The Exchanges

Q Well, you bought back 40% of the business. When, what year was that?

A Um, this was, uh, 2010 to 20 14. I think I was paying down that. My other partner was, uh, you know, a credit union. That was my early investor. And they owned about, you know, 15% of the cap table. They lent me money to buy, uh, you know, the equity from the, uh, the other partner, uh, here. And then eventually they said, could we be on the same plan? Could you convert my equity into debt? And I said, yeah, I can do it if we get to, uh, Reasonable numbers here as I'm, you know, still running a bootstrap company. And eventually there came a time when there was no cap table. There was just a single cell. I owned all of it. And there was some debt. And I, the first time we took capital, uh, from five M's, it was to clear out that debt and start thinking about growth again. And that was a, it's, it's a skip hop jump method, but you really do have a, you know, a wonderful sort of, you know, journey now that you look back at it, where Early investors made money and then you bootstrapped your way to pay, pay all of that off. And then eventually took capital to start thinking bigger scale and, you know, higher growth rates. And then you actually go from there. Now it's M and a, um, you know, um, and, and, you know, building for the next, uh, you know, uh, the next phase of the business.

AI assessment note: “this was, uh, 2010 to 20 14. I think I was paying down that.”

Q long tail kind of smaller and then you have, you know, a couple of bigger ones that make up a lot of your revenue. Yeah, that makes sense. Good. Um, walk me through kind of the, the, the backstory here. So you launched the company in 2014. What was your background? Are you kind of ex legal or ex kind of board seat holder or why get into the space?

A Absolutely. So, uh, when I graduated from Purdue in 2003, I started the, you know, the ensemble product line with the team that we put together in Lafayette, Indiana, and we got really good at secure collaboration and communication in the enterprise space. Right around, uh, when the, you know, iPads came out, which is, you know, April, 2013, we saw that the boardroom access to information suddenly became very attractive on an iPad, and everybody was trying to think about how, what's the best way to dish out this information. That's when we started The journey towards, uh, the boardrooms. I started this company in the Purdue Dom Room, and it was good to see us actually really get into the boardrooms eventually. Now we have some of the largest customers in the world using our product, including some, you know, uh, very, uh, amazing non-profits, uh, Supreme Court in our country is using our product, some of the Fortune, 500 companies, uh, some of the biggest banks and hospitals using our product. So it's, it's been actually really a gradual journey where we first learned Enterprise communication and collaboration. And then we nailed the use case. And at this point, I believe from everything that I see, we are the most tech forward boardroom solution in the market.

AI assessment note: “we saw that the boardroom access to information suddenly became very attractive on an iPad”

Q long tail kind of smaller and then you have, you know, a couple of bigger ones that make up a lot of your revenue. Yeah, that makes sense. Good. Um, walk me through kind of the, the, the backstory here. So you launched the company in 2014. What was your background? Are you kind of ex legal or ex kind of board seat holder or why get into the space?

A Absolutely. So, uh, when I graduated from Purdue in 2003, I started the, you know, the ensemble product line with the team that we put together in Lafayette, Indiana, and we got really good at secure collaboration and communication in the enterprise space. Right around, uh, when the, you know, iPads came out, which is, you know, April, 2013, we saw that the boardroom access to information suddenly became very attractive on an iPad, and everybody was trying to think about how, what's the best way to dish out this information. That's when we started The journey towards, uh, the boardrooms. I started this company in the Purdue Dom Room, and it was good to see us actually really get into the boardrooms eventually. Now we have some of the largest customers in the world using our product, including some, you know, uh, very, uh, amazing non-profits, uh, Supreme Court in our country is using our product, some of the Fortune, 500 companies, uh, some of the biggest banks and hospitals using our product. So it's, it's been actually really a gradual journey where we first learned Enterprise communication and collaboration. And then we nailed the use case. And at this point, I believe from everything that I see, we are the most tech forward boardroom solution in the market.

AI assessment note: “when I graduated from Purdue in 2003, I started the, you know, the ensemble”

Q Oh, wow. Okay. Had they learned about, was that because there were more seats using their platform or were they upselling more features that you hadn't built yet?

A More seats. And there were some technology that we really liked, uh, that has application in all board pursuits that we have. Um, I, I like this, you know, uh, you know, this transaction, mainly similar culture, gives access to talent. They're based in Toronto primarily. And then there were a team that was trying to get into the US market. We are, of course, well entrenched, you know, a couple hundred people working in different cities here in US. So we can bring eScribe product to the US market and we've had tremendous success with that. I'm sitting here in Laguna, um, you know, beach in California and, uh, you know, we just signed up Laguna beach as a customer, uh, you know, uh, two weeks ago. So lots of synergies and, you know, market expansion, some access to talent, and then certainly rounding out our portfolio in terms of covering all meetings, uh, public meetings, uh, you know, um, these are the public sector meetings, I should say. And then through onboard, um, you know, we are also, of course, doing private, uh, boards and then publicly listed companies and then also nonprofits.

