The Exchanges

Q as the new chairman of Tata Sons. And that was the year when Indian economy was also, you know, got liberalized and was open to the world. How was that time for him? And because even the most successful businesses and including Tata Sons, it was a time When big shift was taking place. So how he navigated that time, and how he made Tata son's future ready for the...

A Very, very interesting question, Nancy. So you're quite right. 1991 is when JRD Tata handed over the reigns of the Tata group to Ratan Tata, and Ratan Tata became the chairman of the Tata group. You're also right, that is the year in which Manmohan Singh, as finance minister, under the prime ministership of PV Narsim Rao, announced his famous budget. If you remember with Victor Hugo's words, you cannot stop an idea whose time has come, and the Indian economy was suddenly liberalized. This was still the first year of Ratan Tata's chairmanship, but I think Ratan Tata grasped the impact of this budget on the Indian economy. He knew the Indian economy was going to be far more open in the years ahead. He knew licensing was on its way out. He knew that this would be an era of heightened competition, and he knew that many Tata companies would have to up their game to face the competition and become best in class in India and globally. So a lot of his focus in those early years of his chairmanship was about making the Tata Group future ready. He did many things, but I'll describe three or four things that he did. Uh, I was a young manager in the group at that time. One of the first things that he did, Nancy, was, uh, he wanted the group to be You know, inspired with the spirit of excellence. So he established what was called the GRDQV program, which later became the Tata Business Excel…

AI assessment note: “So a lot of his focus in those early years... was about making the Tata Group future ready.”

Q Very interesting. So, I think this is the one last question I have for you, Harish. You have finished writing eight books. This is your eight book. What goes into writing a book? Like, how did you, you know, approach this whole book writing process? We'll just take this book's example. Like, how many interviews you conducted?

A So, so, you know, Nancy, uh, After I had returned from Bombay, after paying my last respects to Mr. Ratan Tata, I kept thinking about him, and I keep thinking about what has driven him in his life, and thereafter, last November, I was invited to deliver a lecture by XLRI Jamshitpur, and this was the JRD Tata Memorial Lecture, And, ah, after thinking carefully, I chose to speak on the subject of doing the right thing. How Mr. Ratan Tata can inspire us. So I put a small speech together. That was the first step towards writing this book. Um, and I think some of the basic framework of the book was built in that speech, and then when the professors at XLRI Jamshitpur told me that they liked the speech very much, there were lessons in that speech, they wanted to print it in one of their in-house magazines, um, then I came back and said, this looks like a good framework for the book itself. By then I had interviewed three or four people,

AI assessment note: “That was the first step towards writing this book. Um, and I think some”

Q So how and when Tata Suns became a global business?

A So, you know, uh, Tata's have always had some global businesses, uh, even during JRD Tata's time. Uh, for instance, TCS was a global business. Uh, but during Ratan Tata's period, I think Tata Sons took some very, very firm steps towards becoming a truly global company in terms of owning global brands, in terms of owning global businesses. Ah, you would have surely read about the acquisitions of Tetley, the acquisitions of JLR, the acquisitions of Chorus, ah, the acquisitions of Tata Daivu, ah, in, ah, in Korea, and many such acquisitions. So, acquiring global brands or global businesses was one route to becoming global. But the other route to becoming global was to build companies in India Which could compete with the best in the world, which were benchmarking themselves to global businesses. For instance, you know, at that time, I was part of the Titan business, and I know in Titan, we were already market leaders in India, but we started benchmarking ourselves against Swatch, which is, ah, one of the largest global watch companies, and saying, why can't we reach their levels of profitability? Why can't we reach their levels of innovation? Why can't we reach their levels of branding and marketing excellence? So I think globalization was not just the acquisition of companies or going to more countries. Of course it was that. But it was also a global mindset, Nancy. Saying that w…

AI assessment note: “during Ratan Tata's period, I think Tata Sons took some very, very firm steps”

Q I was asking, when was the first car out in the market?

