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Dec 9, 2020 · 22m · top-founders

FanDuel Co-Founder Launched New Relationship App Idea, $2m Raised

Leslie Eccles · 10m spoken Nathan Latka · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

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FanDuel co-founder Leslie Eccles discusses raising seed capital and scaling Relish, a direct-to-consumer relationship coaching app, while reflecting on the financing, regulatory, and operational lessons from her previous venture.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Nathan holds 43.3% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Nathan as informed peer 4.8 Guest teaching 4.4 Guest disagreement 4.4 Nathan pushing back 5.6
05100:0010:0020:001:34–5:45 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Introducing Leslie Eccles and the Relish Relationship Platform Latka explores Relish's B2C direct-to-consumer model and questions why an app is necessary for relationships. He pushes on her initial MVP validation, jokingly asking if early beta users just lied to her face, which Eccles parries with dry humor.5:45–8:58 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 Engineering Distribution, Backend Algorithms, and Relish Coaching Economics Latka drills into unit economics, questioning how Relish can offer human coaching on a $100 annual plan. Eccles explains that coaching interactions are strictly structured around milestones rather than an open chat format like Talkspace.8:58–12:26 · Nathan as informed peer 5/10 FanDuel Download Metrics and Paddy Power Betfair Merger Debate Eccles refuses to disclose exact paying subscriber counts, prompting Latka to pivot to her past at FanDuel. Latka aggressively challenges her distinction between an acquisition and a merger, leading Eccles to explain the corporate structuring of Panda Company.12:26–15:38 · Nathan as informed peer 4/10 Sponsor Break: Frictionless Enterprise Identity Management With Ping Identity Following the sponsor break, Latka assumes the founders exited due to secondary liquidity from private equity. Eccles firmly corrects his narrative, stating founders took no secondary and left only after the FTC blocked the DraftKings merger.15:38–20:17 · Nathan as informed peer 6/10 Mobile Paywall Testing, Subscription Pricing Elasticity, and Funnel Optimization Latka pushes for app conversion benchmarks and asks about successful paywall experiments. When Eccles describes failing an experiment by giving users too many plan options, Latka points out basic conversion rate optimization principles about decision friction.1:34–5:45 · Guest teaching 2/10 Introducing Leslie Eccles and the Relish Relationship Platform Latka explores Relish's B2C direct-to-consumer model and questions why an app is necessary for relationships. He pushes on her initial MVP validation, jokingly asking if early beta users just lied to her face, which Eccles parries with dry humor.5:45–8:58 · Guest teaching 4/10 Engineering Distribution, Backend Algorithms, and Relish Coaching Economics Latka drills into unit economics, questioning how Relish can offer human coaching on a $100 annual plan. Eccles explains that coaching interactions are strictly structured around milestones rather than an open chat format like Talkspace.8:58–12:26 · Guest teaching 6/10 FanDuel Download Metrics and Paddy Power Betfair Merger Debate Eccles refuses to disclose exact paying subscriber counts, prompting Latka to pivot to her past at FanDuel. Latka aggressively challenges her distinction between an acquisition and a merger, leading Eccles to explain the corporate structuring of Panda Company.12:26–15:38 · Guest teaching 7/10 Sponsor Break: Frictionless Enterprise Identity Management With Ping Identity Following the sponsor break, Latka assumes the founders exited due to secondary liquidity from private equity. Eccles firmly corrects his narrative, stating founders took no secondary and left only after the FTC blocked the DraftKings merger.15:38–20:17 · Guest