Sep 18, 2017 · 56m · how-i-built-this
The Chipmunks: Ross Bagdasarian Jr. & Janice Karman
Ross Bagdasarian Jr. · 24m spoken Guy Raz · 15m spoken Janice Karman · 9m spoken Daniel Webster Clark · 1m spoken Alvin Seville (Cartoon Clip) · 8s spoken Dave Seville (Cartoon Clip) · 1s spoken
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
In this episode of NPR's 'How I Built This', Guy Raz interviews Ross Bagdasarian Jr. and Janice Karman about how they resurrected, voiced, and transformed the legacy cartoon characters Alvin and the Chipmunks into a multi-billion-dollar global entertainment franchise while fiercely defending their independent intellectual property.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 32.3% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Guy as informed peer 2.5 Guest teaching 1.8 Guest disagreement 0.8 Guy pushing back 0.5
speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 46:22 Ross rejects Guy's financial motive framing
Ross firmly rejects Raz's premise that their legal clashes stemmed from feeling economically cheated by blockbuster revenues, stating adamantly that their fights were strictly over story and character integrity.
Hardest push from Guy ▶ 13:10 Guy plays devil's advocate for network execsRaz pushes back on Ross and Janice's frustration with years of rejection by defending why network executives in the late 1970s would reasonably dismiss the 1950s rodent franchise as an outdated relic.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 45:38 Ross corrects box office and revenue statsWhen Raz suggests the live-action Fox films made nearly a billion dollars, Ross Jr. immediately interrupts and corrects him, detailing that box office reached 1.3 billion and over 2 billion including DVD sales.
Guy holds their own ▶ 51:30 Guy shares original Liberty Records triviaRaz displays deep historical knowledge of the franchise by explaining that Alvin, Simon, and Theodore were named after Liberty Records executives Alvin Bennett, Simon Waroniker, and Theodore Keep.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Guy as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Guy pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Ross Bagdasarian Sr. and the Birth of the Chipmunks | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Guy Raz sets up the origin story of Ross Bagdasarian Sr. and the 1958 invention of the Chipmunks. Ross Jr. warmly recounts his childhood memories and his father's larger-than-life personality. | |
| Protecting the Legacy: Ross Jr. Goes to Law School | 2 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Ross Jr. explains how his father's sudden death led him to law school as legal martial arts to protect the family IP, followed by Janice and Ross detailing how they met. | |
| Years of Rejection and Unwavering Tenacity | 3 | 3 | 3 | 3 | Guy plays devil's advocate, suggesting TV executives were logical in rejecting a 1950s throwback. Ross Jr. and Janice strongly reject the premise, arguing that tenacity and deep character belief outweighed so-called industry experts. | |
| The Midnight Catalyst: The Chipmunk Punk Phenomenon | 2 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Janice and Ross recount how a Philadelphia DJ sped up a Blondie track, triggering the Chipmunk Punk record deal. Janice lightly corrects Guy on how recording pitch and speed manipulation actually work. | |
| Mastering the Voices: Finding Alvin's Persona | 2 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Ross and Janice demonstrate how they perform character voices at half-speed and discuss assembling veteran animation legends from Warner Bros to produce the NBC Christmas special. | |
| Saturday Morning Triumph and Friendly Competition | 3 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Guy asks if they viewed rival legacy franchises like Bugs Bunny and Peanuts as mortal enemies. Janice and Ross clarify they loved the characters and only wanted to crush rude studio executives. | |
| Mid-Episode Break: Teasing Trouble Ahead | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Guy Raz provides mid-roll narration recapping the NBC broadcast deal and teases the legal battles and business twists ahead. | |
| A Sold-Out Madison Square Garden Awakening | 2 | 3 | 0 | 0 | Ross and Janice describe being oblivious to their massive ratings until sitting in an aisle at a sold-out Madison Square Garden show and discovering the massive windfall of syndication rights. | |
| Betting on Quality: The Chipmunk Adventure | 2 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Ross Jr. explains how they invested nearly all their syndication earnings into funding the animated feature The Chipmunk Adventure to maintain quality despite marketing shortcomings. | |
| The Universal Deal and the Battle to Reclaim the Brand | 3 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Guy probes into how their Universal partnership turned sour when executive champions departed, leading Ross and Janice to file a lawsuit to buy back their company. | |
