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Jul 30, 2020 · 18m · how-i-built-this

How I Built Resilience: Taha Bawa of Goodwall

Taha Bawa · 12m spoken Guy Raz · 4m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of NPR's How I Built This: Resilience Edition, host Guy Raz interviews Goodwall co-founder Taha Bawa about building a global social platform for youth, pivoting through economic disruptions, and empowering Generation Z in an uncertain job market.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Guy holds 28.9% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Guy as informed peer 3.5 Guest teaching 2.7 Guest disagreement 1.0 Guy pushing back 1.2
05100:0010:000:35–4:03 · Guy as informed peer 3/10 Explaining the Goodwall Platform and LinkedIn Comparisons Guy Raz probes Goodwall's core functionality and tests the common comparison to LinkedIn. Taha Bawa gently refines the premise, explaining why high school achievements like robotics or chess do not belong on traditional professional networks.4:04–8:20 · Guy as informed peer 5/10 The Founding Story and Humanitarian Inspiration for Goodwall Raz demonstrates strong preparation by citing Goodwall's headcount, international offices, and the harsh backdrop of tech layoffs. Bawa details their board-level scenario planning and adaptation through corporate-sponsored challenge programs.8:20–10:43 · Guy as informed peer 4/10 Economic Realities and Resilience for the Gen Z Demographic Raz contextualizes the Gen Z plight by drawing parallels to past Gen X stereotypes and post-2008 economic shocks. Bawa explains the labor market reality where young entrants are predictably first to be laid off and last to be hired.10:44–13:43 · Guy as informed peer 3/10 Mid-Interview Break and Upcoming Segment Preview Raz explores whether graduates should delay entering the workforce despite accumulating debt. Bawa provides practical alternatives like startup experimentation while contrasting American college debt with affordable Swiss tuition.13:44–16:43 · Guy as informed peer 4/10 Understanding Gen Z Workplace Expectations and Management Best Practices Raz shares employer-side perspectives on hiring entrepreneurial talent, asking how to manage younger workers. Bawa outlines modern management dynamics, emphasizing constructive feedback and psychological safety over top-down directives.16:43–17:50 · Guy as informed peer 2/10 Five-Year Vision for Goodwall and Concluding Reflections Raz invites Bawa to articulate his five-year horizon, concluding the interview amicably. Bawa highlights Goodwall's international reach across 150 countries and acknowledges their relative good fortune amid startup turmoil.0:35–4:03 · Guest teaching 3/10 Explaining the Goodwall Platform and LinkedIn Comparisons Guy Raz probes Goodwall's core functionality and tests the common comparison to LinkedIn. Taha Bawa gently refines the premise, explaining why high school achievements like robotics or chess do not belong on traditional professional networks.4:04–8:20 · Guest teaching 2/10 The Founding Story and Humanitarian Inspiration for Goodwall Raz demonstrates strong preparation by citing Goodwall's headcount, international offices, and the harsh backdrop of tech layoffs. Bawa details their board-level scenario planning and adaptation through corporate-sponsored challenge programs.8:20–10:43 · Guest teaching 3/10 Economic Realities and Resilience for the Gen Z Demographic Raz contextualizes the Gen Z plight by drawing parallels to past Gen X stereotypes and post-2008 economic shocks. Bawa explains the labor market reality where young entrants are predictably first to be laid off and last to be hired.10:44–13:43 · Guest teaching 4/10 Mid-Interview Break and Upcoming Segment Preview Raz explores whether graduates should delay entering the workforce despite accumulating debt. Bawa provides practical alternatives like startup experimentation while contrasting American college debt with affordable Swiss tuition.13:44–16:43 · Guest teaching 3/10 Understanding Gen Z Workplace Expectations and Management Best Practices Raz shares employer-side perspectives on hiring entrepreneurial talent, asking how to manage younger workers. Bawa outlines modern management dynamics, emphasizing constructive feedback and psychological safety over top-down directives.16:43–17:50 · Guest teaching 1/10 Five-Year