AI assessment note: “More seats. And there were some technology that we really liked”

Q On some, on some, like, on, like E-N-S-M Ensemble?

A Spelled O-N, but yes, it's Ensemble. Exactly. So it was an employee collaboration product. And, you know, uh, to, to, uh, quickly summarize, we started with an employee collaboration tool and pivoted towards board collaboration because the intranets, uh, are toughers. Really became very important, especially when it comes to boards and, you know, uh, all the other folks that you work with. So we pivoted towards that market and then found a lot of success. And then now we've added Eastride. With all of this, the focus had become meetings, whether it's boards or committees or, you know, commissions and such. And the intranet product really kind of looked a little off center. So we actually got it to the right spot. There's a company called N Contracts that actually You know, uh, was doing a roll up on various employee collaboration tools. And that's where, uh, that team and that customer base is now gone.

AI assessment note: “Spelled O-N, but yes, it's Ensemble. Exactly.”

Q On some, on some, like, on, like E-N-S-M Ensemble?

A Spelled O-N, but yes, it's Ensemble. Exactly. So it was an employee collaboration product. And, you know, uh, to, to, uh, quickly summarize, we started with an employee collaboration tool and pivoted towards board collaboration because the intranets, uh, are toughers. Really became very important, especially when it comes to boards and, you know, uh, all the other folks that you work with. So we pivoted towards that market and then found a lot of success. And then now we've added Eastride. With all of this, the focus had become meetings, whether it's boards or committees or, you know, commissions and such. And the intranet product really kind of looked a little off center. So we actually got it to the right spot. There's a company called N Contracts that actually You know, uh, was doing a roll up on various employee collaboration tools. And that's where, uh, that team and that customer base is now gone.

AI assessment note: “Spelled O-N, but yes, it's Ensemble. Exactly.”

Q Oh, wow. Okay. Had they learned about, was that because there were more seats using their platform or were they upselling more features that you hadn't built yet?

A More seats. And there were some technology that we really liked, uh, that has application in all board pursuits that we have. Um, I, I like this, you know, uh, you know, this transaction, mainly similar culture, gives access to talent. They're based in Toronto primarily. And then there were a team that was trying to get into the US market. We are, of course, well entrenched, you know, a couple hundred people working in different cities here in US. So we can bring eScribe product to the US market and we've had tremendous success with that. I'm sitting here in Laguna, um, you know, beach in California and, uh, you know, we just signed up Laguna beach as a customer, uh, you know, uh, two weeks ago. So lots of synergies and, you know, market expansion, some access to talent, and then certainly rounding out our portfolio in terms of covering all meetings, uh, public meetings, uh, you know, um, these are the public sector meetings, I should say. And then through onboard, um, you know, we are also, of course, doing private, uh, boards and then publicly listed companies and then also nonprofits.

AI assessment note: “More seats. And there were some technology that we really liked”

Q Yep. Well, I mean, when you came on last and you talked about last year, and again, around August, 2500 customers paying 5000 dollar ACVs, you were at a twenty four million dollar run rate Then, and if you added eScribe revenue on top of that, you've got to be probably either flirting with or past thirty million at this point. Is that accurate?

A That is accurate. And, you know, ending the year, uh, you know, of course with a few big months, end of the year accurately, you know, we could, we could get to numbers that are higher than, you know, closer towards 35, 37. And, uh, you know, we'll, we'll go from there. We are also building the foundation for long-term success here. This, some of the go-to-market that we've, you know, uh, redone is, is keeping scale in mind. And, you know, our goal is to actually sustain this for three, four, five years as we actually really sort of, you know, uh, continue to, um, you know, uh, leverage all the, you know, opportunity That we see here. Some of the things that we find, uh, is available to us. Some of the talent that's actually becoming available, uh, you know, uh, with every step here.

AI assessment note: “That is accurate. And, you know, ending the year... closer towards 35, 37.”

Q because you want them to be incentivized to stick around and build the now combined business together. So, I mean, can you share a little bit in terms of like what, you know, there's a total deal price of X, which you probably can't share, but of X, What percent did you allow to be sort of, you know, cash take off the table versus stock in the parent company?

A You know, there was not, you know, a very simple rule, unfortunately, and I'm trying to form my own, um, you know, uh, framework around this, but a good rule of thumb is, you know, you take half off and then, you know, in the new combined entity, you are back on the schedule to get some more options. So you are actually back in the Western schedule. Now, what people quickly see, especially a year into this, you know, they clearly see is that, you know, uh, the next, this is a step from Where they were earlier, you know, in terms of the rigors of planning, the rigors of recruitment, the rigors of, you know, just, uh, um, you know, uh, investments that go into sales and marketing. And that's been the story. If you asked me last one year, we've gone from, you know, 20, 30 people combined in sales and marketing to maybe 60, 70 people. That's been a bulk of my life.