| Navigating the Legal Maze and Hibernation | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Ross and Janice explain the legal settlement timeline and why buying back their 25 percent stake for 2.5 million dollars was essential to revive the dormant IP. | |
| Partnering with 20th Century Fox on Proprietary Terms | 3 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Janice and Ross discuss warning prospective studio partners about their fiercely protective proprietary style and recount a painful early record promotion betrayal. | |
| Box Office Billions and Fighting for Creative Integrity | 3 | 4 | 3 | 1 | Ross corrects Guy's box office revenue estimate and reframes Guy's assumption that later lawsuits were about profit splits, clarifying their fights were strictly about story integrity. | |
| The Art of Creative Marriage and Shared Vision | 4 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Raz praises their creative marriage. Janice and Ross share their rule of mutual deference and a moving late-night TV coincidence involving Ross Sr., while Guy reveals the origin of the chipmunks' names. | |
| How You Built That: Daniel Webster Clark and RompHim | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | Guy Raz interviews guest Daniel Webster Clark in the How You Built That segment detailing the origin, prototyping, and viral launch of the RompHim. |
Statements from this episode (18)
Bagdasarian Jr.: Creators must understand legal contracts to maintain ownership
“There's creating what you do, and then there's continuing to own what you do, and those are tough things to do at both times unless you know how to protect yourself and contracts and so forth.”
Bagdasarian Jr. passed the bar in 1975 to protect family IP
“After he passed away, I immediately enrolled in law school. So I graduated and three years later in 75, passed the bar wasn't going to practice law, but wanted to know that with the music publishing and the things that I would hope to create later on, I wanted…”
Bagdasarian Jr.: There are no true experts in the entertainment industry
“What we came to realize is that there actually are no experts. You know, nobody really knows, and so I was just willing to put my belief above what other people were telling us”
The 1980 album 'Chipmunk Punk' sold over one million copies overnight
“As it turns out, it sold over a million albums overnight, and then the people at CBS and NBC and ABC, they, well, you know, all of a sudden they wanted to have lunch.”
Karman explains the Alvin and the Chipmunks half-speed vocal technique
“Well, it sounds, it's the same speed as we speak, but it's at a higher pitch.”
Bagdasarian and Karman hired legendary Looney Tunes animators for Christmas special
“Some of the great animators from Warner Brothers including Chuck Jones, and Phil Monroe, and Virgil Ross, and these guys who had done the greatest Bugs Bunny cartoons in the forties and fifties were available, and they weren't being used, and Janice and I hire…”
NBC paid $210,000 per half-hour episode for the 1980s Chipmunks series
“Back in those days, it was like 210,000 dollars for a half hour of shows.”
Ross Bagdasarian Sr. was the first songwriter to own masters and publishing
“He was the first songwriter who not only owned the publishing but also The master recordings.”
The 1980s Chipmunks animated series captured approximately 40% of television audiences
“Back in those days, Guy, we were getting like 40% of the audience was watching.”
The 1980s Chipmunks animated series drew 15 to 20 million weekly viewers
“Like twenty million a week, or 15 to twenty million a week.”
Bagdasarian Productions sold Chipmunks TV syndication rights for $25 million
“And then a couple years later, we sold those rights for twenty-five million dollars.”
NBC received zero revenue share from the $25 million Chipmunks syndication deal
“No, not at, NBC didn't get a piece at all.”
Bagdasarian Jr. invested the $25 million syndication windfall into a feature film
“We took most of that money and made an animated feature, The Chipmunk Adventure, and that, which came out in 87.”
Bagdasarian Jr. and Karman bought back Universal's Chipmunks stake for $2.5 million
“Two and a half million dollars for their-”
The 2007 Chipmunks film villain was based on a real record executive
“In any event, we're all excited and want to now talk about the national plans that they're going to do, and this is a quote, and it's, it, so it explains why David Cross is, as Ian is, is that character. So the record executive, the tells Janice and me, well w…”
The 20th Century Fox Chipmunks movies generated over $2 billion in revenue
“Yeah, they, their box office is about a billion three hundred million. And if you include the DVD sales, it's over two billion dollars in revenue.”