Vision for Goodwall and Concluding Reflections Raz invites Bawa to articulate his five-year horizon, concluding the interview amicably. Bawa highlights Goodwall's international reach across 150 countries and acknowledges their relative good fortune amid startup turmoil.0:35–4:03 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Explaining the Goodwall Platform and LinkedIn Comparisons Guy Raz probes Goodwall's core functionality and tests the common comparison to LinkedIn. Taha Bawa gently refines the premise, explaining why high school achievements like robotics or chess do not belong on traditional professional networks.4:04–8:20 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Founding Story and Humanitarian Inspiration for Goodwall Raz demonstrates strong preparation by citing Goodwall's headcount, international offices, and the harsh backdrop of tech layoffs. Bawa details their board-level scenario planning and adaptation through corporate-sponsored challenge programs.8:20–10:43 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Economic Realities and Resilience for the Gen Z Demographic Raz contextualizes the Gen Z plight by drawing parallels to past Gen X stereotypes and post-2008 economic shocks. Bawa explains the labor market reality where young entrants are predictably first to be laid off and last to be hired.10:44–13:43 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Mid-Interview Break and Upcoming Segment Preview Raz explores whether graduates should delay entering the workforce despite accumulating debt. Bawa provides practical alternatives like startup experimentation while contrasting American college debt with affordable Swiss tuition.13:44–16:43 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Understanding Gen Z Workplace Expectations and Management Best Practices Raz shares employer-side perspectives on hiring entrepreneurial talent, asking how to manage younger workers. Bawa outlines modern management dynamics, emphasizing constructive feedback and psychological safety over top-down directives.16:43–17:50 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Five-Year Vision for Goodwall and Concluding Reflections Raz invites Bawa to articulate his five-year horizon, concluding the interview amicably. Bawa highlights Goodwall's international reach across 150 countries and acknowledges their relative good fortune amid startup turmoil.0:35–4:03 · Guy pushing back 2/10 Explaining the Goodwall Platform and LinkedIn Comparisons Guy Raz probes Goodwall's core functionality and tests the common comparison to LinkedIn. Taha Bawa gently refines the premise, explaining why high school achievements like robotics or chess do not belong on traditional professional networks.4:04–8:20 · Guy pushing back 2/10 The Founding Story and Humanitarian Inspiration for Goodwall Raz demonstrates strong preparation by citing Goodwall's headcount, international offices, and the harsh backdrop of tech layoffs. Bawa details their board-level scenario planning and adaptation through corporate-sponsored challenge programs.8:20–10:43 · Guy pushing back 1/10 Economic Realities and Resilience for the Gen Z Demographic Raz contextualizes the Gen Z plight by drawing parallels to past Gen X stereotypes and post-2008 economic shocks. Bawa explains the labor market reality where young entrants are predictably first to be laid off and last to be hired.10:44–13:43 · Guy pushing back 1/10 Mid-Interview Break and Upcoming Segment Preview Raz explores whether graduates should delay entering the workforce despite accumulating debt. Bawa provides practical alternatives like startup experimentation while contrasting American college debt with affordable Swiss tuition.13:44–16:43 · Guy pushing back 1/10 Understanding Gen Z Workplace Expectations and Management Best Practices Raz shares employer-side perspectives on hiring entrepreneurial talent, asking how to manage younger workers. Bawa outlines modern management dynamics, emphasizing constructive feedback and psychological safety over top-down directives.16:43–17:50 · Guy pushing back 0/10 Five-Year Vision for Goodwall and Concluding Reflections Raz invites Bawa to articulate his five-year horizon, concluding the interview amicably. Bawa highlights Goodwall's international reach across 150 countries and acknowledges their relative good fortune amid startup turmoil.

