The Exchanges

Q up to amazing people in your community. One of the reasons I was actually scared, and didn't end up going to West Point for myself, is I sometimes wasn't very good with authority as a kid, and I, I thought it was interesting, you were on SEAL Team Six, and you stood up to authority and got fired earlier in your career. Can you tell us what happened with that?

A Yeah, well, I don't know if it was standing up to authority, or there was certainly a disagreement between my boss and I, but he was the commanding officer, and at the end of the day, the commanding officer makes the decisions at a command, rightfully so, and he didn't think I was particularly a good fit for the organization, so he kind of relieved me of my command, and essentially, I got fired, and you know, I always tell people, it's never good to get fired, it's really bad to get fired in the Navy, and it's particularly bad to get fired in the SEAL teams, because everybody knows who you are. And, and of course, everybody knew that I had been fired. So you, you kind of face this sort of existential, uh, problem that, well, do I continue on? Uh, do I decide to go another path? And, uh, and I went home that night after, uh, after he took me away from my job and I talked to my wife and, and she said, look, you've never quit at anything in your life. Don't start now. And it was the, probably the best advice I had in my career. And so I stayed the course. I got hired by, ah, another SEAL team, ah, SEAL Team Four, and, ah, and was able to resurrect my career and, and continue on.

AI assessment note: “there was certainly a disagreement between my boss and I... relieved me of my command”

Q gotta hear it. Tell us a little more, you know, I think a lot of us look up to SEALs and the culture there. You have some amazing stories of the discipline and how hard you had to try it in your book, Make Your Bed. Like, how does a SEAL think about solving a difficult problem, either a kinetic or diplomatic problem? How's that, what's that approach teach you?

A Yeah, you know, I think, uh, when you look at a, uh, a kinetic problem, let's say, so a, a raid, a, a mission like we would have conducted in Iraq or Afghanistan or anywhere else around the world, uh, you know, it, it is really about the depth of the planning. You know, people always see the movies and, you know, you see the movies and you see the seals going out and running the, the great missions and there's the, the, you know, the sexiness to the movie. What they don't see is the hours and hours and hours of deliberate planning that goes into this because movie makers aren't going to make You know, a picture about a bunch of seals in front of a whiteboard kind of phase diagramming out the plan. But when you've got a challenging plan, uh, or a challenging mission, you better have a good plan. You better have a plan. You better rehearse it. You better make sure you have all the resources you need to, to conduct it, conduct it safely, uh, and, and bring the boys back home. But, uh, but this is also where you lean on experience. So there were a lot of times during Iraq and Afghanistan where we had challenging missions And I would always bring in the men or the women that had the experience, that had seen this before, because rarely in warfare, and I would offer rarely in, whether it's diplomacy or rarely in the corporate world, Is there a situation that somebody in your organiza…

AI assessment note: “it is really about the depth of the planning.”

Q 2014, you did a really viral commencement speech at UT, and you described the 10 lessons you learned from SEAL training. You have this great book, Make Your Bed. And you started it with, if you want to change the world, start off by making your bed. Why do you think this resonated with so many people? I mean, millions of people have seen this now and talked about it.

A Yeah, I mean, it's over a hundred million have watched this video. And I'm always flattered and And, and, and a little surprised by it, but in a very pleasant way. But I think the reason it resonates is it is simple. You know, it's not hard to get up every morning and make your bed. And I get a dozen emails every week from people kind of all around the world that say, look, this very simple task has really helped me deal with the, the challenges of the day. Because when you get up and you make your bed and you, again, you take a little pride in it, then it kind of motivates you to do another task and another and another. And it's, And there was just something, it's kind of strange to sound, but there's something comforting. There's something orderly about going back into your bedroom and finding the bed made. I think it gives people a sense of order in a, in a chaotic life. Um, and it's not hard. Obviously, you know, anybody can get up and make their bed. You don't, nobody has to really teach you. Uh, there's no complex book about it. Um, and so I think that's why it has resonated. It is simple. It is powerful. Uh, and you know, the utility of doing it is, has played out time and time again.

