The Exchanges

Q Why is it addictive? And why is education not? What needs to change?

A Gamification. Like, like if you, you know, there's this game called Jailbreak on Roblox. Simple game, super simple graphics. But one is the social aspect element of it. The second is the gamification element of it. If you read this book called Actionable Gamification, it breaks down every single aspect of why you get addicted to a game. You, people play games that they win. So today, if they are sitting in a coaching center, where you don't even get entry to a best teacher's class, because they say you are number hundred, that won't work. But if there is an AI app that says that, so the AI app can actually say that, Nikhil, you want to learn this? It can real time generate a lesson for you. By the way, this is not happening, but we have to make it happen. And can start giving you questions. So basically, and they have to give you some positive reinforcement, because if you start playing, if FIFA only had world class mode, and didn't have a amateur mode, you would never play FIFA.

AI assessment note: “Gamification... people play games that they win.”

Q And when did Unacademy become all that it is in terms of scale? The same question I asked them. When did you realize Unacademy is big?

A No, so we had that Um, intrinsic optimism that we have to make this big. I mean, one guy is, he was the assistant collector of Jabalpur. I mean, he's leaving that. Uh, and then, um, you know, we, we, we knew that this is all, we are going all in, like working 16 hours a day, seven days a week. We, we had to go all in and we had to make it big. The question wasn't so, see, people don't realize a lot of times we went through at least 10 pivots. Before we realized our business model in 2019. So 2015 is when we started the company, when Roman quit, when Himesh quit, when I quit. Both of Himesh and I quit Commonflow, Roman quit IS. Four years, it took us 10 plus pivots to realize what's our business model. But once we cracked the business model, this is, I remember 2019, we were on a founder's retreat and we, we start seeing revenue numbers that we are doing 30 lakhs a day, 40 lakhs a day. And this is the first time we had seen revenue PMF. We had seen views PMF. We were creating content. So we had seen that journey that our videos were doing hundred million views a month. So that journey we had already seen. But when we started seeing revenue PMF, that's when we knew we had had something, but it took us four years plus 10 pivots to get there.

AI assessment note: “2019... when we started seeing revenue PMF, that's when we knew”

Q It's a much larger experience for a larger set of people, but do you think this can compete with that?

A So let me, let me just give you an example. So we have products for people ranging from 17 year olds to 2930 year olds. There is this examination people prepare for called Neat PG. If you became a doctor and you want to do your post-graduation and get your MD, et cetera, you give this NEAT PG examination. Now, the younger you are, you need more coaching, you need more intervention, you need somebody to call you and tell you, please study, you need more discipline. But NEAT PG, where let's say we own 24% market share, the problem there is people say, we don't need offline coaching centers. And even if you give them great content, but boring content, They will open the app because the intent is so high. They will study it without even building social interactions. So if your question is on whether this can be done, that you don't need, let's say, without a network, etc. Can you build that? That depends on how much intent.

AI assessment note: “Can you build that? That depends on how much intent.”

Q Were you a bright child? Good marks in school?

A Like I would study just before the exam and I would get 8085%. And some of the teachers, but every parents teacher meeting, I would get reprimanded at home because I would, I was, I think I had this rebellious nature, which I still do, but I just had to take my teachers to a breaking point. Like I had to say something in the class or something like that. But, but then this coding thing, I was 15 years old when I started eX-rays. So we had a school magazine called X-rays, and I could not get selected in it. So I went to the principal who was, Father Joseph Jacob, and I told him I'll start this EX race. And, um, I got to build a new team and, you know, it was launched in school, et cetera. So I think that was the first taste where I realized that, um, maybe I'm, I mean, I, I, I could study physics, chemistry, maths when I could, but I was never excited about it. I always loved building products. Um, I remember, um, uh, You know, I built this bot in college called Pingu. You know, it was, it was like a much basic version of what bots we are seeing today, but you could, you could say that I'm getting bored and it would give you that. So I think, and at some point, the coding and the tech part got merged with content. So, um, I used to run these blogs in college and ended up making two, 3000 dollars a month, which used to be a lot.

AI assessment note: “I would study just before the exam and I would get 8085%.”

Q One thing you've learned in your journey, in the journey around education, that you would like to share so the new budding entrepreneurs can keep that in mind. Second part of the question, if you could change arbitrarily one, one very fundamental first principles, kind of thing about education, what would you change?

A So I'll start with the second one first, what I would like to change is that Even today, I think, um, everybody, there is a lot more focus on content and education, et cetera. Um, I like to believe that technologists are not coming in the sector. I like to believe that the way, uh, a Duolingo has solved a problem where it's a completely, um, computer generated program or a game teaching people. And obviously there is human intervention that has gone into it. Um, or there is Roblox where, Every, um, third kid is using in US, like, or playing a game on Roblox. I think people are not building enough technology stuff. So one thing I would like to change is that I would request entrepreneurs that education is a big sector. Um, don't just be stuck in FinTech. Um, look beyond FinTech. Every other founder I meet is, I'm doing FinTech this, I'm doing FinTech that. Yes, FinTech is a big market.

AI assessment note: “what I would like to change is that Even today, I think, um, everybody”

Q And following that journey, where are you now? Like you have X. What do you compare yourself to?

A No, now I don't. See, at some point, it's a, now, see, drive is not black or white. It's not like because I wanted a better car, I, I work 16 hours a day. I could have, if I wanted to make money, I could have chosen another profession, where I would work eight hours a day, and have a much more work life balance, but I don't have that. So I think, I think initial drive, or for example, when I was in school, all of my friends, I went to Xavier's Jaipur, which is one of the best schools in Jaipur, but all of my friends got into IITs. I didn't. So then during college, that was the second part of the drive that I had was that, you know, there was this hunger to prove that, you know, and every time, at that time, it was this Gmail group, and you know, you had Gtalk, or something like that, and we would discuss that. Gchat. Sorry. Um, uh, it's very surprising. They should have been the one to break out and done.

AI assessment note: “No, now I don't. See, at some point, it's a”