The Exchanges

Q a lot of loyalty to because they did so much. How do you, ah, we, we, we know in our guts, but from a process perspective, how do we put that in practice with our teams? How do we, how do we know how to, can we measure this toxicity? Can we, is it, and how do we, how do we optimize the action, ah, that we take on it?

A So part of what you have to define is what toxicity means to your organization, right? So for us, it's really focused on culture. So we define what our culture is, and then we can actually talk to someone about the degree to which they're falling short or exceeding those values. Part of the benefit of the anonymous employee survey is you hear very quickly from people's peers who those toxic folks are. And so I already mentioned, we share all the data that's received, including things about our management team. So if there are things about me or Darmeshin there, they're shared with the whole company. Anyone on the management team signs up for that. But if we receive anonymous feedback about one employee who is a frontline employee or a frontline manager, we go directly to that employee, and we say, we just want you to know there were five comments in this round of the ENPS just about your behavior. And we go to their manager, and we have a conversation, and we're like, ok, sometimes that's people reacting to change. Sometimes people don't like being challenged. So some of those people can be our best employees. And it's my job to have the conversation and go, ok, Is this person just pushing the status quo? If so, let's help them do that in a way that feels more relevant, and kind, and contextual to the people they're working with. If that person is truly toxic, we need to help p…

AI assessment note: “Part of the benefit of the anonymous employee survey is you hear very quickly”

Q Sorry, wrong term. Death under 20, it can be, it can be near death. At 2000, it's a, it's a fact of life, right?

A I like that you're pushing us on it. I think it's the right push because candidly, I think the generation before us, you know, you built your career at IBM. You stayed for a lifetime. You built your career at one company. Those days are over. And so I think as a result, the way companies think about retention needs to change too. So for example, at HubSpot, very early on, we've celebrated our alumni. We have actively promoted Alumni that come out of HubSpot. I can see our AppCues team. We have folks who are HubSpot alumni. No, we celebrate their success. So one of our value propositions at HubSpot is that you will become a better entrepreneur by joining our team. You cannot say we're going to do that, and then when people go to leave, go like, no, no, no, we'll just throw money at you. You can't possibly leave. We are exceptionally proud of the fact that we are helping people grow, and I hope that that's with us for as long as possible, but if they leave, I want them to make us incredibly proud, And to make us proud in the entrepreneurial community, not just in Boston, but globally. And so what we try and do is find a good balance between, we don't want to be silly with the cost to acquire an employee, right? It's the same thing with any SaaS metric. We don't want to be wasting money on hiring and onboarding people who will only stay six months. With that said, you have to crea…

AI assessment note: “the way companies think about retention needs to change too.”

Q a second question, which you brought up, which I think is a tough one, which is, if you hire someone that doesn't have an HR background, or comes out of a recruiting or other background, and they don't have a background in diversity inclusion, how do you, how should you approach that as a CEO and think about that? Um, because not everyone has a background in these issues, right?

A Yeah, absolutely. Great questions. Uh, so to, uh, your, I'll address your second question first. Uh, truthfully, both folks who have a lot of practice in this space and a huge background in HR and diversity inclusion, very few people are doing it well. And so I would say rather than thinking of all the reasons why not to get started, be intentional about doing something as far as what to actually do rather than make assumptions, ask people who have done it before and ask your employees who care about the issue and start there. I personally think that's better than going to scholarly academic journals, that sort of thing, um, so I think that's helpful. To your question of when to hire a chief people officer, so we actually have a storied wiki post at HubSpot that actually made a declaration that we would never, ever, ever in the history of the company have a chief people officer.

AI assessment note: “ask people who have done it before and ask your employees who care”

Q Got it. That's what the Fortune 50 has to do because they have no functional culture, right?

A It felt like the start of the TPS reports to a lot of people, and I sort of understand that. Uh, the reality is our employee experience is one of the most valuable products we offer, along with our marketing software, along with our sales software. It is the way in which we will win. It is the single biggest ingredient in our success as a company, and how we will either succeed or fail, uh, and I believe strongly that our people are our greatest asset, and so I personally think that companies should do it sooner. I think that more companies should, uh, not make that declaration, instead should go the other way, uh, but I also think that people need to be open, and I'm not just saying this because I'm biased, to non-career HR professionals, because the reality is most HR professionals have been conditioned To solve for compliance versus growth. And if you're in this room, chances are you care massively about growth. So you need someone creative, innovative and thoughtful enough to help you get there.

AI assessment note: “I personally think that companies should do it sooner.”