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Mar 3, 2025 · 25m · the-pitch

#79 The Anti-JUUL

Josh Israel · 9m spoken Josh Muccio · 6m spoken Sheel Mohnot · 2m spoken Charles Hudson · 1m spoken Al Doan · 54s spoken Nimi Katragadda · 29s spoken
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On an episode of The Pitch, founder Josh Israel presents Hava Health, a smart dual-chamber vaporization device designed to systematically wean users off nicotine, successfully securing an angel investment from Sheil Mohnot despite facing a lengthy FDA approval timeline.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Josh holds 32.5% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Josh as informed peer 2.4 Guest teaching 4.6 Guest disagreement 1.4 Josh pushing back 1.6
05100:0010:0020:001:41–3:54 · Josh as informed peer 1/10 Josh Israel Introduces the Dual-Chamber Cessation Device Josh Israel delivers his opening pitch, introducing Hava's dual-chamber hardware and phone-pairing tapering system. The investors and host simply listen to the introductory presentation without friction.3:55–6:20 · Josh as informed peer 2/10 Tailored Regimens and the Post-Addiction Plan Israel educates the panel on nicotine replacement failure rates, pointing out that patches drop dosage abruptly from 24mg to 14mg while ignoring oral fixation. The panel asks straightforward clarifying questions about patient adherence.6:21–11:12 · Josh as informed peer 3/10 Business Model, FDA Timelines, and Funding Requirements The discussion turns to unit economics, clinical trial expenses, and the 36-month FDA approval pathway. Israel provides direct, crisp answers on CRO trial budgets and regulatory exclusivity, making the non-bio investors reconsider their typical timelines.11:25–16:46 · Josh as informed peer 2/10 Investor Deliberations and Sheil's Investment Offer Charles Hudson passes due to fund mandate policies despite liking the concept, while Sheil Mohnot negotiates entry at the earlier 4 million cap. Israel holds firm on positioning the product strictly as medical cessation rather than tobacco.16:49–24:36 · Josh as informed peer 4/10 Host Debrief with Sheil on Founder Conviction In the follow-up debrief, Muccio probes how the 2019 vaping health scare impacted investor relations and questions the friction of non-traditional go-to-market strategies. Israel explains the technical difference between black market THC acetate and FDA-regulated medical vapes.1:41–3:54 · Guest teaching 3/10 Josh Israel Introduces the Dual-Chamber Cessation Device Josh Israel delivers his opening pitch, introducing Hava's dual-chamber hardware and phone-pairing tapering system. The investors and host simply listen to the introductory presentation without friction.3:55–6:20 · Guest teaching 6/10 Tailored Regimens and the Post-Addiction Plan Israel educates the panel on nicotine replacement failure rates, pointing out that patches drop dosage abruptly from 24mg to 14mg while ignoring oral fixation. The panel asks straightforward clarifying questions about patient adherence.6:21–11:12 · Guest teaching 5/10 Business Model, FDA Timelines, and Funding Requirements The discussion turns to unit economics, clinical trial expenses, and the 36-month FDA approval pathway. Israel provides direct, crisp answers on CRO trial budgets and regulatory exclusivity, making the non-bio investors reconsider their typical timelines.11:25–16:46 · Guest teaching 4/10 Investor Deliberations and Sheil's Investment Offer Charles Hudson passes due to fund mandate policies despite liking the concept, while Sheil Mohnot negotiates entry at the earlier 4 million cap. Israel holds firm on positioning the product strictly as medical cessation rather than tobacco.16:49–24:36 · Guest teaching 5/10 Host Debrief with Sheil on Founder Conviction In the follow-up debrief, Muccio probes how the 2019 vaping health scare impacted investor relations and questions the friction of non-traditional go-to-market strategies. Israel explains the technical difference between black market THC acetate and FDA-regulated medical vapes.1:41–3:54 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Josh Israel Introduces the Dual-Chamber Cessation Device Josh Israel delivers his opening pitch, introducing Hava's dual-chamber hardware and phone-pairing tapering system. The investors and host simply listen to the introductory presentation without friction.3:55–6:20 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Tailored Regimens and the Post-Addiction Plan Israel educates the panel on nicotine replacement failure rates, pointing out that patches drop dosage abruptly from 24mg to 14mg while ignoring oral fixation. The panel asks straightforward clarifying questions about patient adherence.6:21–11:12 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Business Model, FDA Timelines, and Funding Requirements The discussion turns to unit economics, clinical trial expenses, and the 36-month FDA approval pathway. Israel provides direct, crisp answers on CRO trial budgets and regulatory exclusivity, making the non-bio investors reconsider their typical timelines.11:25–16:46 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Investor Deliberations and Sheil's Investment Offer Charles Hudson passes due to fund mandate policies despite liking the concept, while Sheil Mohnot negotiates entry at the earlier 4 million cap. Israel holds firm on positioning the product strictly as medical cessation rather than tobacco.16:49–24:36 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Host Debrief with Sheil on Founder Conviction In the follow-up debrief, Muccio probes how the 2019 vaping health scare impacted investor relations and questions the friction of non-traditional go-to-market strategies. Israel explains the technical difference between black market THC acetate and FDA-regulated medical vapes.1:41–3:54 · Josh pushing back 0/10 Josh Israel Introduces the Dual-Chamber Cessation Device Josh Israel delivers his opening pitch, introducing Hava's dual-chamber hardware and phone-pairing tapering system. The investors and host simply listen to the introductory presentation without friction.3:55–6:20 · Josh pushing back 1/10 Tailored Regimens and the Post-Addiction Plan Israel educates the panel on nicotine replacement failure rates, pointing out that patches drop dosage abruptly from 24mg to 14mg while ignoring oral fixation. The panel asks straightforward clarifying questions about patient adherence.6:21–11:12 · Josh pushing back 2/10 Business Model, FDA Timelines, and Funding Requirements The discussion turns to unit economics, clinical trial expenses, and the 36-month FDA approval pathway. Israel provides direct, crisp answers on CRO trial budgets and regulatory exclusivity, making the non-bio investors reconsider their typical timelines.11:25–16:46 · Josh pushing back 3/10 Investor Deliberations and Sheil's Investment Offer Charles Hudson passes due to fund mandate policies despite liking the concept, while Sheil Mohnot negotiates entry at the earlier 4 million cap. Israel holds firm on positioning the product strictly as medical cessation rather than tobacco.16:49–24:36 · Josh pushing back 2/10 Host Debrief with Sheil on Founder Conviction In the follow-up debrief, Muccio probes how the 2019 vaping health scare impacted investor relations and questions the friction of non-traditional go-to-market strategies. Israel explains the technical difference between black market THC acetate and FDA-regulated medical vapes.

