StarZero All shows Try the podcast clipper →

Apr 26, 2021 · 19m · top-founders

Secret Dev Shop Top SaaS Founders Use Breaks $10m in Revenue

Mitul Bid · 10m spoken Nathan Latka · 5m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this interview with Nathan Latka, Koditas founder Mitul Bid details how he bootstrapped an engineering services agency from $1,500 into a $10 million enterprise. Bid shares insights on pricing structures, on-demand team scaling, and elevating software engineering standards through a craftsmanship-focused approach.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 32.5% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.6 Guest teaching 4.4 Guest disagreement 2.2 Nathan pushing back 3.0
05100:0010:001:31–4:28 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Koditas Background, Service Model, and Revenue Growth Nathan tries to slot Koditas into the familiar agency-to-SaaS narrative, but Mitul clarifies their model is strictly time and materials services. When Nathan underestimates their recent annual revenue at around five million, Mitul directly corrects him that they surpassed ten million.4:29–8:53 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Commitment to Services and Raising Indian Engineering Standards Mitul firmly rejects the idea of creating internal SaaS IP, identifying it as a distracting conflict of interest that harms service firms. He then educates Nathan on code quality standards in India and dismisses anyone claiming to write bug-free software as having never coded.8:55–12:39 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Hourly Pricing Tiers, Client Retention, and M&A Dynamics Nathan demonstrates solid understanding of M&A dynamics by pressing on whether having an entirely outsourced engineering team hurts a client during acquisition diligence. Mitul outlines their blended rate structure and contractual buyout provisions.13:07–16:13 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 On-Demand Scaling, Non-Solicitation, and Company Culture Nathan explores the operational advantages of on-demand scaling versus in-house hiring, asking how Koditas stops clients from poaching engineers. Mitul explains their bench mechanics, non-solicitation agreements, and hefty buyout terms.16:14–19:34 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Bootstrapped Founding, Stakeholder Equity, and Famous Five The exchange wraps up amicably as Mitul details bootstrapping from fifteen hundred dollars and sharing equity with key employees. Nathan transitions smoothly through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions.1:31–4:28 · Guest teaching 4/10 Koditas Background, Service Model, and Revenue Growth Nathan tries to slot Koditas into the familiar agency-to-SaaS narrative, but Mitul clarifies their model is strictly time and materials services. When Nathan underestimates their recent annual revenue at around five million, Mitul directly corrects him that they surpassed ten million.4:29–8:53 · Guest teaching 7/10 Commitment to Services and Raising Indian Engineering Standards Mitul firmly rejects the idea of creating internal SaaS IP, identifying it as a distracting conflict of interest that harms service firms. He then educates Nathan on code quality standards in India and dismisses anyone claiming to write bug-free software as having never coded.8:55–12:39 · Guest teaching 5/10 Hourly Pricing Tiers, Client Retention, and M&A Dynamics Nathan demonstrates solid understanding of M&A dynamics by pressing on whether having an entirely outsourced engineering team hurts a client during acquisition diligence. Mitul outlines their blended rate structure and contractual buyout provisions.13:07–16:13 · Guest teaching 4/10 On-Demand Scaling, Non-Solicitation, and Company Culture Nathan explores the operational advantages of on-demand scaling versus in-house hiring, asking how Koditas stops clients from poaching engineers. Mitul explains their bench mechanics, non-solicitation agreements, and hefty buyout terms.16:14–19:34 · Guest teaching 2/10 Bootstrapped Founding, Stakeholder Equity, and Famous Five The exchange wraps up amicably as Mitul details bootstrapping from fifteen hundred dollars and sharing equity with key employees. Nathan transitions smoothly