The Exchanges

Q If you watch Superman, I mean, you seem like you've had, um, you know, a lot of successes. It doesn't go into a lot of failures. Are there any that stand out to you in terms of?

A I think most of the ones that stand out to me are with Alice, because he was the one that I took the most amount of chances with. We've had so many with him. I think in the movie, I tell the cannon story. We, uh, got our first stadium date at Three River Stadium in Pittsburgh. I was trying to think of what would Alice Cooper do at a baseball stadium? Like, that big, gigantic, how do we use that space to do something really unique? And for some reason, getting shot out of a cannon across the stadium sort of hit my head. That that would be like an Alice Cooper thing to do. Big, dramatic, I could do by flame light and a big explosion. So I went to Warner Brothers Studios, who had built my guillotines and, and other props for us, and I, there was an old man there with little half glasses who did all our stuff and told him this idea, and he didn't even look up at me. He said, what period canon? And it was the most confident answer I've ever gotten on a bizarre question. And I told him he went to a jury and he pulled out blueprints. So I thought I was home. Completely confident. Alice, sweetheart, baby, you're gonna, she get shot out of a cannon. Really? Cover it. I got it. So he builds this, uh, forty-foot, three-ton or four-ton cannon. And the gag was that the lights go down, the whole band goes to torchlight, except for the drummer who's on a snare. They take Alice in a procession…

AI assessment note: “I think most of the ones that stand out to me are with Alice”

Q Have you maintained integrity in an industry that seems, at least from the outside, notorious for a lack of integrity, a lack of relationship? You've never had a contract with allies?

A Never had a contract with any of my artists. The only artist I ever had a contract with was Ann Murray, whose lawyer made me sign a contract. That's the only one I ever had a contract with. It doesn't mean anything. It's meaningless. They want to leave. Goodbye. No problem. The way I do my business, it's all based on trust. They have to trust me, and I have to trust them. And if we don't have that trust, for me, it doesn't work because of what I'm looking to get out of it selfishly for me, which is to be able to win, and win in a way that everybody else wins. Win-win. So if they don't trust me, and I don't trust them, and they don't, why are we doing this for?

AI assessment note: “Never had a contract with any of my artists... it's all based on trust.”

Q Totally. Is that what made you, you became a parole officer, I think, for a day or two?

A Yeah, that was just to buy lunch. Oh, okay. And a little bit of altruism. You know, I don't know if it was watching the Western movies, Um, I don't know if it was the Jewish culture of, of understanding that I was from a group of humans who had been persecuted for whatever the reasons were. I was very quiet. I sort of stayed in my room most of my, till I got to college. But I always had this vision of, um, really, you know, silly vision of myself on a white horse. Like charging in and saving the day. When I saw the job for the parole officer, it was really one of the first times I manifested that. I was at the New School for Social Research in New York. I was a psychedelic head. Um, it was during the Reagan era. Um, there was a big song called, I want to wear a flower in my hair and go to San Francisco. I love that song. At the new school, they came in recruiting for parole officers for California, because we were all sociology majors. There were, the only two jobs you could get was parole officer, social worker. That's all sociology in those days led towards And I didn't graduate, but I said, geez, what an opportunity. The guy said, you don't have to. You can still apply. And I said, what a great opportunity to save these kids from Ronald Reagan. And, you know, my image was kids up against the wall at the whiskey, and long hairs up against the wall, and Latinos up against the …

AI assessment note: “Yeah, that was just to buy lunch. Oh, okay. And a little bit of altruism.”

Q Do you think we're going to see more of this in sort of like with the backdrop of counterculture to algorithmic?

A I think it's always the same. I think, you know, there's people who come through in every generation that are artists who see it. You know, you look at Lady Gaga today, she's exactly what Alice was 40 years ago. Yeah, I think it's basically the same. Just the economics change, the delivery systems change, but it's the same kind of thing. You know, it's just figuring out how to get attention and then having the real goods behind the curtain. I remember a moment in my life where I would walk past my kids' room, they were playing hip-hop music, I opened up the door and said, would you turn that shit off? And as soon as I said it, I shut the door and said to myself, that's the next big thing, because that's the way the cycle works. Anything I don't like, they're going for.

AI assessment note: “I think it's basically the same. Just the economics change, the delivery systems change”

Q What's it like dealing with all of these egos, I would imagine, as people became more famous? Do you think that revealed who they are, or do you think it changed who they are?

A Once I did Alice and Ann Murray, what I realized fairly early was the toughest thing was dealing with the fame. That was really the hardest thing for, and it was the thing that was completely out of my control. Just out of my control. I couldn't fill it, you know, psychologically. So what I did is I set up a rule in my office that we didn't take acts until after they had already had a number one act, uh, record, and they were meaningful on the road. Um, I think we set our barrier at five, 3500 people or something, so that they had already been tested. If they were going to drop out from fame, They had this shit together. We may take it to a new level, but at least Alice was the only act I ever created. Ann Murray even had a number one record when I took it, but it was Snowbird. So that was my filter system, so I didn't waste my time.

AI assessment note: “what I realized fairly early was the toughest thing was dealing with the fame”

Q What's the difference? I mean, I would imagine a lot of people are sort of in this for money versus sort of like in it to serve.

A Oh, I'm in it for money. There's no question I'm in it for money. But that's one of many things. I don't want to overstate it. Well, everybody's in it for money. All the artists are in it for money. I'm in it for money. It's those choices that you make. For example, the way I met Sammy. Alice was headlining in Orlando, Florida, an outdoor show. We were getting 3500 dollars, maybe. 2500 dollars as a headliner. The opening act was Montrose. They were getting a 150 dollars. They had five guys in the band. A hurricane came and blew the stage. The promoter didn't pay anyone. I knew that these guys had a 150 bucks. That's a fucking killer. That means you're not in a motel, you're all in one room. That night you're not in the one room.

AI assessment note: “Oh, I'm in it for money. There's no question I'm in it for money.”

Q When you guys were dating. How did that change you?

A Um, just fortified my feelings I had picked up through my association with, with Mr. Verge as a way in which you can live your life of service from a position of strength, not weakness. When I met His Holiness, they were exactly the same person. Compassionate to every living thing. I always thought with the two of them, the thing that always impressed me with both of them, although I never discussed it with either one, is no matter what we were doing, no matter what, didn't matter. They always saw the miracle in something before they saw the something. The holiness, he meets so many people. Every time he met a person, you could see that first And Mr. Virgé was the same, whether it was a, a chicken that came in to be cooked that night, or, um, a customer, or a flower, like that, the miracle of that essence of that thing came first, and you can't be anything but compassionate to it. So, you know, they were as compassionate to, like, a piece of paper as they were to their relative. They see the miracle in everything. So that's the way I sort of, that, that was my takeaway from both of them, and I, I try and incorporate that. I have not been able to do that in my political conversations.

AI assessment note: “just fortified my feelings I had picked up through my association with, with Mr. Verge”