Nathan tries to offer a concrete numerical example of incremental ACV, but Sid interrupts to correct the math to reflect doubling the net-new added growth rather than total contract size. Nathan pushes back to ensure they are aligned on the measurement framework before transitioning into churn, 175% net expansion, and payback periods.13:18–15:55 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Venture Funding, Distributed Workforce, and Revenue Scale Nathan asks how GitLab deployed over $40M in capital, surprised to learn only Sid occupies their SF office while 270 employees work remotely. Nathan pushes Sid to pin down their ARR bracket, which Sid bounds between $10M and $100M before moving into the Famous Five questions.1:34–4:02 · Guest teaching 4/10 Founding GitLab and Open Source Stewardship Nathan probes Sid about whether GitLab is really his baby given the employee count timeline. Sid clarifies that while his co-founder Dimitri started the open-source project, Sid founded the commercial entity from employee one. The rest of the exchange is collaborative as they discuss open-source stewardship and Matt Mullenweg joining the board.4:03–7:35 · Guest teaching 3/10 GitLab Open-Core Model and Tiered Pricing Nathan drills into the tiering structure, average monthly seat price, and organization sizes. Sid walks through the hybrid sales motion, explaining that seat counts skew small while enterprise contracts over 1,000 seats drive the bulk of revenue. The tone remains polite and informative.7:35–10:26 · Guest teaching 8/10 Focusing on Incremental ACV Over ARR Nathan estimates GitLab is doing $10M/month based on multiplying seat counts, which Sid immediately dismisses as not even in the same ballpark. Sid then educates Nathan on why GitLab ignores ARR as a vanity metric in favor of tracking and doubling incremental ACV year-over-year.10:28–13:18 · Guest teaching 6/10 Measuring Incremental ACV in Enterprise Sales Nathan tries to offer a concrete numerical example of incremental ACV, but Sid interrupts to correct the math to reflect doubling the net-new added growth rather than total contract size. Nathan pushes back to ensure they are aligned on the measurement framework before transitioning into churn, 175% net expansion, and payback periods.13:18–15:55 · Guest teaching 3/10 Venture Funding, Distributed Workforce, and Revenue Scale Nathan asks how GitLab deployed over $40M in capital, surprised to learn only Sid occupies their SF office while 270 employees work remotely. Nathan pushes Sid to pin down their ARR bracket, which Sid bounds between $10M and $100M before moving into the Famous Five questions.1:34–4:02 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Founding GitLab and Open Source Stewardship Nathan probes Sid about whether GitLab is really his baby given the employee count timeline. Sid clarifies that while his co-founder Dimitri started the open-source project, Sid founded the commercial entity from employee one. The rest of the exchange is collaborative as they discuss open-source stewardship and Matt Mullenweg joining the board.4:03–7:35 · Guest disagreement 1/10 GitLab Open-Core Model and Tiered Pricing Nathan drills into the tiering structure, average monthly seat price, and organization sizes. Sid walks through the hybrid sales motion, explaining that seat counts skew small while enterprise contracts over 1,000 seats drive the bulk of revenue. The tone remains polite and informative.7:35–10:26 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Focusing on Incremental ACV Over ARR Nathan estimates GitLab is doing $10M/month based on multiplying seat counts, which Sid immediately dismisses as not even in the same ballpark. Sid then educates Nathan on why GitLab ignores ARR as a vanity metric in favor of tracking and doubling incremental ACV year-over-year.10:28–13:18 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Measuring Incremental ACV in Enterprise Sales Nathan tries to offer a concrete numerical example of incremental ACV, but Sid interrupts to correct the math to reflect doubling the net-new added growth rather than total contract size. Nathan pushes back to ensure they are aligned on the measurement framework before transitioning into churn, 175% net expansion, and payback periods.13:18–15:55 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Venture Funding, Distributed Workforce, and Revenue Scale Nathan asks how GitLab deployed over $40M in capital, surprised to learn only Sid occupies their SF office while 270 employees work remotely. Nathan pushes Sid to pin down their ARR bracket, which Sid bounds between $10M and $100M before moving into the Famous Five questions.1:34–4:02 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Founding GitLab and Open Source Stewardship Nathan probes Sid about whether GitLab is really his baby given the employee count timeline. Sid clarifies that while his co-founder Dimitri started the open-source project, Sid founded the commercial entity from employee one. The rest of the exchange is collaborative as they discuss open-source stewardship and Matt Mullenweg joining the board.4:03–7:35 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 GitLab Open-Core Model and Tiered Pricing Nathan drills into the tiering structure, average monthly seat price, and organization sizes. Sid walks through the hybrid sales motion, explaining that seat counts skew small while enterprise contracts over 1,000 seats drive the bulk of revenue. The tone remains polite and informative.7:35–10:26 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Focusing on Incremental ACV Over ARR Nathan estimates GitLab is doing $10M/month based on multiplying seat counts, which Sid immediately dismisses as not even in the same ballpark. Sid then educates Nathan on why GitLab ignores ARR as a vanity metric in favor of tracking and doubling incremental ACV year-over-year.10:28–13:18 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Measuring Incremental ACV in Enterprise Sales Nathan tries to offer a concrete numerical example of incremental ACV, but Sid interrupts to correct the math to reflect doubling the net-new added growth rather than total contract size. Nathan pushes back to ensure they are aligned on the measurement framework before transitioning into churn, 175% net expansion, and payback periods.13:18–15:55 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Venture Funding, Distributed Workforce, and Revenue Scale Nathan asks how GitLab deployed over $40M in capital, surprised to learn only Sid occupies their SF office while 270 employees work remotely. Nathan pushes Sid to pin down their ARR bracket, which Sid bounds between $10M and $100M before moving into the Famous Five questions.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 74% · guest 26%0:00 · Nathan 74% · guest 26%3:00 · Nathan 31.4% · guest 68.6%3:00 · Nathan 31.4% · guest 68.6%6:00 · Nathan 26.4% · guest 73.6%6:00 · Nathan 26.4% · guest 73.6%9:00 · Nathan 70.5% · guest 29.5%9:00 · Nathan 70.5% · guest 29.5%12:00 · Nathan 46.7% · guest 53.3%12:00 · Nathan 46.7% · guest 53.3%15:00 · Nathan 63.4% · guest 36.6%15:00 · Nathan 63.4% · guest 36.6%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 7:43 Sid bluntly shoots down Nathan's revenue extrapolation