through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions.1:31–4:28 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Koditas Background, Service Model, and Revenue Growth Nathan tries to slot Koditas into the familiar agency-to-SaaS narrative, but Mitul clarifies their model is strictly time and materials services. When Nathan underestimates their recent annual revenue at around five million, Mitul directly corrects him that they surpassed ten million.4:29–8:53 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Commitment to Services and Raising Indian Engineering Standards Mitul firmly rejects the idea of creating internal SaaS IP, identifying it as a distracting conflict of interest that harms service firms. He then educates Nathan on code quality standards in India and dismisses anyone claiming to write bug-free software as having never coded.8:55–12:39 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Hourly Pricing Tiers, Client Retention, and M&A Dynamics Nathan demonstrates solid understanding of M&A dynamics by pressing on whether having an entirely outsourced engineering team hurts a client during acquisition diligence. Mitul outlines their blended rate structure and contractual buyout provisions.13:07–16:13 · Guest disagreement 2/10 On-Demand Scaling, Non-Solicitation, and Company Culture Nathan explores the operational advantages of on-demand scaling versus in-house hiring, asking how Koditas stops clients from poaching engineers. Mitul explains their bench mechanics, non-solicitation agreements, and hefty buyout terms.16:14–19:34 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Bootstrapped Founding, Stakeholder Equity, and Famous Five The exchange wraps up amicably as Mitul details bootstrapping from fifteen hundred dollars and sharing equity with key employees. Nathan transitions smoothly through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions.1:31–4:28 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Koditas Background, Service Model, and Revenue Growth Nathan tries to slot Koditas into the familiar agency-to-SaaS narrative, but Mitul clarifies their model is strictly time and materials services. When Nathan underestimates their recent annual revenue at around five million, Mitul directly corrects him that they surpassed ten million.4:29–8:53 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 Commitment to Services and Raising Indian Engineering Standards Mitul firmly rejects the idea of creating internal SaaS IP, identifying it as a distracting conflict of interest that harms service firms. He then educates Nathan on code quality standards in India and dismisses anyone claiming to write bug-free software as having never coded.8:55–12:39 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Hourly Pricing Tiers, Client Retention, and M&A Dynamics Nathan demonstrates solid understanding of M&A dynamics by pressing on whether having an entirely outsourced engineering team hurts a client during acquisition diligence. Mitul outlines their blended rate structure and contractual buyout provisions.13:07–16:13 · Nathan pushing back 3/10 On-Demand Scaling, Non-Solicitation, and Company Culture Nathan explores the operational advantages of on-demand scaling versus in-house hiring, asking how Koditas stops clients from poaching engineers. Mitul explains their bench mechanics, non-solicitation agreements, and hefty buyout terms.16:14–19:34 · Nathan pushing back 2/10 Bootstrapped Founding, Stakeholder Equity, and Famous Five The exchange wraps up amicably as Mitul details bootstrapping from fifteen hundred dollars and sharing equity with key employees. Nathan transitions smoothly through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 71.5% · guest 28.5%0:00 · Nathan 71.5% · guest 28.5%3:00 · Nathan 37.2% · guest 62.8%3:00 · Nathan 37.2% · guest 62.8%6:00 · Nathan 5.5% · guest 94.5%6:00 · Nathan 5.5% · guest 94.5%9:00 · Nathan 15.2% · guest 84.8%9:00 · Nathan 15.2% · guest 84.8%12:00 · Nathan 40.8% · guest 59.2%12:00 · Nathan 40.8% · guest 59.2%15:00 · Nathan 17.9% · guest 82.1%15:00 · Nathan 17.9% · guest 82.1%18:00 · Nathan 55.5% · guest 44.5%18:00 · Nathan 55.5% · guest 44.5%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 4:41 Rejecting software IP as a conflict of interest