speaking balance: gold is Josh, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Josh 66.5% · guest 33.5%0:00 · Josh 66.5% · guest 33.5%3:00 · Josh 13.6% · guest 86.4%3:00 · Josh 13.6% · guest 86.4%6:00 · Josh 16.1% · guest 83.9%6:00 · Josh 16.1% · guest 83.9%9:00 · Josh 32.5% · guest 67.5%9:00 · Josh 32.5% · guest 67.5%12:00 · Josh 6% · guest 94%12:00 · Josh 6% · guest 94%15:00 · Josh 23.7% · guest 76.3%15:00 · Josh 23.7% · guest 76.3%18:00 · Josh 37.7% · guest 62.3%18:00 · Josh 37.7% · guest 62.3%21:00 · Josh 54.2% · guest 45.8%21:00 · Josh 54.2% · guest 45.8%24:00 · Josh 59.7% · guest 40.3%24:00 · Josh 59.7% · guest 40.3%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 4:44 Dismissing traditional cessation products

Josh Israel rejects Nimi's suggestion that Hava could complement nicotine patches or gum, asserting that traditional methods are fundamentally ineffective and boast only a 5-15% success rate.

 Hardest push from Josh ▶ 10:29 Sheil questions the non-traditional software timeline

Sheil explicitly pushes back against the three-year waiting period to reach market, noting that as non-biotech investors, backing a company without revenue for years is outside their norm.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 5:05 Explaining the physiological failure of nicotine patches

Josh Israel details the pharmacological flaw in nicotine patches, showing how drastic drops from 24mg to 14mg trigger severe withdrawal compared to Hava's 0.1mg micro-titration.

