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Apr 3, 2020 · 21m · top-founders

1714 Do This Today: How Much You Get $349b PPP Stimulus for SaaS Founders

Connor Lee · 11m spoken Nathan Latka · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

Host Nathan Latka interviews GoPersonas founder Connor Lee to explore how his bootstrapped SaaS company scaled to $3.6M in ARR while providing a step-by-step tactical guide for founders navigating CARES Act PPP stimulus funding and pandemic-era market shifts.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 44.1% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 5.2 Guest teaching 1.5 Guest disagreement 0.7 Nathan pushing back 2.7
05100:0010:0020:000:33–4:24 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Transitioning from HipLead to Audience-First GoPersonas Nathan inquires about the product pivot and challenges Connor on how building bespoke tools for enterprise clients avoids fragmented codebases and dev headaches. Connor explains their modular API building-block architecture.4:25–6:28 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Deconstructing the $310K MRR Revenue Engine Nathan deconstructs the revenue stream between self-serve SaaS and high-ticket enterprise contracts, verifying the $310k total MRR and bootstrap trajectory.6:30–12:16 · Nathan as informed peer 9/10 Evaluating Historic Venture Debt and Relief Capital Nathan demonstrates deep technical expertise on the freshly released CARES Act PPP loan calculations, terms, and forgiveness clauses, prompting Connor to remark that Nathan is an expert on the subject.12:16–16:01 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Client Churn Patterns and Pandemic Market Realities Nathan presses Connor on muddy churn and expansion numbers, actively walking through cohort calculations to force a precise net revenue retention figure of 95%.16:01–19:42 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Multi-Channel Growth Tactics and Sustainable Profitability The conversation covers acquisition channels, global remote staffing, and profitability. Nathan pitches his venture debt matching initiative for founders taking stimulus loans.19:44–21:17 · Nathan as informed peer 2/10 Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Connor Lee Nathan runs through the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions, with Connor sharing reflections on books, mentors, and life balance.0:33–4:24 · Guest teaching 3/10 Transitioning from HipLead to Audience-First GoPersonas Nathan inquires about the product pivot and challenges Connor on how building bespoke tools for enterprise clients avoids fragmented codebases and dev headaches. Connor explains their modular API building-block architecture.4:25–6:28 · Guest teaching 1/10 Deconstructing the $310K MRR Revenue Engine Nathan deconstructs the revenue stream between self-serve SaaS and high-ticket enterprise contracts, verifying the $310k total MRR and bootstrap trajectory.6:30–12:16 · Guest teaching 1/10 Evaluating Historic Venture Debt and Relief Capital Nathan demonstrates deep technical expertise on the freshly released CARES Act PPP loan calculations, terms, and forgiveness clauses, prompting Connor to remark that Nathan is an expert on the subject.12:16–16:01 · Guest teaching 2/10 Client Churn Patterns and Pandemic Market Realities Nathan presses Connor on muddy churn and expansion numbers, actively walking through cohort calculations to force a precise net revenue retention figure of 95%.16:01–19:42 · Guest teaching 1/10 Multi-Channel Growth Tactics and Sustainable Profitability The conversation covers acquisition channels, global remote staffing, and profitability. Nathan pitches his venture debt matching initiative for founders taking stimulus loans.19:44–21:17 · Guest teaching 1/10 Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Connor Lee Nathan runs through the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions, with Connor sharing reflections on books, mentors, and life balance.0:33–4:24 