Mitul pushes back on Nathan's standard SaaS playbook assumption, asserting that attempting to build proprietary software alongside services is a critical mistake and conflict of interest.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 12:05 Challenging outsourced tech during M&A diligence

Nathan directly challenges whether relying entirely on an outsourced Indian engineering team threatens enterprise valuation during buyer due diligence.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 7:40 Debunking the promise of bug-free software

Mitul dismantles common agency sales pitches, stating candidly that anyone promising bug-free software has never written code and explaining why clean code and transparency matter more.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 11:50 Nathan probes acquisition risks with ConnectAndSell case study

Nathan leverages insights from a previous guest to probe potential vulnerabilities in relying entirely on a dev shop when scaling toward an exit.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Koditas Background, Service Model, and Revenue Growth 4423 Nathan tries to slot Koditas into the familiar agency-to-SaaS narrative, but Mitul clarifies their model is strictly time and materials services. When Nathan underestimates their recent annual revenue at around five million, Mitul directly corrects him that they surpassed ten million.
Commitment to Services and Raising Indian Engineering Standards 4743 Mitul firmly rejects the idea of creating internal SaaS IP, identifying it as a distracting conflict of interest that harms service firms. He then educates Nathan on code quality standards in India and dismisses anyone claiming to write bug-free software as having never coded.
Hourly Pricing Tiers, Client Retention, and M&A Dynamics 6524 Nathan demonstrates solid understanding of M&A dynamics by pressing on whether having an entirely outsourced engineering team hurts a client during acquisition diligence. Mitul outlines their blended rate structure and contractual buyout provisions.
On-Demand Scaling, Non-Solicitation, and Company Culture 5423 Nathan explores the operational advantages of on-demand scaling versus in-house hiring, asking how Koditas stops clients from poaching engineers. Mitul explains their bench mechanics, non-solicitation agreements, and hefty buyout terms.
Bootstrapped Founding, Stakeholder Equity, and Famous Five 4212 The exchange wraps up amicably as Mitul details bootstrapping from fifteen hundred dollars and sharing equity with key employees. Nathan transitions smoothly through the Famous Five rapid-fire questions.

Statements from this episode (8)

Assertion Contradicted
Bid: Koditas grew revenue to nearly $2M in 2015 and 50%+ annually
“It grew to almost two million. And then since then it has been growing on year on year, more than 50% or at least, you know, a quarter of 50% on average.”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 4:05
Assertion Contradicted
Bid: Koditas crossed $10 million in annual revenue last year
“Last year we did a quarter of 10.”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 4:23
Insight
Bid: Services firms struggle to scale when splitting focus with proprietary IP
“That's the biggest problem by a lot of software services companies are not able to, you know, scale well because they are always in two minds. They want to build their own IP. And they want to offer services. I saw it as a conflict of interest.”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 4:42
Disclosure
Bid: Koditas owns zero intellectual property to avoid conflicts of interest
“We have zero IP even today. We have lots of things which are repeatable, reusable. We do not claim the IP. I just see it as a conflict of interest.”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 5:02
Disclosure
Bid: Koditas hourly rates range from $10 to over $50
“So it starts with literally 10 to 12 dollars an hour, two up to 50 plus dollars an hour, right?”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 9:12
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bid: Koditas maintains 35 to 40 active clients, served over 150
“So last year, so we currently have around 35, 40 active clients, and that's the kind of size we've been maintaining. Over the lifetime, we would have served more than a 150 clients”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 9:52
Disclosure
Bid: Koditas charges up to a year of billing for developer buyouts
“I wouldn't allow you to transfer them for the first one or two years, right? And after that, it will be relatively high. I typically would take a fairly minimum six to 10, one year of a billing kind of thing to execute that.”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 15:16
Disclosure
Koditas launched with just $1,500 and required no further capital
“And that was because that was a paid up capital required. You know, you declare some money with the starting. So we put in, I don't think we can use that fully. And we've never had to follow more to the company.”
Mitul Bid Apr 26, 2021 ▶ 16:35
Made with StarZero

Turn any episode into a week of clips.

This entire site, over 2,600 episodes transcribed, diarized, checked and made playable, runs on the StarZero media pipeline. Drop in your own episode and the podcast clipper finds the moments worth sharing, cuts them, captions them, and reframes them for every feed.

Try the podcast clipper Learn more