When Nathan asserts that 500k seats at $19 yields nearly $10M/month in MRR, Sid flatly denies it, stating the estimate is far too aggressive and not even in the same ballpark.

Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 11:22 Nathan insists on pinning down the measurement methodology

After Sid rejects Nathan's hypothetical doubling scenario, Nathan re-asserts his question, pushing to establish the exact underlying metric mechanics rather than arguing over specific multiplier targets.

Biggest teaching moment ▶ 8:07 Sid explains why ARR is a vanity metric compared to Incremental ACV

Sid breaks down the compounding math of doubling incremental ACV versus simple ARR doubling, showing why standard top-line SaaS growth metrics mask true sales trajectory.

Nathan holds their own ▶ 12:15 Nathan cross-examines net expansion and payback period mechanics

Nathan demonstrates strong SaaS fluency by clarifying whether the 175% expansion figure is truly net of churn and immediately distinguishing between cash-basis zero-day payback and 12-month revenue recognition.

the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Founding GitLab and Open Source Stewardship 5423 Nathan probes Sid about whether GitLab is really his baby given the employee count timeline. Sid clarifies that while his co-founder Dimitri started the open-source project, Sid founded the commercial entity from employee one. The rest of the exchange is collaborative as they discuss open-source stewardship and Matt Mullenweg joining the board.
GitLab Open-Core Model and Tiered Pricing 4313 Nathan drills into the tiering structure, average monthly seat price, and organization sizes. Sid walks through the hybrid sales motion, explaining that seat counts skew small while enterprise contracts over 1,000 seats drive the bulk of revenue. The tone remains polite and informative.
Focusing on Incremental ACV Over ARR 3844 Nathan estimates GitLab is doing $10M/month based on multiplying seat counts, which Sid immediately dismisses as not even in the same ballpark. Sid then educates Nathan on why GitLab ignores ARR as a vanity metric in favor of tracking and doubling incremental ACV year-over-year.
Measuring Incremental ACV in Enterprise Sales 5645 Nathan tries to offer a concrete numerical example of incremental ACV, but Sid interrupts to correct the math to reflect doubling the net-new added growth rather than total contract size. Nathan pushes back to ensure they are aligned on the measurement framework before transitioning into churn, 175% net expansion, and payback periods.
Venture Funding, Distributed Workforce, and Revenue Scale 4324 Nathan asks how GitLab deployed over $40M in capital, surprised to learn only Sid occupies their SF office while 270 employees work remotely. Nathan pushes Sid to pin down their ARR bracket, which Sid bounds between $10M and $100M before moving into the Famous Five questions.

