Jul 14, 2023 · 10m · a16z

These People Are Engaging Their Doctors 45x a Year

Fay Rottenberg · 5m spoken Steph Smith · 3m spoken
0:00 / 0:00
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of the a16z podcast series on healthcare and fintech, host Steph Smith and Firefly Health CEO Fay Rotenburg explore how virtual-first primary care and value-based models can reform the U.S. healthcare system by significantly increasing patient engagement while lowering costs.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. The host holds 41.9% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

The host as informed peer 2.8 Guest teaching 3.8 Guest disagreement 0.8 The host pushing back 0.0
05100:0010:000:00–2:07 · The host as informed peer 3/10 Overview of Healthcare Inefficiencies Steph opens with a narrated breakdown of systemic healthcare inefficiencies, including medical debt and fee-for-service legacy models. The guest and featured speaker offer brief introductory commentary on opaque pricing and uncollected invoices without any pushback.2:07–4:24 · The host as informed peer 3/10 Misaligned Incentives in Healthcare Fay details how misaligned provider-payer incentives force cost burden onto patients. Steph contextualizes this with narration on chronic behavior challenges versus single-visit facilities.4:24–7:25 · The host as informed peer 3/10 Firefly Health's Virtual-First Model and 45x Engagement Fay outlines Firefly Health's virtual-first model, high-engagement strategy, and integrated health plan. Steph adds narrated context highlighting the contrast between standard yearly doctor visits and Firefly's 45x engagement stat.7:25–9:17 · The host as informed peer 2/10 Navigating Healthcare Decisions and the Future Vision Fay elaborates on navigating complex specialist choices and presents a 5-year vision of personalized care teams. Steph wraps up the episode with standard promotional callouts and series summaries.0:00–2:07 · Guest teaching 2/10 Overview of Healthcare Inefficiencies Steph opens with a narrated breakdown of systemic healthcare inefficiencies, including medical debt and fee-for-service legacy models. The guest and featured speaker offer brief introductory commentary on opaque pricing and uncollected invoices without any pushback.2:07–4:24 · Guest teaching 4/10 Misaligned Incentives in Healthcare Fay details how misaligned provider-payer incentives force cost burden onto patients. Steph contextualizes this with narration on chronic behavior challenges versus single-visit facilities.4:24–7:25 · Guest teaching 5/10 Firefly Health's Virtual-First Model and 45x Engagement Fay outlines Firefly Health's virtual-first model, high-engagement strategy, and integrated health plan. Steph adds narrated context highlighting the contrast between standard yearly doctor visits and Firefly's 45x engagement stat.7:25–9:17 · Guest teaching 4/10 Navigating Healthcare Decisions and the Future Vision Fay elaborates on navigating complex specialist choices and presents a 5-year vision of personalized care teams. Steph wraps up the episode with standard promotional callouts and series summaries.0:00–2:07 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Overview of Healthcare Inefficiencies Steph opens with a narrated breakdown of systemic healthcare inefficiencies, including medical debt and fee-for-service legacy models. The guest and featured speaker offer brief introductory commentary on opaque pricing and uncollected invoices without any pushback.2:07–4:24 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Misaligned Incentives in Healthcare Fay details how misaligned provider-payer incentives force cost burden onto patients. Steph contextualizes this with narration on chronic behavior challenges versus single-visit facilities.4:24–7:25 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Firefly Health's Virtual-First Model and 45x Engagement Fay outlines Firefly Health's virtual-first model, high-engagement strategy, and integrated health plan. Steph adds narrated context highlighting the contrast between standard yearly doctor visits and Firefly's 45x engagement stat.7:25–9:17 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Navigating Healthcare Decisions and the Future Vision Fay elaborates on navigating complex specialist choices and presents a 5-year vision of personalized care teams. Steph wraps up the episode with standard promotional callouts and series summaries.0:00–2:07 · The host pushing back 0/10 Overview of Healthcare Inefficiencies Steph opens with a narrated breakdown of systemic healthcare inefficiencies, including medical debt and fee-for-service legacy models. The guest and featured speaker offer brief introductory commentary on opaque pricing and uncollected invoices without any pushback.2:07–4:24 · The host pushing back 0/10 Misaligned Incentives in Healthcare Fay details how misaligned provider-payer incentives force cost burden onto patients. Steph contextualizes this with narration on chronic behavior challenges versus single-visit facilities.4:24–7:25 · The host pushing back 0/10 Firefly Health's Virtual-First Model and 45x Engagement Fay outlines Firefly Health's virtual-first model, high-engagement strategy, and integrated health plan. Steph adds narrated context highlighting the contrast between standard yearly doctor visits and Firefly's 45x engagement stat.7:25–9:17 · The host pushing back 0/10 Navigating Healthcare Decisions and the Future Vision Fay elaborates on navigating complex specialist choices and presents a 5-year vision of personalized care teams. Steph wraps up the episode with standard promotional callouts and series summaries.