AI assessment note: “a good rule of thumb is, you know, you take half off”

Q So very capital efficient. That's great. Was the majority of the deal all cash or do they now have a bunch of stock and onboard?

A No, I think the employees actually, you know, they all rolled. They were the, you know, the core group, and actually really sort of in a deeper L-one, L-twos were vested, and they got a chance to roll here, and some of them cashed out because they've been invested for a long time. I really like these transactions, especially when I think about being a, you know, somebody who started a bootstrap business too. You can only hold on to all of that for five, 10, 15 years while everybody else around you is actually Either working for big tech where they're making big, big dollars every year, or they're seeing these, you know, short run startup cycles. This is a great chance to stay in the same business, stay on the same mission while you get to take some chips off. So we saw a little bit of that, uh, you know, in this transaction as well.

AI assessment note: “they got a chance to roll here, and some of them cashed out”

Q So very capital efficient. That's great. Was the majority of the deal all cash or do they now have a bunch of stock and onboard?

A No, I think the employees actually, you know, they all rolled. They were the, you know, the core group, and actually really sort of in a deeper L-one, L-twos were vested, and they got a chance to roll here, and some of them cashed out because they've been invested for a long time. I really like these transactions, especially when I think about being a, you know, somebody who started a bootstrap business too. You can only hold on to all of that for five, 10, 15 years while everybody else around you is actually Either working for big tech where they're making big, big dollars every year, or they're seeing these, you know, short run startup cycles. This is a great chance to stay in the same business, stay on the same mission while you get to take some chips off. So we saw a little bit of that, uh, you know, in this transaction as well.

AI assessment note: “I think the employees actually, you know, they all rolled... some of them cashed out”

Q because you want them to be incentivized to stick around and build the now combined business together. So, I mean, can you share a little bit in terms of like what, you know, there's a total deal price of X, which you probably can't share, but of X, What percent did you allow to be sort of, you know, cash take off the table versus stock in the parent company?

A You know, there was not, you know, a very simple rule, unfortunately, and I'm trying to form my own, um, you know, uh, framework around this, but a good rule of thumb is, you know, you take half off and then, you know, in the new combined entity, you are back on the schedule to get some more options. So you are actually back in the Western schedule. Now, what people quickly see, especially a year into this, you know, they clearly see is that, you know, uh, the next, this is a step from Where they were earlier, you know, in terms of the rigors of planning, the rigors of recruitment, the rigors of, you know, just, uh, um, you know, uh, investments that go into sales and marketing. And that's been the story. If you asked me last one year, we've gone from, you know, 20, 30 people combined in sales and marketing to maybe 60, 70 people. That's been a bulk of my life.

AI assessment note: “a good rule of thumb is, you know, you take half off”

Q That was still the hot, hot, hot time. The market hadn't crashed yet. What, what revenue multiple did you pay for the business?

A Uh, you know, I don't know if I can really, you know, share the revenue of multiple, uh, but I, I say actually, you know, there was some, you know, uh, uh, I would say similar multiples. You know, that market was actually really, you know, 10 to 15 X sort of multiples. It was a good market. Um, and then, you know, we, uh, got ensemble, uh, you know, sort of packaged and off to end contracts also in the same timeframe. And now we are seeing actually really sort of, you know, first year anniversary of raising money and doing these transactions, all of that come through. We're seeing a growth rate sort of justify all of that. Yeah. The valuations were, you know, crazy in the Valley. Remember I was in the Midwest, you know, still raising money from there. And we, I was conscious of finding the right partner, not the one who's giving us the highest multiple, but the one who had the best chance of getting us to Sort of, you know, where I think would be, uh, the right spot for this business.

AI assessment note: “I don't know if I can really, you know, share the revenue of multiple”

Q That was still the hot, hot, hot time. The market hadn't crashed yet. What, what revenue multiple did you pay for the business?

A Uh, you know, I don't know if I can really, you know, share the revenue of multiple, uh, but I, I say actually, you know, there was some, you know, uh, uh, I would say similar multiples. You know, that market was actually really, you know, 10 to 15 X sort of multiples. It was a good market. Um, and then, you know, we, uh, got ensemble, uh, you know, sort of packaged and off to end contracts also in the same timeframe. And now we are seeing actually really sort of, you know, first year anniversary of raising money and doing these transactions, all of that come through. We're seeing a growth rate sort of justify all of that. Yeah. The valuations were, you know, crazy in the Valley. Remember I was in the Midwest, you know, still raising money from there. And we, I was conscious of finding the right partner, not the one who's giving us the highest multiple, but the one who had the best chance of getting us to Sort of, you know, where I think would be, uh, the right spot for this business.

AI assessment note: “I don't know if I can really, you know, share the revenue of multiple”