Oct 3, 2016 · 27m · how-i-built-this
Clif Bar: Gary Erickson
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
In this episode of NPR's 'How I Built This,' host Guy Raz chronicles how Gary Erickson founded Clif Bar from his mother's kitchen, scaled it through grassroots perseverance, and famously turned down a $120 million corporate buyout to preserve company independence and purpose.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 27.5% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Guy as informed peer 3.1 Guest teaching 1.2 Guest disagreement 0.1 Guy pushing back 0.6
speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 19:32 Definitively calling off the deal
Erickson describes decisively telling his business partner to hang up the phone with attorneys and abruptly pulling out of the $120M sale on the morning of signing.
Hardest push from Guy ▶ 21:55 Challenging the refusal to cash outRaz pushes back on Erickson's choice to shoulder $60 million in debt instead of taking the buyout money to live a charmed, stress-free life.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 13:43 Explaining the sharp end of the ropeErickson educates Raz on rock climbing psychology, explaining how leading on the rope demands complete focus that carries over into high-stakes business crises.
Guy holds their own ▶ 16:37 Raz names the suitor firstRaz demonstrates his knowledge of the company history by naming Quaker Oats before Erickson can mention the buyer, catching Erickson off guard.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Guy as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Guy pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| First Venture: Callie's Sweets and Savories | 4 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Raz guides the narrative smoothly, identifying PowerBar before Erickson even specifies them by name. Erickson enthusiastically details his background and the Mount Hamilton ride. | |
| Kitchen Experiments and Developing the Recipe | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Erickson recounts experimenting with ingredients alongside his mother and creating the packaging and name. Raz asks standard open-ended prompts to maintain narrative flow. | |
| Bootstrapping Early Production and Cash Flow | 4 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Raz synthesizes the cash flow mechanics Erickson used to bootstrap early production. Erickson shares how aggressive advertising against PowerBar led to immediate litigation and industry buzz. | |
| Early Traction and Exponential Sales Growth | 3 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Erickson explains nearly losing the company through a disastrous handshake distribution agreement. He shares how his rock climbing mindset helped him navigate high-stakes pressure. | |
| Mid-Show Teaser and Break | 5 | 1 | 0 | 1 | Raz demonstrates solid research by correctly identifying Quaker Oats as the potential acquirer before Erickson reveals it, mildly pressing on how serious the buyout plans were. | |
| The Parking Lot Epiphany and Walking Away | 2 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Erickson gives an emotional recap of walking around the block and breaking down in tears before backing out of the sale. Raz supports the story with gentle, affirmative questions. | |
| Buying Out the Partner and Managing $60M Debt | 4 | 2 | 1 | 3 | Raz challenges Erickson on why he refused an easy retirement with tens of millions to take on massive debt. Erickson explains the institutional power of a business over individual wealth. | |
| Clifford Erickson's Pride and Celebrity | 3 | 1 | 0 | 1 | Raz asks whether the mythological archetype of the fearless entrepreneur applied to Erickson, who confirms he never experienced genuine self-doubt during the journey. | |
| Passing the Torch: Employee Ownership | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Host closing monologue summarizing employee ownership milestones and providing podcast production credits. |
Statements from this episode (18)
Erickson: PowerBar was the dominant cyclist energy bar in 1990
“The only energy bar really that was on the market at that time that so many cyclists were eating... It was Power Bar. And they were also from Berkeley, coincidentally.”
Erickson: PowerBars functioned as fuel but never tasted good
“They just, they're hard. They were, they never really did taste good, but we always, as bike racers, we always thought of them as the bitter pill, that they do the job, but it's not about taste.”
Doug Gilmore designed Clif Bar's iconic rock climber packaging
“A real good friend that I was working with named Doug Gilmore, you know, we, I helped him out with some of the advertising for the bicycle company, and I knew that he was very, very creative person. I said, you need to design the package for me, and he came up…”
Clif Bar was named after Gary Erickson's father, Clifford
“So we named it Cliff Bar after my dad. My dad's name is Clifford Erickson.”
Erickson bootstrapped Clif Bar via outsourced baking and deferred payments
“So we tried to make it in our bakery, we just didn't have the equipment to do it. So I found a bakery down the street that agreed to help me produce it, like a, like almost like a cookie bakery. And we leveraged the packaging companies and said, We'll pay you.…”
PowerBar sued Clif Bar over ads, inadvertently creating industry buzz
“Our insurance picked up the tab, and we ended up settling with Power Bar, but it created this buzz in the bicycle industry where people said, hey, have you heard of Cliff Bar?”
Erickson: Taking outside capital causes founders to lose control of destiny
“You know, I never thought of either looking for outside money or wanting outside money, and maybe that was a good thing of my naivete, because once you do that, you know, you lose control of your destiny.”
Erickson financed Clif Bar with $20,000 from his father's credit card
“My father gave me off his credit card, 20,000 dollars, but most of it, I, man, I look back, and I kind of think, how did I pull this off?”
Clif Bar reached $700,000 in sales by the end of 1992
“By the end of 1992, we sold 700,000 dollars of Clif Bars.”
Clif Bar nearly doubled sales annually for eight consecutive years
“We almost doubled sales for the next eight years in a row.”
An early handshake deal led to an ownership lawsuit against Clif Bar
“So I did a handshake deal with a distributor in, you know, early nineties where it ended up biting me because they weren't performing. And so I canceled their quote contract and they came back and sued me for ownership.”
Clif Bar was the last major independent after PowerBar sold
“Power Bar was already, already sold, and Balance Bar was sold, so it was just, it was kind of just us as the third.”
Quaker Oats offered $120M for Clif Bar on $40M in sales
“We got a deal, we got an offer for a hundred and twenty million dollars on forty million dollars in sales.”
Erickson backed out of selling Clif Bar minutes before signing
“So halfway around the block, I decided not to sell the company, and then I felt completely free.”
Erickson took on $60M in debt to buy out his co-owner
“Secondly, my partner wanted out, so I had to negotiate a deal, and so that was seven months of negotiation, and third was I had to go out as, Our attorney says, dialing for dollars. I had to go find sixty million dollars.”
It took Clif Bar nine years to pay off its $60M debt
“And it took us nine years to pay off that thing.”