Feb 1, 2023 · 58m · we-live-to-build
Every New Level Has a New Devil - He Proved It From $5M to $75M
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
In this podcast episode, MIT45 CEO Ryan Niedel details his executive playbook for scaling an e-commerce botanical brand from $5 million to over $75 million in revenue. He shares actionable insights on financial restructuring, rigorous cGMP quality standards, decentralized decision-making, and cultivating an employee-first culture anchored in equity ownership.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Sean holds 19.8% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Sean as informed peer 3.0 Guest teaching 3.2 Guest disagreement 1.0 Sean pushing back 1.1
speaking balance: gold is Sean, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 55:17 Ryan rejects retirement in Bali framing
Ryan directly rejects Sean's recurring suggestion to relax without a phone on a beach in Bali, calling that total disengagement his 'seventh plane of hell.'
Hardest push from Sean ▶ 8:59 Sean challenges product verification and lab claimsSean pushes Ryan to substantiate his claims, asking directly whether lab reports and testing are publicly verifiable given frequent deceptive claims in the market.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 10:49 Ryan explains regulatory loopholes in supplements vs foodRyan educates Sean on the precise difference between Certificates of Analysis (COA) and GMP compliance, pointing out how the supplement industry can bypass pre-market testing.
Sean holds their own ▶ 23:50 Sean articulates executive talent alignment strategySean demonstrates his own founder experience by clearly explaining how he manages employee transitions and career alignment rather than treating departures as punitive firings.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Sean as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Sean pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Ryan Niedel's Entrepreneurial Journey and Past Failures | 1 | 2 | 1 | 0 | Ryan gives an extensive monologue recounting his entrepreneurial background, past failures, and entry into Kratom. Sean merely listens and offers a brief interjection. | |
| Understanding Kratom: Efficacy, Controversy, and Market Demand | 3 | 3 | 1 | 2 | Sean probes whether growth was pandemic-driven and raises addiction and legal risks in the industry. Ryan calmly addresses addiction potential and explains how his company removes habit-forming alkaloids. | |
| Quality Assurance: GMP Compliance and Rigorous Testing Standards | 3 | 6 | 1 | 3 | Sean directly asks if Ryan has public lab reports to substantiate claims and asks for clarification on acronyms. Ryan educates Sean on GMP compliance, COAs, and regulatory loopholes in the US supplement market. | |
| Consumer Trust and International Supply Chain Management | 4 | 5 | 1 | 1 | Ryan details how fixing uncollected receivables, FIFO/LIFO inventory, and cash-to-accrual accounting helped scale from $5M to $11M. Sean contributes his own philosophy on graciously transitioning employees. | |
| Upgrading Executive Leadership and Building Employee Ownership | 3 | 2 | 0 | 0 | Sean asks targeted follow-up questions about replacing executive leadership. Ryan explains the strategy of hiring leaders who have traversed the next operational tier and issuing equity across the company. | |
| Scaling from $25M to $50M: Acquiring Manufacturing and Optimizing Sales | 2 | 3 | 0 | 0 | Ryan details scaling from $25M to $50M by acquiring two GMP facilities and hiring proven sales leadership. Sean actively listens with supportive commentary. | |
| Scaling Beyond $50M: Decentralization and High-Velocity Decision-Making | 4 | 2 | 1 | 1 | Ryan outlines Bezos-style Type 1 and Type 2 decision-making frameworks. Sean shares his startup experience regarding decision error rates, which Ryan validates. | |
| Exit Strategies, Partner Dynamics, and Life-Changing Wealth Creation | 3 | 3 | 1 | 1 | Sean inquires about exit options, and Ryan provides a detailed breakdown of divergent partner timelines and private equity rollup mechanics. | |
| Employee-Centric Corporate Culture and the 6.5-Hour Workday | 3 | 4 | 2 | 1 | Ryan describes employee fringe benefits and the 6.5-hour workday. When Sean likens the model to European socialism, Ryan reframes it around protecting democracy without practicing it inside business decisions. | |
| Holistic Balance, Global Perspective, and Evolution of Leadership Thought | 4 | 2 | 2 | 2 | Sean shares his overseas experience learning patience in Asia and playfully pushes Ryan to disconnect on a beach in Bali. Ryan pushes back, stating complete disengagement would be his personal hell right now. |
Statements from this episode (17)
Niedel: Less than 2% of people have ever tried Kratom
“If you look at anecdotal third party research, less than two percent of the populace has ever tried it before.”
Niedel: Big Pharma opposes Kratom because it treats opioid addiction
“Big Pharma doesn't like Kratom because it helps people get off of opioid addiction.”
Niedel: MIT45 reached $70M to $75M in 2022 revenue
“The numbers aren't all the way tight from last year. We're certainly north of seventy million. We'll see what we have in some of those reserve accounts and what things look like, but in between 70 and seventy-five million is where we hit for 2022.”
Niedel: MIT45 sells ~600k bottles of core product monthly
“We sell about 600,000 bottles of our main product every month.”
Niedel: US supplement brands do not require pre-market testing
“You can create a supplement. You and I, Sean, can create a supplement together. We don't have to have it tested. We can take it to market. We can manufacture it. We can say it solves everything under the sun. And until the FDA or FTC pushes us to be able to ba…”
MIT45 had $1.6 million in uncollected receivables when Niedel joined
“So when I came in, we had 1.6 million in uncollected accounts receivable that no one even knew existed.”
Accounting error cost Niedel hundreds of millions on web hosting exit
“Here we are, this company running fifty million dollars a year in revenue, but we're not really. We're earning about twelve million in revenue on an accrual basis, which takes this company. I thought we were going to sell for hundreds of millions of dollars, a…”
Niedel: Employees rarely worsen when companies scale, role requirements simply change
“The person probably hasn't changed. They probably haven't become worse at what they do. Just the requirements have changed or our internal skills have changed. And so when that happens to me, instead of saying, okay, like you're fired, It's really acknowledgin…”
Niedel: Scale by hiring C-suite executives with experience beyond current stage
“It's starting to look for people that have already been past where we're going to. It's not allowing people to necessarily, especially in that C-suite roles, not have them learn on the job, right? I need people that have already been past that because I want t…”
Niedel: MIT45 converted to C-Corp and grants stock to all employees
“Another pivotal part, Sean was switching our corporation or switching our LLC into a C Corp. Really massaging some of the things that way and doing stock issuance to our entire team. So when you come on board with us, you're actually getting shares in, in the …”
Niedel: MIT45 will be one of the first publicly traded kratom companies
“I mean, our vision right now is certainly to be one of the first public, if not the first publicly traded Kratom company in the world. And our revenue is supporting that. Our growth is supporting that. There'll be some uniqueness to figure out what exchange to…”
Niedel: $54 million of MIT45's $75 million revenue is B2B
“Out of the 70, I'll say seventy-five million this year in revenue, fifty-four million of that is B to B for us.”
Niedel projects MIT45 will hit $150 million in revenue next year
“If I were to show you our forecast for next year, it's a hundred and twenty-five million without acquisitions, two acquisitions kind of hovering in the background. So I think we'll hit one 50 in, in total, total revenue as a business, right?”
Niedel: Private equity firms have a 92% to 98% success rate
“Private equity groups have like a 92%, 98% success rate over the past 10 years of picking winners.”
Niedel says MIT45's enterprise value significantly exceeds $150 million
“Our stock issuance was based off enterprise value of one hundred and fifty million dollars, and our enterprise value is significantly higher than that at this moment.”