speaking balance: gold is Guy, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Guy 34.5% · guest 65.5%0:00 · Guy 34.5% · guest 65.5%3:00 · Guy 2.3% · guest 97.7%3:00 · Guy 2.3% · guest 97.7%6:00 · Guy 38.1% · guest 61.9%6:00 · Guy 38.1% · guest 61.9%9:00 · Guy 45.3% · guest 54.7%9:00 · Guy 45.3% · guest 54.7%12:00 · Guy 20.7% · guest 79.3%12:00 · Guy 20.7% · guest 79.3%15:00 · Guy 19.5% · guest 80.5%15:00 · Guy 19.5% · guest 80.5%18:00 · Guy 100% · guest 0%18:00 · Guy 100% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 1:14 Pushing back on the LinkedIn analogy

Bawa politely rejects Raz's framing of Goodwall as just a youth LinkedIn, pointing out that high school extracurricular content does not fit standard professional platforms.

 Hardest push from Guy ▶ 6:00 Pressing on economic slowdown and tech layoffs

Raz confronts Bawa with grim macroeconomic data and major competitor layoffs, demanding to know how Goodwall's revenue survived.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 13:15 Highlighting international higher education disparities

Bawa educates the audience on structural education costs, contrasting staggering US student debt against his thousand-dollar-per-year Swiss undergraduate tuition.

 Guy holds their own ▶ 6:00 Listing Goodwall's global footprint and headwinds

Raz displays thorough reporting by detailing Goodwall's 50-person headcount and international branch network before challenging their runway.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicGuy as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementGuy pushing backWhy
Explaining the Goodwall Platform and LinkedIn Comparisons 3322 Guy Raz probes Goodwall's core functionality and tests the common comparison to LinkedIn. Taha Bawa gently refines the premise, explaining why high school achievements like robotics or chess do not belong on traditional professional networks.
The Founding Story and Humanitarian Inspiration for Goodwall 5212 Raz demonstrates strong preparation by citing Goodwall's headcount, international offices, and the harsh backdrop of tech layoffs. Bawa details their board-level scenario planning and adaptation through corporate-sponsored challenge programs.
Economic Realities and Resilience for the Gen Z Demographic 4311 Raz contextualizes the Gen Z plight by drawing parallels to past Gen X stereotypes and post-2008 economic shocks. Bawa explains the labor market reality where young entrants are predictably first to be laid off and last to be hired.
Mid-Interview Break and Upcoming Segment Preview 3411 Raz explores whether graduates should delay entering the workforce despite accumulating debt. Bawa provides practical alternatives like startup experimentation while contrasting American college debt with affordable Swiss tuition.
Understanding Gen Z Workplace Expectations and Management Best Practices 4311 Raz shares employer-side perspectives on hiring entrepreneurial talent, asking how to manage younger workers. Bawa outlines modern management dynamics, emphasizing constructive feedback and psychological safety over top-down directives.
Five-Year Vision for Goodwall and Concluding Reflections 2100 Raz invites Bawa to articulate his five-year horizon, concluding the interview amicably. Bawa highlights Goodwall's international reach across 150 countries and acknowledges their relative good fortune amid startup turmoil.

Statements from this episode (6)

Insight
Bawa: Confidence and success stem from formative experiences rather than innate ability
“I'm here Not because I'm smart, but because I was lucky. I was born, I could have been born two doors down, and that my life would have been very different. And I'm confident because of the experiences I had rather than because I'm innately able to do so.”
Taha Bawa Jul 30, 2020 ▶ 4:43
Opinion
Bawa: Youth are likely to suffer economically as last hired, first fired
“It's very probable that youth, at least in the short run, are to suffer. They're normally the last to be hired, the first to be fired, and that's justified for various reasons, including ethical.”
Taha Bawa Jul 30, 2020 ▶ 9:19
Insight
Bawa: Enterprise CHROs prioritize job candidates who demonstrate entrepreneurial abilities
“You know, when we talk to CHROs of some of the leading companies in the world, what are they looking for? Or what were they looking for before the crisis? And definitely after is that ability to be entrepreneurial, even if you're working for a fortune 500.”
Taha Bawa Jul 30, 2020 ▶ 12:09
Disclosure
Bawa: Top Swiss university undergraduate tuition costs around $1,000 annually
“In Switzerland, for example, I paid for my undergraduate, I paid around a thousand dollars a year. It's a leading education. I mean, it's like a, you know, one of the top universities.”
Taha Bawa Jul 30, 2020 ▶ 13:25
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Bawa: Post-COVID Gen Z will mirror the post-WWII generation's financial consciousness
“Coming out of this, generally on the whole, there's good reason to believe that this generation is going to be really conscious, a bit like after World War II really conscious of financials, very conscious of how lucky they are, how privileged, how quickly thi…”
Taha Bawa Jul 30, 2020 ▶ 14:48
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Bawa: Startup founders saw massive financing term sheets evaporate during COVID-19
“I've, I have friends who had term sheets for massive rounds of financing just evaporate”
Taha Bawa Jul 30, 2020 ▶ 17:25
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