speaking balance: gold is the host, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · the host 64.3% · guest 35.7%0:00 · the host 64.3% · guest 35.7%3:00 · the host 25.4% · guest 74.6%3:00 · the host 25.4% · guest 74.6%6:00 · the host 25.2% · guest 74.8%6:00 · the host 25.2% · guest 74.8%9:00 · the host 72.6% · guest 27.4%9:00 · the host 72.6% · guest 27.4%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 0:14 Blunt critique of healthcare pricing opacity

Featured Speaker and Fay forcefully criticize the state of healthcare pricing, calling it absurdly opaque and a leading category for viral memes.

Hardest push from the host ▶ 5:30 Highlighting execution difficulty in bloat removal

Steph pushes back on optimistic disruption claims by explicitly noting that removing bloat from a multi-trillion dollar industry is far easier said than done.

Biggest teaching moment ▶ 3:26 Explaining systemic driver of patient suffering

Fay clearly educates the audience on how the historical mismatch between payers and providers directly results in denied care or shifted costs onto patients.

The host holds their own ▶ 6:37 Benchmarking industry engagement standards

Steph demonstrates strong context awareness by contrasting average consumer doctor visits (1-10 times a year) with Firefly's benchmark of 45 engagements.

the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicThe host as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementThe host pushing backWhy
Overview of Healthcare Inefficiencies 3210 Steph opens with a narrated breakdown of systemic healthcare inefficiencies, including medical debt and fee-for-service legacy models. The guest and featured speaker offer brief introductory commentary on opaque pricing and uncollected invoices without any pushback.
Misaligned Incentives in Healthcare 3410 Fay details how misaligned provider-payer incentives force cost burden onto patients. Steph contextualizes this with narration on chronic behavior challenges versus single-visit facilities.
Firefly Health's Virtual-First Model and 45x Engagement 3510 Fay outlines Firefly Health's virtual-first model, high-engagement strategy, and integrated health plan. Steph adds narrated context highlighting the contrast between standard yearly doctor visits and Firefly's 45x engagement stat.
Navigating Healthcare Decisions and the Future Vision 2400 Fay elaborates on navigating complex specialist choices and presents a 5-year vision of personalized care teams. Steph wraps up the episode with standard promotional callouts and series summaries.

Statements from this episode (7)

Assertion Supported
Smith: Fee-for-Service Model Has Driven US Healthcare Since the 1960s
“Unfortunately, the American healthcare system has instead been grounded in fee-for-service models since the 19 sixties, incentivizing providers to focus on quantity rather than quality of care.”
Steph Smith Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 1:48
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Rotenburg: Healthcare systems will default to denying care to cut costs
“And certainly when the easiest but not the best way to remove costs from the system is either to deny care to patients or push more of the payment burden onto patients, that's exactly what will happen.”
Fay Rottenberg Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 2:51
Assertion Partly supported
Rotenburg: Behaviors Drive Most U.S. Healthcare Costs and Deaths
“Address the drivers of the vast majority of death, disease, and costs in this country, which are driven by behaviors, which cannot be treated in any single visit, often don't require a physical facility.”
Fay Rottenberg Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 3:28
Assertion Supported
Smith: Value-Based Care Investment Quadrupled During the Pandemic
“Investment in value-based care quadrupled during the pandemic, while new hospital construction remained unchanged.”
Steph Smith Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 4:14
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Firefly Health members engage with care teams 45 times yearly on average
“And so on average, members are engaging with us 45 times a year, which is an astounding stat.”
Fay Rottenberg Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 6:53
Insight
Rotenburg: Frequent patient engagement is required to manage chronic conditions and reduce ER visits
“Like, that's how you improve chronic conditions. That's how you keep people out of the ER. It's how you build trust and a relationship so that you earn the right to navigate them to those higher value providers.”
Fay Rottenberg Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 6:58
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Rotenburg: In five years, everyone will have a concierge care team
“I think that the biggest thing we're talking about five years, it's that everyone has their own personal quarterback concierge care team right here that is their guide that they know they can access. You know, the best care instantaneously, and they understand…”
Fay Rottenberg Jul 14, 2023 ▶ 8:43
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