teaching 3/10 Mobile Paywall Testing, Subscription Pricing Elasticity, and Funnel Optimization Latka pushes for app conversion benchmarks and asks about successful paywall experiments. When Eccles describes failing an experiment by giving users too many plan options, Latka points out basic conversion rate optimization principles about decision friction.1:34–5:45 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Introducing Leslie Eccles and the Relish Relationship Platform Latka explores Relish's B2C direct-to-consumer model and questions why an app is necessary for relationships. He pushes on her initial MVP validation, jokingly asking if early beta users just lied to her face, which Eccles parries with dry humor.5:45–8:58 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Engineering Distribution, Backend Algorithms, and Relish Coaching Economics Latka drills into unit economics, questioning how Relish can offer human coaching on a $100 annual plan. Eccles explains that coaching interactions are strictly structured around milestones rather than an open chat format like Talkspace.8:58–12:26 · Guest disagreement 6/10 FanDuel Download Metrics and Paddy Power Betfair Merger Debate Eccles refuses to disclose exact paying subscriber counts, prompting Latka to pivot to her past at FanDuel. Latka aggressively challenges her distinction between an acquisition and a merger, leading Eccles to explain the corporate structuring of Panda Company.12:26–15:38 · Guest disagreement 7/10 Sponsor Break: Frictionless Enterprise Identity Management With Ping Identity Following the sponsor break, Latka assumes the founders exited due to secondary liquidity from private equity. Eccles firmly corrects his narrative, stating founders took no secondary and left only after the FTC blocked the DraftKings merger.15:38–20:17 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Mobile Paywall Testing, Subscription Pricing Elasticity, and Funnel Optimization Latka pushes for app conversion benchmarks and asks about successful paywall experiments. When Eccles describes failing an experiment by giving users too many plan options, Latka points out basic conversion rate optimization principles about decision friction.1:34–5:45 · Nathan pushing back 4/10 Introducing Leslie Eccles and the Relish Relationship Platform Latka explores Relish's B2C direct-to-consumer model and questions why an app is necessary for relationships. He pushes on her initial MVP validation, jokingly asking if early beta users just lied to her face, which Eccles parries with dry humor.5:45–8:58 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Engineering Distribution, Backend Algorithms, and Relish Coaching Economics Latka drills into unit economics, questioning how Relish can offer human coaching on a $100 annual plan. Eccles explains that coaching interactions are strictly structured around milestones rather than an open chat format like Talkspace.8:58–12:26 · Nathan pushing back 7/10 FanDuel Download Metrics and Paddy Power Betfair Merger Debate Eccles refuses to disclose exact paying subscriber counts, prompting Latka to pivot to her past at FanDuel. Latka aggressively challenges her distinction between an acquisition and a merger, leading Eccles to explain the corporate structuring of Panda Company.12:26–15:38 · Nathan pushing back 7/10 Sponsor Break: Frictionless Enterprise Identity Management With Ping Identity Following the sponsor break, Latka assumes the founders exited due to secondary liquidity from private equity. Eccles firmly corrects his narrative, stating founders took no secondary and left only after the FTC blocked the DraftKings merger.15:38–20:17 · Nathan pushing back 5/10 Mobile Paywall Testing, Subscription Pricing Elasticity, and Funnel Optimization Latka pushes for app conversion benchmarks and asks about successful paywall experiments. When Eccles describes failing an experiment by giving users too many plan options, Latka points out basic conversion rate optimization principles about decision friction.