Statements from this episode (16)

Insight
Sijbrandij: Open source communities accept monetization if stewarded properly
“I don't think that open source communities are against dollar signs, but what they do want to see is you being a good steward of the project and acting in the interest of the project. And that's a balance. That's a balance between things that generate revenue,…”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 2:48
Assertion Supported
Sijbrandij: GitLab employs 150 engineers, leads open-source project contributions
“Yes, we have a 150 engineers and we're by far the largest contributor to the project.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 3:47
Disclosure
Sijbrandij: GitLab's most popular paid tier is $19 per user monthly
“So the most popular one is the middle one of 19 dollars per user per month.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 4:32
Disclosure
GitLab's majority revenue comes from organizations with over 1,000 employees
“If I look like, where does the majority of our revenue come from? It's over a thousand people.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 5:23
Assertion Not publicly verifiable
GitLab converts 5,000 of 100,000 total free organizations to paid users
“So there's over a 100,000 organizations with millions of users using GitLab. Most are on the open source edition, but we've got over 5000 organizations, mostly the larger ones, paying us for one of our proprietary versions.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 6:44
Assertion Not checkable as stated
New GitLab buyers increasingly purchase directly without first using open source
“It used to be like that, that most of the people were coming in already using the open source, but we're seeing more and more people that have not used GitLab before that really want to modernize their DevOps workflow. They want to modernize how they do engine…”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 7:16
Assertion Not checkable as stated
GitLab doubled its incremental ACV every year for five straight years
“In the last five years, we've doubled our incremental ACV every single year, and we're on track to do that.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 7:59
Insight
Sijbrandij: ARR is a vanity metric; track incremental ACV instead
“I think ARR is, is a vanity graph. If you're a subscription business, you should look at incremental ACV and that's the number we use throughout the company.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 10:37
Disclosure
GitLab ignores deal size and targets doubling incremental ACV yearly
“So sales speech in sales, we don't talk about deal size. Like even it's a multi-year deal, even if it's all cash upfront, we look at that. Incremental ACV number for any deal. If it's just a renewal, you didn't actually gain anything. So we try to do that thro…”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 10:47
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Sijbrandij: GitLab retains well over 90% of customer logos
“We have way more than 90% of the people staying with us.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 12:10
Assertion Not checkable as stated
GitLab achieves net revenue expansion exceeding 175% year over year
“Now, on a net expansion basis, it's over one 75%. So if they spend a hundred dollars with us last year, they're going to spend a 175 dollars with us this year, the same cohort.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 12:20
Disclosure
Sijbrandij: GitLab targets zero-day cash CAC payback
“We try to keep our payback period on a cash basis to like zero days. As soon as the deal is signed, it should be paid back, and on a revenue recognition basis the first year.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 12:53
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Sijbrandij: GitLab requires at least one year paid upfront on all deals
“All the deals we do are one year paid, at least one year paid up front.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 13:13
Disclosure
Sijbrandij: GitLab has raised roughly $40M+ in total capital
“I think it's forty-something.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 13:24
Disclosure
GitLab operates with only a single $5,000-per-month office lease globally
“I'm sitting at our office in San Francisco. It lasts on 5000 dollars a month, and that's the only, like, office space we lease.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 13:35
Assertion Not checkable as stated
GitLab's 270 fully remote employees work across 270 distinct locations
“We have 270 people working from 270 locations.”
Sid Sijbrandij Oct 27, 2018 ▶ 13:47
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