AI assessment note: “I think the reason it resonates is it is simple.”

Q So, you know, we started American Optimist to push back against a lot of the pessimism and cynicism we're seeing in our society. Uh, what makes you optimistic for the future of our nation? What would you tell young people who are negative on our future?

A Yeah, well, here's what I'll tell you. I'm the biggest fan of the millennials and the Gen Z that you'll ever meet. And that surprises a lot of people because there is this narrative out there that the millennials and the Gen Z are these soft, entitled little snowflakes. Well, I'm quick to point out you've never seen them in a firefight in Afghanistan or going to the University of Texas to make a better life for themselves. I love this young generation. Because I, I see in them a difference that is, is going to help the United States and probably the world. This generation, um, believes they can do anything. And frankly, you're, you're a prime example of that. You know, my generation for the most part, I think we fell in line with our parents. If our parents were in the military, we were going to be in the military. If our parents were lawyers, we were going to be lawyers. So there was a little bit of this idea that we are going to follow in the footsteps of our parents or grandparents. But this new generation believes that, hey, I can go do anything I want to do. And that's great. That, that, that entrepreneurial spirit I think is really what is going to bring us new technology and MRNA and all the things that can solve a lot of the difficult problems in the world. I love the fact that this generation really, um, believes and cherishes their friendships in a way that I mean, I …

AI assessment note: “I'm the biggest fan of the millennials and the Gen Z that you'll ever meet.”

Q you lock them away, And then when we leave the bad guys escape and become really powerful terrorist groups again. And that was always extremely frustrating for feeling like it helped a little bit. And then that happened. Like, how'd you feel about that? And are there mistakes we made and that we're not going to make again? Cause it feels like it happened a little bit again in Afghanistan.

A Every week we would sit down with the leadership in Iraq or Afghanistan, and we would go through again, a legal proceeding with the lawyers. Okay. You, you, you, uh, captured this person. This person's been incarcerated for X number of months. Um, he's been a good citizen, you know, so, but where there were, um, detainees that we held that we thought were, should never be released, uh, in the entire time I was in Iraq, we certainly didn't release them. Uh, some of them went to, um, went to Guantanamo. Um, now, is that to say that, you know, at some point in time, a lot of bad guys got back out into the, uh, into Iraq and Afghanistan? Sure. Yes, they did. There's no denying that. But some of the really, really hardcore guys, uh, you know, we sent off to Guantanamo.

AI assessment note: “Sure. Yes, they did. There's no denying that.”

Q I agree. But, but, uh, speaking of challenging things, uh, state of the military, a recent study showed about 80% of young Americans would not qualify for military service right now. What's happening in our culture around that, and how do we fix that?

A Yeah, that's a great question. Uh, and you're right, the, the recruiting numbers are down, uh, for a number of reasons. Uh, one, there is this concern about the fitness of young men and women coming up. And, uh, you know, it's, it's everything from the fitness, uh, they're, they're overweight, uh, you know, drug abuse, a lot of these sorts of things. Um, so it is harder to recruit, and I'm not sure whether it's 80%, but it's a high number. But also during the pandemic, uh, the recruiters who normally recruit out of high school, of course, they were not able to have access to the high schools because high schools were shut down during the pandemic. So that affected the, the pipeline. Um, you know, there's this concern about wokeness, um, but I will tell you that when a survey has been done regarding, you know, talking to the young kids, why did you join? Where did wokeness fall out? Yeah, it was not high on their concerns, and I will tell you in my discussions with, ah, you know, with sailors and soldier, sailors, airmen, marines, you know, again, I think it's getting blown out of proportion. It's not to say we, we don't need to be cognizant of it, um, but it doesn't permeate the military the way, you know, some people seem to imply that it does.

AI assessment note: “recruiting numbers are down, uh, for a number of reasons. Uh, one, there is this concern”