The Exchanges

Q Do you always think that? That you would come to political life?

A At some point I always thought I would, or I'd like to think I would, um, or have the opportunity to do so, but essentially, um, you know, the reason for that is very simply that, ah, you know, I really think actually doing something else before you come to political life is often very, very helpful, because you understand more of the world, and you understand more of what, ah, people are, you know, how you can actually help people, how you can deal with them. Um, so for me, yeah, having a business career was something I always wanted to do, but I always think that the skills from some of that is very transferable into my job. It's not the same thing running a company as it is a country. It's actually completely different and very different on a number of levels, but the principles by which you do that, the way that you lead, the way that you build a team of ministers to actually deliver the agenda to actually get things done is very, very similar. And so some of the same principles that I learned in business actually are very applicable now into this role as, as prime minister.

AI assessment note: “At some point I always thought I would, or I'd like to think I would”

Q are many similarities in the direction America is taking and you seem to be taking. Uh, I even heard that you spoke to Trump recently. I mean, in terms of him talking about meritocracy, lesser weightage on DEI, businessmen in politics, the doge getting corporates to come in and try to fix politics in a very corporate way. Are there many similarities between what you're doing and what they are?

A Uh, no, I don't, yeah, we're following our own path, and, you know, I've been in office now for 16 months, and, you know, we've inherited a really challenging set of economic circumstances. And we went to our election in New Zealand saying we want to rebuild the economy, we want to restore the order, and we need to deliver better health and education outcomes for New Zealanders. So yeah, I get, you know, some of the parallels people may, with any country people might, you know, might make those assumptions, but it's definitely not the case for us. It's about our own, plotting our own course and saying what's right for New Zealand. And we want to embrace more science, technology, innovation. We want world-class infrastructure. We need to make sure it's an easy place to do business with little, Bureaucracy, and we need to make sure we attract trade and investment. Equally, for our most vulnerable citizens, we want to invest in what we call social investment, which is actually using our community organisations and actually get the money out of the bureaucracy into those organisations to get better health and educational outcomes and social outcomes for people. And obviously we've got a big commitment to, you know, net 20, 50. Uh, and in fact our latest plan, which we, we have legislated into our, our parliament, Um, you know, even since we might even get there six years early. So,…

AI assessment note: “no, I don't, yeah, we're following our own path”

Q I think what's much more- How would you label your board?

A Well, what I'd label is it's about, about being customer centric. It's really actually about delivering for your people and their needs. And when I talk to New Zealanders at the moment, what's the number one need that they have? It's about, ah, dealing with the cost of living, improving their economic wellbeing. It's restoring law and order so they feel safe in their homes, their businesses, their communities. It's certainly about delivering better health and educational outcomes so their kids have a great future. So if you stay focused on those things and those goals, um, then you drive government to deliver those goals. And you can talk about, ah, left, right, and labels as much as you like, but actually the public wants you to deliver for them. And actually help them have a better life. And they get more choices, more freedom as to what they get to do with their time and their money.

AI assessment note: “you can talk about, ah, left, right, and labels as much as you like”

Q Do you think Doge is a good idea?

A Well, again, it's about making sure you've got a public, I'm not going to talk about US domestic politics, because I'm not responsible for the US, but what I can do is, the parallel in New Zealand is to make sure that my public service is as efficient as it possibly can be, and that it's focused on delivering for New Zealanders, and I do think in the public service, and you think about the bureaucracies that exist in many countries around the world, is the question is, how do you make it deliver So that it's always focused on the people. And sometimes that gets lost. And so in my case, what I'm doing is making sure that I want them to think of themselves as large service organizations that have customers. If you build customer centricity into any organization, as you well know from your own background, um, we want the public servants of New Zealand to be thinking that they are there to serve patients who need healthcare services and need quality access to timely healthcare. And we want to make sure that they are understanding their job going into work today is to improve reading and mathematical outcomes for our kids. Um, we want to make sure that infrastructure is getting built and roads and stuff. So I've spent a lot of time looking at other small advanced economies, and if you look at, say, Singapore, they've got a very effective public service, and I've actually spent a lot…

AI assessment note: “I'm not going to talk about US domestic politics, because I'm not responsible”

Q And when you say you don't emote the highs and lows, I'm assuming you're not as reactive as the next person. Are you not feeling the emotion or are you not projecting the emotion?

A No, I mean, I know I feel it. Um, but the question is, I also, you know, do things like I'm fully informed about social media, but I'm not consumed by it because otherwise there's so many critics out there that you'd never get out of bed in the morning, right? If you, if your whole life was defined by what comments are said about you on social media. So that's a way in which you Make sure that you're not bounced around, ah, by, by people who you, who, um, you may or may not choose to take advice from. And so, um, you know, that, that to me is, I've got a very good set of friends and mentors and, and, uh, family around me that keep me really grounded. And so for me, I'm just not, I'm a person who's always believed that, you know, like good sports teams, you don't, you know, when you see good, I study a lot of coaches and, and captains of sports teams because it's the same dynamic. In politics, people often think of it as an individual, ego-driven game. But actually, I've determined, and the work that we've done with our team is now we're in a team game. I can play the position on the team. I may be opening bat, bat, or whatever, but I need a really fast bowler, I need a spin bowler, I need a, you know, I need different people on the team that can play their position in a world-class edit and do a really good job. And it's about my job as captain is to make sure I get the right p…

AI assessment note: “No, I mean, I know I feel it.”

Q I mean, they just do it with a nib, right?

A Yeah, you got it, you got it, you got it. And, um, they're just incredible because actually, you know, right from, you know, New Zealand's been a very innovative country. If you think about these, Uh, Maori Polynesian navigators that navigated by the stars and came through the Pacific Ocean and, and to New Zealand. Uh, and so it's actually awesome to bring them with me here because, um, you know, what I really appreciate is, is, you know, when you run into Indians, they've got huge appreciation for culture, your own culture. It's thousands of years of civilization. That's just incredibly mesmerizing and interesting. And I think, you know, there's huge respect for Maori culture as well. And it's a great way also to make the connections at a human connections level or people to people level.

AI assessment note: “Yeah, you got it, you got it, you got it. And, um, they're just incredible”