The Exchanges

Q What exactly is tactical empathy and why does it matter?

A Um, it's effectively proactive listening based on patterns of behavior that are predicted by things like your five core emotions and neuroscience. Now originally, um, empathy was originally designed to not be sympathy. It's been contorted, convoluted into usage. These days people say if you have empathy, that means you sympathize, you have compassion. Empathy is just observing the other person's Emotions. And where it's you getting out of the way. Um, empathy, uh, from an Israeli to a Palestinian is for the Israeli to say, you hate us because you think we're a colonizing power that's bent on your extermination. That's not agreement. That's observing the other side's point of view. Palestinian to an Israeli. Uh, the world persecuted you. You feel that this is your homeland, which is taken away from you 2000 years ago. Ultimately, there was a global effort to exterminate you perpetrated by the Nazis in the 19 thirties. Most of the world stood back and watched. And then finally, you had, after all these years, you finally have a homeland, and this is the only place you feel safe. There was no agreement from either side on that. That's empathy. That's stating the other side's perspective. And that's the true application of empathy. We call the tactical empathy originally because it's a little why you tell a SEAL guy, no, we're not teaching you yoga breathing. We're teaching you tac…

AI assessment note: “it's effectively proactive listening based on patterns of behavior”

Q Interesting. So what about, um, What about negotiation in the way that people typically think about it? We were talking about money. How do you negotiate for a salary and do it in the right way?

A Uh, first of all, empathy is always about how does the other side see things? Empathy, tactical empathy. It's not sympathy. It's not compassion. It's not accurate. It's not the truth. If you can release yourself from all those things, it's not fair. How does the other side see things? So at the job, nobody ever goes to the boss unless they want something for themselves. So whether we like it or not, bosses, supervisors are conditioned to think of everybody as selfish. Because every time you come to me, you want, all you want is something for yourself. That's the reality. You didn't cause it. You're not selfish. However, when was the last time you went to the boss and say, Hey, is there more work I could do for free? I want to do more. I don't want to get compensated for it. I want to take more of a load off your shoulders and I don't need anything extra for it at all. I just gonna do it. Cause I want you to feel good. Like that doesn't happen. So what's the reality? You go to the boss cause you want something. Realize that that's the case. So you can walk in and say, look, boss, I'm probably going to seem like another selfish employee that only comes to you when I want something. That's an empathy statement. That's good. That's not saying that you are, or that's true, fair, or it's accurate. You say, I'm probably going to seem like, cause that's how you're going to seem. And th…

AI assessment note: “look, boss, I'm probably going to seem like another selfish employee”

Q Yeah, that is why do I want to say that? Like, why do we want to say that back to you? Cause that's my gut reaction.

A Yeah. I think there's, um, there is a fundamental human instinct for fairness, which, uh, the exploiters use against us on a regular basis. Like we call fair the F F word. And so why is it so powerful on a regular basis when somebody says to you like, I just want what's fair. You know, the, the manipulative negotiators learn that using that phrase will cause you, probably cause you to compromise your position because inside you'd be like, I don't want to be unfair. You don't want to be unfair. So I think when we call it out in the other way, then you say, yeah, you know, I gotta look out for my side, but you have to look out for yourself too. I know that that's the trigger. Now, why that's a trigger, my hypothesis, is that, you know, we are in fact wired for fairness.

AI assessment note: “there is a fundamental human instinct for fairness, which, uh, the exploiters use against us”

Q Okay. Do you think that that's true? And what do you know about tone and how to use it in conversations?

A Um, tone is like the spin on a football or a baseball. Like, uh, a baseball player wants to throw a strike. For the, for the tone to, for the ball to hit its target, it has to have spin. And so they throw a knuckleball, your baseball player pitches a ball that has no spin. That thing flies all over the place. Nobody knows where the hell it's going. The catcher doesn't know where it's going. And nobody knows it's going to miss the mark. So tone is very much like putting spin on a ball. It's essential for it to hit its target. And so then when you begin to experiment with it, and are fascinated by it, curious about it, and you start picking it up different ways. The great comedians. Chris Rock delivers his monologue in a monotone. Nobody's gonna laugh. But he starts adding his tone of voice. And it's, then everything hits the mark. So if you're interested in communicating verbally, you start studying tone. You start, you notice tone and you, and then if you want your words to be effective, And I started realizing a certain tone, just, it doesn't matter how nice I said what I said, or how nice the words were. If my tone was off, it ain't, it ain't gonna land. And so I want to be effective, and so I start to pay attention. And then hostage negotiations and the suicide hotline, they taught us, you know, the downward inflecting, calming tone. The late night FM DJ voice. And then I'm …

AI assessment note: “tone is like the spin on a football or a baseball.”

Q say with a certain, with a certainty that the level of manipulation by the mainstream media should not be overlooked when we look back on what exactly led to this moment. An election is also a negotiation, and many of the people with the megavones and pens have not been doing their jobs. What do you think about this? And what do you think we should do with this information?

A Recognize them for what they are, and what they are, not all of them, but the ones we're talking about are professional instigators. Now, when I'm with the Bureau of Crisis Response, on behalf of the U.S. government, so we end up in several G-Twenty conferences. You know, it's a G eight on steroids. They got all these people there, and they put them in different places in the world. And I'm there with Secret Service, Royal Canadian Mounted Police, and they're telling us about instigators, professional instigators. And then they show us how a crowd of peaceful demonstrators, numbering anywhere from 50 to 2000, Can be turned into a raging violent mob by six instigators. Only six instigators to turn a peaceful crowd of a thousand into a raging violent mob. And then they'd say, they put, they put themselves, they know how to do this. They put themselves in strategic positions around the crowd. So they don't look like they're together. And then they start to amplify the anger. And if you're in the crowd, you go like, oh, that guy said it. Oh, that guy said it. Oh, that guy said it. Now I'm angry. And the people with the megaphones are professional instigators. They want us at each other's throats. And I think if we're just aware that their intent is to instigate, whether they be with Fox news or whether they be with CNN, Their intent is to instigate. If you're then at least warned t…

AI assessment note: “Recognize them for what they are, and what they are... are professional instigators.”

Q talking to at any given point. How does one become more aware, not just of the other, which I think is what everybody obsesses with. Oh, well, what are they? Are they a narcissist? Are they aware of that? It's like, well, what, what am I, and what am I doing in this moment? How are you, how do you build self-awareness of how you show up in the world?

A Everything is learned, so it's nothing other than practice. And you try to get it a little at a time. People want to make these great leaps in ability. As opposed to getting a little bit better, a little at a time. Um, I'm a big fan of James Clear and Atomic Habits. Uh, like his masterclass. Gonna start having the people in my company. Watch the masterclass. And he's, he says, you know, just get a little bit better each day. James Clear will say, you know, get one percent better. They're gone. On my team says, get one degree better. Derek's, what I love about Derek's analogy is, you know, in terms of water, one degree better, not noticeable, not noticeable, then suddenly there's a breakthrough. Whether it's, you know, from ice to liquid or liquid to steam. And that, that tends to be what happens. You know, you get a little bit better incrementally, and then suddenly there's a big breakthrough, and that leap that you were looking for, that you wanted to make today, happened. But you built it up a little at a time. So, what do you got to do? You just try to get a little bit better each day. Practice. I think the biggest thing that we do is, unlike athletes, we don't practice in our heads. You know, if there's an interaction we could have done better, what, if we go over in our head again, we envision ourselves saying, making a really cutting remark. This is what I wish I would ha…

AI assessment note: “Everything is learned, so it's nothing other than practice.”