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Jul 23, 2020 · 16m · top-founders

Churnly Burning $40k/mo, Hits 20 Customers, $200k Revenue Helping SaaS Companies Reduce Churn

Adam Baker · 9m spoken Nathan Latka · 4m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of Conversations with Nathan Latka, Churnly founder Adam Baker discusses bootstrapping his predictive churn intelligence SaaS platform to $18,000 in monthly recurring revenue across 20 customers. Baker details his $40,000 monthly burn rate funded by prior startup exits, his technical team structure, and his organic SEO customer acquisition strategy.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 32.2% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.6 Guest teaching 2.2 Guest disagreement 1.0 Nathan pushing back 3.4
05100:0010:002:09–5:56 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Professional Background and the Genesis of Churnly Latka inquires about Baker's transition from The Guardian to founding Churnly and probes the expensive $300k MVP phase. Baker explains why generalized churn models are challenging across disparate SaaS verticals.5:56–9:28 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Customer Traction, Self-Funded Burn, and Product Prioritization Latka quickly calculates Baker's monthly revenue run-rate and pushes on the sustainability of self-funding a $40k/month net burn. Baker explains his product-first rationale and willingness to take financial risks.9:29–11:42 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Churn Metrics and Dynamic Pricing Strategy Latka directly challenges Baker's dynamic pricing model, arguing that pricing on lost customer logos is counterproductive for SaaS companies going upmarket. Baker openly admits they have not fully nailed their pricing structure yet.11:42–14:44 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Customer Acquisition, Inbound SEO, and International Traction Latka breaks down customer acquisition economics and references competitive dynamics like Gainsight's dominance in US search rankings. Baker shares his organic funnel and low-cost Brazilian SEO strategy.14:44–16:13 · Nathan as informed peer 3/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five questions while sneaking in a tactical metrics question about total platform integrations. Baker provides clear, reflective answers.2:09–5:56 · Guest teaching 3/10 Professional Background and the Genesis of Churnly Latka inquires about Baker's transition from The Guardian to founding Churnly and probes the expensive $300k MVP phase. Baker explains why generalized churn models are challenging across disparate SaaS verticals.5:56–9:28 · Guest teaching 2/10 Customer Traction, Self-Funded Burn, and Product Prioritization Latka quickly calculates Baker's monthly revenue run-rate and pushes on the sustainability of self-funding a $40k/month net burn. Baker explains his product-first rationale and willingness to take financial risks.9:29–11:42 · Guest teaching 2/10 Churn Metrics and Dynamic Pricing Strategy Latka directly challenges Baker's dynamic pricing model, arguing that pricing on lost customer logos is counterproductive for SaaS companies going upmarket. Baker openly admits they have not fully nailed their pricing structure yet.11:42–14:44 · Guest teaching 3/10 Customer Acquisition, Inbound SEO, and International Traction Latka breaks down customer acquisition economics and references competitive dynamics like Gainsight's dominance in US search rankings. Baker shares his organic funnel and low-cost Brazilian SEO strategy.14:44–16:13 · Guest teaching 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five questions while sneaking in a tactical metrics question about total platform integrations. Baker provides clear, reflective answers.2:09–5:56 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Professional Background and the Genesis of Churnly Latka inquires about Baker's transition from The Guardian to founding Churnly and probes the expensive $300k MVP phase. Baker explains why generalized churn models are challenging across disparate SaaS verticals.5:56–9:28 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Customer Traction, Self-Funded Burn, and Product Prioritization Latka quickly calculates Baker's monthly revenue run-rate and pushes on the sustainability of self-funding a $40k/month net burn. Baker explains his product-first rationale and willingness to take financial risks.9:29–11:42 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Churn Metrics and Dynamic Pricing Strategy Latka directly challenges Baker's dynamic pricing model, arguing that pricing on lost customer logos is counterproductive for SaaS companies going upmarket. Baker openly admits they have not fully nailed their pricing structure yet.11:42–14:44 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Customer Acquisition, Inbound SEO, and International Traction Latka breaks down customer acquisition economics and references competitive dynamics like Gainsight's dominance in US search rankings. Baker shares his organic funnel and low-cost Brazilian SEO strategy.14:44–16:13 · Guest disagreement 0/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five questions while sneaking in a tactical metrics question about total platform integrations. Baker provides clear, reflective answers.2:09–5:56 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Professional Background and the Genesis of Churnly Latka inquires about Baker's transition from The Guardian to founding Churnly and probes the expensive $300k MVP phase. Baker explains why generalized churn models are challenging across disparate SaaS verticals.5:56–9:28 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Customer Traction, Self-Funded Burn, and Product Prioritization Latka quickly calculates Baker's monthly revenue run-rate and pushes on the sustainability of self-funding a $40k/month net burn. Baker explains his product-first rationale and willingness to take financial risks.9:29–11:42 · Nathan pushing back 6/10 Churn Metrics and Dynamic Pricing Strategy Latka directly challenges Baker's dynamic pricing model, arguing that pricing on lost customer logos is counterproductive for SaaS companies going upmarket. Baker openly admits they have not fully nailed their pricing structure yet.11:42–14:44 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Customer Acquisition, Inbound SEO, and International Traction Latka breaks down customer acquisition economics and references competitive dynamics like Gainsight's dominance in US search rankings. Baker shares his organic funnel and low-cost Brazilian SEO strategy.14:44–16:13 · Nathan pushing back 1/10 The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions Latka runs through the Famous Five questions while sneaking in a tactical metrics question about total platform integrations. Baker provides clear, reflective answers.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 70.7% · guest 29.3%0:00 · Nathan 70.7% · guest 29.3%3:00 · Nathan 20.7% · guest 79.3%3:00 · Nathan 20.7% · guest 79.3%6:00 · Nathan 21% · guest 79%6:00 · Nathan 21% · guest 79%9:00 · Nathan 21.4% · guest 78.6%9:00 · Nathan 21.4% · guest 78.6%12:00 · Nathan 15.3% · guest 84.7%12:00 · Nathan 15.3% · guest 84.7%15:00 · Nathan 55% · guest 45%15:00 · Nathan 55% · guest 45%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 10:57 Defending early-stage pricing experimentation