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Transitioning from HipLead to Audience-First GoPersonas Nathan inquires about the product pivot and challenges Connor on how building bespoke tools for enterprise clients avoids fragmented codebases and dev headaches. Connor explains their modular API building-block architecture.4:25–6:28 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Deconstructing the $310K MRR Revenue Engine Nathan deconstructs the revenue stream between self-serve SaaS and high-ticket enterprise contracts, verifying the $310k total MRR and bootstrap trajectory.6:30–12:16 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Evaluating Historic Venture Debt and Relief Capital Nathan demonstrates deep technical expertise on the freshly released CARES Act PPP loan calculations, terms, and forgiveness clauses, prompting Connor to remark that Nathan is an expert on the subject.12:16–16:01 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Client Churn Patterns and Pandemic Market Realities Nathan presses Connor on muddy churn and expansion numbers, actively walking through cohort calculations to force a precise net revenue retention figure of 95%.16:01–19:42 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Multi-Channel Growth Tactics and Sustainable Profitability The conversation covers acquisition channels, global remote staffing, and profitability. Nathan pitches his venture debt matching initiative for founders taking stimulus loans.19:44–21:17 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Connor Lee Nathan runs through the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions, with Connor sharing reflections on books, mentors, and life balance.0:33–4:24 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Transitioning from HipLead to Audience-First GoPersonas Nathan inquires about the product pivot and challenges Connor on how building bespoke tools for enterprise clients avoids fragmented codebases and dev headaches. Connor explains their modular API building-block architecture.4:25–6:28 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Deconstructing the $310K MRR Revenue Engine Nathan deconstructs the revenue stream between self-serve SaaS and high-ticket enterprise contracts, verifying the $310k total MRR and bootstrap trajectory.6:30–12:16 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Evaluating Historic Venture Debt and Relief Capital Nathan demonstrates deep technical expertise on the freshly released CARES Act PPP loan calculations, terms, and forgiveness clauses, prompting Connor to remark that Nathan is an expert on the subject.12:16–16:01 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Client Churn Patterns and Pandemic Market Realities Nathan presses Connor on muddy churn and expansion numbers, actively walking through cohort calculations to force a precise net revenue retention figure of 95%.16:01–19:42 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Multi-Channel Growth Tactics and Sustainable Profitability The conversation covers acquisition channels, global remote staffing, and profitability. Nathan pitches his venture debt matching initiative for founders taking stimulus loans.19:44–21:17 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Connor Lee Nathan runs through the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions, with Connor sharing reflections on books, mentors, and life balance.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 43.9% · guest 56.1%0:00 · Nathan 43.9% · guest 56.1%3:00 · Nathan 22.6% · guest 77.4%3:00 · Nathan 22.6% · guest 77.4%6:00 · Nathan 42.3% · guest 57.7%6:00 · Nathan 42.3% · guest 57.7%9:00 · Nathan 80% · guest 20%9:00 · Nathan 80% · guest 20%12:00 · Nathan 19.8% · guest 80.2%12:00 · Nathan 19.8% · guest 80.2%15:00 · Nathan 24.7% · guest 75.3%15:00 · Nathan 24.7% · guest 75.3%18:00 · Nathan 66.5% · guest 33.5%18:00 · Nathan 66.5% · guest 33.5%21:00 · Nathan 72.9% · guest 27.1%21:00 · Nathan 72.9% · guest 27.1%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 15:05 Connor disputes blended churn categorization