speaking balance: gold is Nathan, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Nathan 56.7% · guest 43.3%0:00 · Nathan 56.7% · guest 43.3%3:00 · Nathan 33.9% · guest 66.1%3:00 · Nathan 33.9% · guest 66.1%6:00 · Nathan 29.4% · guest 70.6%6:00 · Nathan 29.4% · guest 70.6%9:00 · Nathan 32.9% · guest 67.1%9:00 · Nathan 32.9% · guest 67.1%12:00 · Nathan 72.4% · guest 27.6%12:00 · Nathan 72.4% · guest 27.6%15:00 · Nathan 43.5% · guest 56.5%15:00 · Nathan 43.5% · guest 56.5%18:00 · Nathan 24.3% · guest 75.7%18:00 · Nathan 24.3% · guest 75.7%21:00 · Nathan 70.8% · guest 29.2%21:00 · Nathan 70.8% · guest 29.2%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 14:47 Guest rejects speculative exit narrative

Eccles bluntly refutes Latka's theory that founders left FanDuel for a shiny new opportunity after cashing out, telling him to 'do the sums' himself.

 Hardest push from Nathan ▶ 13:52 Host insists merger is just PR positioning for acquisition

Latka refuses Eccles's framing of the Paddy Power deal, arguing that if no founders remained at the company, it was functionally an acquisition.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 11:18 Guest explains Panda Company merger structure

Eccles details the legal entity mechanics of Panda Company merging with US assets, showing Latka why it legally and operationally was not a standard sale or cash exit.

 Nathan holds their own ▶ 18:26 Host demonstrates CRO knowledge over paywall choices

Latka presses Eccles on why she was surprised that adding multiple options reduced conversion, citing standard optimization principles regarding choice friction.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicNathan as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementNathan pushing backWhy
Introducing Leslie Eccles and the Relish Relationship Platform 4234 Latka explores Relish's B2C direct-to-consumer model and questions why an app is necessary for relationships. He pushes on her initial MVP validation, jokingly asking if early beta users just lied to her face, which Eccles parries with dry humor.
Engineering Distribution, Backend Algorithms, and Relish Coaching Economics 5425 Latka drills into unit economics, questioning how Relish can offer human coaching on a $100 annual plan. Eccles explains that coaching interactions are strictly structured around milestones rather than an open chat format like Talkspace.
FanDuel Download Metrics and Paddy Power Betfair Merger Debate 5667 Eccles refuses to disclose exact paying subscriber counts, prompting Latka to pivot to her past at FanDuel. Latka aggressively challenges her distinction between an acquisition and a merger, leading Eccles to explain the corporate structuring of Panda Company.
Sponsor Break: Frictionless Enterprise Identity Management With Ping Identity 4777 Following the sponsor break, Latka assumes the founders exited due to secondary liquidity from private equity. Eccles firmly corrects his narrative, stating founders took no secondary and left only after the FTC blocked the DraftKings merger.
Mobile Paywall Testing, Subscription Pricing Elasticity, and Funnel Optimization 6345 Latka pushes for app conversion benchmarks and asks about successful paywall experiments. When Eccles describes failing an experiment by giving users too many plan options, Latka points out basic conversion rate optimization principles about decision friction.

Statements from this episode (11)

Disclosure
Relish charges $100 per year for a two-person B2C subscription
“It's 100% B to C. We're in direct consumer. That's my background. And You know, I think it's the right way to go for this product. It's an annual subscription, a hundred dollars a year for two people.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 1:53
Disclosure
Relish raised a $2.2M seed round in late 2018
“2.2.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 4:04
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Relish has a total team size of 10 people
“We have 10.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 5:54
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Relish has accumulated approximately 50,000 app downloads
“So we have about 50,000 downloads.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 9:12
Assertion Supported
FanDuel and Paddy Power Betfair transaction formed a new company called Panda
“The way that this deal was created was there was a new company created, which was called Panda Company. And that was created by the FanDuel board. And that company was merged with the US assets of Paddy Power Bitfair. And that came together to create a new com…”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 11:18
Assertion Supported
None of FanDuel's co-founders stayed post-merger with Paddy Power Betfair
“None of the founders stayed.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 11:57
Assertion Supported
FanDuel raised capital from Shamrock in 2014 and KKR in 2015
“We took money in 2014 from Shamrock and we took KKR in 2015.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 12:19
Assertion Not publicly verifiable
FanDuel founders were barred from taking secondary liquidity during KKR round
“There was no secondary. The founders were not allowed to take secondary.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 13:28
Assertion Supported
FanDuel founders left the company without liquidity before starting new ventures
“We all left FanDuel way before we started new companies. Let me put it that way. Okay. This was not oh, there's a shiny bright new thing over there that I want to go and do. That was not this case. And we didn't take any liquidity from the company.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 14:48
Assertion Supported
FanDuel founders left after the FTC blocked the DraftKings merger
“We left after the FTC blocked the merger with DraftKings.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 15:32
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Offering multiple paywall choices dropped Relish's conversion rate by 25%
“The conversion was like, 25% lower than it had been when there was just one option on the paywall.”
Leslie Eccles Dec 9, 2020 ▶ 18:38
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