Baker pushes back against Latka's criticism of his pricing model, emphasizing that while imperfect, it currently fits their delivery model and works for their early customer cohort.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 10:49 Pushing back on pricing based on logo churn

Latka rejects Baker's pricing methodology, pointing out that upmarket SaaS companies typically experience high logo churn but low revenue churn, making the metric flawed for expansion.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 4:32 Educating on the non-scalability of generic churn algorithms

Baker educates Latka on why churn prediction cannot easily be copy-pasted across SaaS verticals due to divergent trigger points, necessitating heavy custom data science.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 10:49 Demonstrating SaaS metrics expertise regarding upmarket churn

Latka demonstrates deep domain familiarity with SaaS revenue models by identifying the disconnect between logo churn and net revenue retention in enterprise transitions.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Professional Background and the Genesis of Churnly 4313 Latka inquires about Baker's transition from The Guardian to founding Churnly and probes the expensive $300k MVP phase. Baker explains why generalized churn models are challenging across disparate SaaS verticals.
Customer Traction, Self-Funded Burn, and Product Prioritization 5214 Latka quickly calculates Baker's monthly revenue run-rate and pushes on the sustainability of self-funding a $40k/month net burn. Baker explains his product-first rationale and willingness to take financial risks.
Churn Metrics and Dynamic Pricing Strategy 6226 Latka directly challenges Baker's dynamic pricing model, arguing that pricing on lost customer logos is counterproductive for SaaS companies going upmarket. Baker openly admits they have not fully nailed their pricing structure yet.
Customer Acquisition, Inbound SEO, and International Traction 5313 Latka breaks down customer acquisition economics and references competitive dynamics like Gainsight's dominance in US search rankings. Baker shares his organic funnel and low-cost Brazilian SEO strategy.
The Famous Five Rapid-Fire Questions 3101 Latka runs through the Famous Five questions while sneaking in a tactical metrics question about total platform integrations. Baker provides clear, reflective answers.

Statements from this episode (12)

Disclosure
Churnly spent roughly $300k on its MVP before earning revenue
“Somewhere around about 300 K.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 4:28
Insight
Churn prediction models do not easily scale across SaaS verticals
“What we discovered very early on is that churn, churn models aren't very scalable.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 4:35
Disclosure
Baker: Churnly employs four software engineers and seven data scientists
“Software engineers, we've got four and we've got seven data scientists.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 5:40
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Baker: Churnly currently has just under 20 paying customers
“So we're just under 20.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 6:02
Disclosure
Adam Baker sold two prior companies to self-fund Churnly
“Built and sold two companies. So I've been fortunate enough to be able to take a risk with my own cash in this.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 8:02
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Baker: Churnly is burning about $40,000 net per month
“We're probably burning about 40 at the moment.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 8:24
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Baker: Churnly had zero gross revenue churn over the past year
“It's zero.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 9:45
Disclosure
Churnly charges an average of $900 per month
“We feel that the price point that we've landed on, which is anywhere to be honest, between seven and 1200 bucks a month. And it kind of, Averages out about nine.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 11:18
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Baker: Churnly generated 75 leads and closed 1 customer from SaaStock
“We went to SAS stock last year. We picked up 75 leads. We closed one of those leads actually two weeks ago.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 12:07
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Baker: Churnly has four customers in Brazil via organic SEO
“We've got four customers in Brazil right now. And so, you know, we come up on page one for particularly in Brazil.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 13:28
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Baker: Churnly generates about six leads per week via SEO
“Currently through SEO we're getting about six leads a week coming through”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 13:45
Disclosure
Baker: Churnly pays its external SEO agency $400 per month
“We paid them monthly about 400 bucks a month.”
Adam Baker Jul 23, 2020 ▶ 13:56
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