Connor pushes back against Nathan's 100% net retention assumption, clarifying that gross churn is higher and enterprise upsells are tracked under distinct accounting models.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 15:39 Nathan forces net churn cohort definition

Nathan refuses Connor's ambiguous multi-tier churn description and forces him to calculate the exact year-over-year cohort baseline down to 95% net retention.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 7:44 Connor clarifies cap table and debt history

Connor corrects Nathan's misconception that the company had taken $200k in equity, clarifying that historic funding was purely repaid venture debt and minor SAFE notes.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 10:53 Latka's masterclass on PPP loan qualification and forgiveness

Nathan delivers a comprehensive, highly technical breakdown of the 2.5x payroll multiplier, 0.5% interest cap, 2-year term, and complete forgiveness criteria.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Transitioning from HipLead to Audience-First GoPersonas 4314 Nathan inquires about the product pivot and challenges Connor on how building bespoke tools for enterprise clients avoids fragmented codebases and dev headaches. Connor explains their modular API building-block architecture.
Deconstructing the $310K MRR Revenue Engine 4112 Nathan deconstructs the revenue stream between self-serve SaaS and high-ticket enterprise contracts, verifying the $310k total MRR and bootstrap trajectory.
Evaluating Historic Venture Debt and Relief Capital 9102 Nathan demonstrates deep technical expertise on the freshly released CARES Act PPP loan calculations, terms, and forgiveness clauses, prompting Connor to remark that Nathan is an expert on the subject.
Client Churn Patterns and Pandemic Market Realities 6225 Nathan presses Connor on muddy churn and expansion numbers, actively walking through cohort calculations to force a precise net revenue retention figure of 95%.
Multi-Channel Growth Tactics and Sustainable Profitability 6102 The conversation covers acquisition channels, global remote staffing, and profitability. Nathan pitches his venture debt matching initiative for founders taking stimulus loans.
Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions with Connor Lee 2101 Nathan runs through the standard Famous Five rapid-fire questions, with Connor sharing reflections on books, mentors, and life balance.

Statements from this episode (13)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Connor Lee: GoPersonas serves roughly 110 customers on its software tool
“We have about on the hip lead at, well, on the personas actual tool, we have roughly a hundred, a 110.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 2:33
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Connor Lee: GoPersonas generates $130K app MRR and $180K enterprise MRR
“We have so we're doing roughly a 130 K in the app on MRR and about a 180 K in our enterprise.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 4:49
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Connor Lee: Six enterprise SaaS clients pay GoPersonas $180K monthly total
“We have, and we have about six pretty large SAS clients that, that are paying us a 180 K a month in total.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 5:17
Disclosure
Connor Lee: GoPersonas repaid $225,000 on a $150,000 Lighter Capital loan
“So we use letter capital. Yeah, we were, we haven't our loan was 150 K in actual loan and we had a 50% interest paid over, over three years. So we paid 225 K 70, 70,000, you know, in in, in, in fees and whatnot.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 6:36
Disclosure
Connor Lee: GoPersonas has no outside equity on its balance sheet
“There's no actual, like, you know, true equity on on our books.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 7:57
Prediction Held up
Nathan Latka: The $349B PPP stimulus funds will run out quickly
“So the trick with this that, you know, Connor, that I'm trying to share with people is I think the money will run out. Right. If you take three hundred fifty billion. Right. At a max of ten million per company, that's only 34,000 companies. Right. Even even if…”
Nathan Latka Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 10:23
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Connor Lee: GoPersonas sees 0% enterprise churn and 12-15% self-serve churn
“We haven't had any churn on our enterprise whatsoever. So zero percent there, but on our, yeah, we're at 12, 15% churn on, on the self-serve go percentage.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 13:59
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Connor Lee: GoPersonas operates at approximately 95% net revenue retention
“It's about five percent churn overall.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 15:54
Disclosure
Connor Lee: GoPersonas is currently operating as a profitable business
“We're profitable.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 17:07
Disclosure
Connor Lee: GoPersonas employs 20 people globally
“So we have eight employees in SF and we have 12 other remote employees kind of all over the world.”
Connor Lee Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 17:12
Disclosure
Nathan Latka discloses investing substantial debt capital into SaaS companies
“Part of what I've done over the past two years, I don't obviously talk about this a ton publicly, but I've invested a lot of money via debt into SaaS companies.”
Nathan Latka Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 18:42
Disclosure
Nathan Latka offers to match SaaS founders' COVID relief with debt
“One of the things that I'm considering doing, and if you end up doing this, email me or tweet me is I am matching. Whatever you get from COVID. So if you like applied and got a 200,000 dollar check from the COVID funds, I will, would give you another 200,000 d…”
Nathan Latka Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 18:51
Opinion
Nathan Latka: Outreach CEO Manny Medina handled recent layoffs gracefully
“He had to make a tough decision laying off a large portion of the team, but I think did it in a way that is just probably the most graceful way you could ever do that.”
Nathan Latka Apr 3, 2020 ▶ 20:13
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