The Exchanges

Q about that technology in a moment, but first I want to ask you about sustainable energy, right? Because so much of our focus is on solar and wind. And if in fact we had, you know, just millions and millions and millions of wind turbines around the world and, and, you know, cover the Sahara desert and solar panels, would that be sufficient to, to power all of our needs?

A I think it would, but the ecological consequences would be just as bad as putting CO₂ into the atmosphere. So without getting too technical, the concept of power density matters here. So the idea that you use land to procure your power, when you start talking about the scale of the energy needs of humanity, which are ever increasing, If we try to do that with wind and solar, given that their power density is much, much less than fossil fuels, it would imply a premium on land use. We're talking about a hundred times. At those scales, it starts to become an issue. It's like trading a black eye for two black eyes, right? So, so we cannot really do that. It's not going to be sustainable.

AI assessment note: “I think it would, but the ecological consequences would be just as bad”

Q So it sounds like you were trying to figure out what other sustainable energy alternatives we could use Um, as a species to power our needs. Nuclear is one of them. You know, it's a relatively safe and sustainable source of energy, right?

A Yeah. I mean, I converge on three things and, and this is thinking at it like, um, like an engineer, you know, I, I understood the oil industry well. I understood that it powered most of civilization and I understood how much energy that implies. So when you look at that, I think there's only three things that can do it. The first one is indeed nuclear fission. As you just mentioned, it has the scalability and the power density to do it. The second one is fusion, which is what the sun does, but it's still experimental and in research. And the third one is deep geothermal. Aside from those three, there's nothing else that can scale to the number of terawatts that we need, uh, We consume about 23 terawatts in twenty-twenty-two. And, and keep in mind, uh, Guy, we, we cannot afford to transition energy every 25 years. So this is really not about twenty-fifty. This is about setting up for the next 100 to 200 years. So we're really not designing for even 20, 30, 40 terawatts. We're designing for a hundred plus terawatts. So certainly at those scales, you very quickly run out of options, and the only options left are those three.

AI assessment note: “The first one is indeed nuclear fission. As you just mentioned”

Q All right. So you finish your degree at MIT. You stay there for a master's degree. And I guess right out of MIT, you're recruited to work for a big oil and gas drilling company called Schlumberger. Um, where did you go? Are they based in, in, in Europe?

A They are. Originally a French company, but by the time I joined, they were truly an international company, and Schlumberger hired me in one of the Houston facilities to be an engineer, to design tools that would go downhole into an oil well and do something. Um, you know, it's remarkable to imagine how many things going to Making oil available to humanity, and there's a lot of technology that goes behind that. So, right after MIT, 2002, went to Houston, uh, started my career there, very technical, always wanted to be an engineer and be building things, and lived in Houston for, for eight years before I got transferred to Norway and then to England to expand my career in other directions. Uh, drilling was part of that, but it was not the only part of that. There's, there's other things like knowing where the oil is, you know, how do you know where things are down there? Uh, how do you produce it efficiently? How do you process it? So a lot of technologies that from end to end make it possible, and I, I became very familiar with all of them, uh, from a very technical angle. Um, of course, as you mature in your career, You inevitably get into the business side of things. You get into the commercialization side of things. So I became very aware of what it took to not only build and design these systems, these, these technologies, but also put them out into the world as commercial o…

AI assessment note: “They are. Originally a French company... hired me in one of the Houston facilities”

Q we, we know, we all use it every day. I mean, these are, these are absolutely vital to, um, economies to function. We are dependent on fossil fuels. But was there a point when, when you were working for, for that company where you started to wonder whether you should use your talent in, in, in another way to, to maybe Maybe in a more sustainable sector, uh, around energy?

A Yeah, my, my wife was the first one to point that out. You know, to me, it all happened very late in my career, but according to her, it happened much earlier. I mean, I've been married to her for more than 21 years, so she knows me right outside of MIT as we were 22 and 23. Um, I, I started becoming restless about energy transition, um, Around 2015, 2016, you know, I, I said to myself, you know, I have half of my career ahead of me, and I don't think it's going to be oil-related. You know, the energy transition will happen in our generation. It has to happen, and I am in a very good spot, given my experience and still my career ahead of me, to actually transition myself into something different. Um, I didn't know that it was going to be geothermal. I didn't know that it was going to be quays. That came later, but I, uh, obeyed that instinct. I said, you know, I, I need to walk away from oil and gas and try to find my way as a professional, as an engineer in this energy transition that's surely going to happen in the rest of our lifetimes.

AI assessment note: “I started becoming restless about energy transition, um, Around 2015, 2016”

Q You, you spent, I think, 14 or 15 years working At the same company in, in the oil and gas industry before you decided to leave, return to MIT to run one of their startup accelerators called The Engine. What inspired that change?

A So I became convinced that the reason we don't transition energy is first and foremost because we do not have as a species that technology to do it. Politics play a role, but It is really a technological gap first and foremost. So as I started to reason my way through these things and say, okay, if it's a technology gap, I'm pretty good at technology. Let's go and find what that is. I, I then learned that in order to finance these very difficult technical undertakings, you know, they're capital intensive, time intensive, it takes very high risk capital. And if you're going to do that outside of the agenda of a corporation, it's probably going to be venture capital. So that's how I started converging on that Uh, pathway.

AI assessment note: “I became convinced that the reason we don't transition energy is first and foremost”

Q Um, all right. So now, what are the hurdles in your way to do, I mean, besides proving the technology, once you prove the technology, is it, is it about money? Is it about the regulatory environment? Are there, uh, legal hurdles? Tell me what, what you have to overcome.

A These things take a lot of money a lot of time. So support and capitalization is, is important. We're talking about hundreds of millions of dollars to show that this can work. Uh, so that's a big one. The other one is technology. We have to scale the technology up. That's a lot of engineering, uh, and those things, uh, take a lot of time and effort. And the third one is making sure that the world continues to be supportive of decarbonization, right? Because if the world forgets about decarbonization, none of these things matter anymore, right? So, so I think all of those things will converge to, to clear the way and, and we'll, we'll succeed in repairing that power plant by the end of the decade.

AI assessment note: “These things take a lot of money a lot of time. So support and capitalization”