 Josh holds their own ▶ 23:23 Contrasting standard tech capitalism with regulated medical pathways

Muccio challenges the founder on the psychological burden of delayed market feedback, contrasting standard iterative software development with strict FDA regulatory hurdles.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicJosh as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementJosh pushing backWhy
Josh Israel Introduces the Dual-Chamber Cessation Device 1310 Josh Israel delivers his opening pitch, introducing Hava's dual-chamber hardware and phone-pairing tapering system. The investors and host simply listen to the introductory presentation without friction.
Tailored Regimens and the Post-Addiction Plan 2621 Israel educates the panel on nicotine replacement failure rates, pointing out that patches drop dosage abruptly from 24mg to 14mg while ignoring oral fixation. The panel asks straightforward clarifying questions about patient adherence.
Business Model, FDA Timelines, and Funding Requirements 3512 The discussion turns to unit economics, clinical trial expenses, and the 36-month FDA approval pathway. Israel provides direct, crisp answers on CRO trial budgets and regulatory exclusivity, making the non-bio investors reconsider their typical timelines.
Investor Deliberations and Sheil's Investment Offer 2423 Charles Hudson passes due to fund mandate policies despite liking the concept, while Sheil Mohnot negotiates entry at the earlier 4 million cap. Israel holds firm on positioning the product strictly as medical cessation rather than tobacco.
Host Debrief with Sheil on Founder Conviction 4512 In the follow-up debrief, Muccio probes how the 2019 vaping health scare impacted investor relations and questions the friction of non-traditional go-to-market strategies. Israel explains the technical difference between black market THC acetate and FDA-regulated medical vapes.

Statements from this episode (12)

Disclosure
Israel says Hava closed $1M pre-seed and seeks $250K oversubscription
“I'm happy to say that we recently closed our pre-seed round of one million dollars, so I'm here today to look at potentially oversubscribing that round with investments up to 250,000 dollars to further product development while we go through our preclinical ph…”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 3:38
Assertion Supported
Israel says nicotine patch and gum success rates are 5% to 15%
“Like, if you look at the success rates for the patch of the gum, it's five to 15%. People try seven to eight times with those products on average to quit. They don't work.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 4:48
Disclosure
Israel says Hava Health device will cost $59 to $69
“Looking to price our device for around 59 or 69 dollars, and then a monthly subscription for around 30 to 40 dollars, which includes the replacement pods.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 7:03
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Israel expects $375 revenue per customer based on 12-month retention
“On average, about 12 months so we should get around 375 dollars per customer, and the cost to us is around 85 to 125 dollars.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 7:16
Prediction Open · timeframe Mar 2028
Israel expects Hava Health's time to market to be 36 months
“So total time to market, estimating around 36 months.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 9:28
Assertion Partly supported
Israel says FDA grants three to five years of market exclusivity
“So they have like three to five year exclusivity if we were to get approval and things of that nature.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 9:38
Disclosure
Mohnot says he has never invested in a three-year time to market
“I've never invested in a company that couldn't get a product to market for three years.”
Sheel Mohnot Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 10:39
Disclosure
Hudson says Precursor Ventures strictly avoids tobacco and cannabis investments
“We've had a strict sort of no tobacco, no cannabis policy, a precursor, since I started the fund.”
Charles Hudson Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 13:51
Disclosure
Israel says Hava is contractually committed against taking Big Tobacco capital
“What we did in his advisory agreement, you know, we made it explicitly clear that we're a smoking cessation product and we will never take capital from big tobacco.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 14:40
Disclosure
Mohnot offers a $25,000 personal angel check to Hava Health
“I'd like to write, like, a small personal check of, like, 25 K. Sure. If you could fit me into the previous round.”
Sheel Mohnot Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 16:10
Assertion Supported
Israel says vaping illnesses stem from black-market THC, not nicotine vapes
“If you look at nicotine-based vapes, there hasn't been any directly related health crisis or crises that have sprung up because of them. It's all been linked to THC and vitamin E or vitamin A acetate and the THC kind of black market pods.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 19:30
Assertion Supported
Israel says pre-2016 vape makers like Juul launched with zero FDA testing
“They haven't done any tests at all. It was like a pretty much a free for all pre-two 1016 where anybody could release a product and they were grandfathered in.”
Josh Israel Mar 3, 2025 ▶ 20:20
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