A So, so, 1998 was when the Tata Indica was launched. It was driven out proudly by Mr. Ratan Tata from the Pune plant. Uh, it was launched in the market. Initially, it had some quality issues with it. Uh, even now, you know, people squirm when they are reminded about those quality issues, but those quality issues were fixed very quickly. Mr. Tata and his team visited distributors, visited the markets, understood what the issues were. Over the next year, those issues were fixed, and eventually the Tata Indica was relaunched as Tata Indica V-II. It went on to become the fastest selling car on the face of India in the early 2000. There are about 3000 discrete parts which go into a car. And when the Tata Indica was launched, 97% of these parts were created indigenously. So imagine the ancillary industry that it gave rise to. Imagine the engineering excellence which the actual making of a car in India brought. Um, and, uh, you know, people have later asked Mr. Rutten Tata, What gave you the courage to make India's first car, the Tata Indica? And Ratan Tata has said that his courage came from his trust in the young engineers of Telco, Tata Motors. And he has also said that he wanted to do something which would be inspiring for young India, which would show young India that it's often possible to do the impossible. Ratan Tata has actually said, you know, history may say it succeeded or …

AI assessment note: “1998 was when the Tata Indica was launched.”

Q And, uh, uh, he set up the cancer, like the foundation of the cancer research center, which got later, you know, built by, uh, his son and the grandson and so excited, but let us start, you know, for our audience by how did the Tata group get formed?

A So, uh, Siddhartha, it's my pleasure and privilege to speak on this show. And, uh, you know, we've just about, my co-author, Mr. Gopalakrishnan and me have just about completed the writing of our book on Jamshedji Tata and the lessons that we can learn from Jamshedji Tata that every manager, entrepreneur, leader today can learn. It was a fascinating voyage writing that book. And, uh, therefore, uh, You know, going, going to the foundation of the Tata group, which we have also briefly described there. The Tata group was founded in 1868 by Jamshedji Tata, who was a Parsi merchant of Mumbai. He was born in Navsari in Gujarat. He came from a line of priests in the Parsi religion, but his father had already ventured into the world of business. He came to Mumbai with his father at the age of 13, stayed there, studied in Mumbai. And in 1868, he founded this company, which is known as Tata Sons today, the parent company of the Tata Group. Jamshedji Tata initially made a foray into the textiles business. He first bought an old mill and converted it to textiles in Mumbai, but later he built his first greenfield enterprise, the Empress Mills in Nagpur, which became one of the most prosperous businesses of its time. It returned to its shareholders within a few years, very, very significant returns on their capital. And he did that by using the best quality of long stapled cotton. He did th…

AI assessment note: “The Tata group was founded in 1868 by Jamshedji Tata, who was a Parsi merchant”

Q And let's say if we imagine hypothetically go back one 30 years, one 40 years, what would have schedule of Jamshedji Tata look like at that point and how would he spend his time across various ventures of his?

A It is a very, very good question. It's a very, very good question. We do know from, from everything that's been written about Jamshedji Tata of three or four things. One, he used to read a lot. Every evening after dinner, he used to go into his library or study and read. Reading to him was a window on the world. Second, he used to travel a lot. He has to, he used to travel extensively to Japan, To Europe, to the US, in so much that if you look at, say the year, one or two years before he passed away, I think several months in that year would have gone traveling. And he used to travel a lot because the, to locate the best technology, to see the best examples, what we call in today's world benchmarking, you know, global benchmarking. He used to do that in, so there was time spent on that as well. He was a very industrious person, so he used to spend a lot of time thinking about the industrial projects that he was putting up. He was a man of detail. If you look at the letters that he used to write to his son or to his business partners, so that was his time in office. He used to also spend a fair amount of time in the clubs in the evening discussing, you know, I talked of the Ripan Club, um, discussing Various projects discussing various matters of interest to society, to his city of Mumbai, etc. So that would have taken some bit of his time. And of course, I'm told, you know, Jam…

AI assessment note: “So all these, I'm sure, would have found time on his daily schedule.”

Q Thank you. And congratulations on your new book, Doing the Right Thing. And I'm told that this book is already a national bestseller. So, maybe you can tell us why you wrote this book, and why are so many people reading this book?

A So, you know, it's interesting, the genesis of this book, Nancy, ah, on the ninth of October last year, which is twenty-twenty-four, Mr. Ratan Tata passed away. And, ah, I was in Bangalore in my home that night, when I heard the news. I was deeply saddened because he has been a huge influence on me throughout my career with the Tata group. So the next morning I took a flight to Bombay to pay my last respects to Ratan Tata. His body was at the NCPA in Mumbai. I went and paid my last respects. There's a huge queue of people gathered there to pay their last respects to Mr. Tata. On the roads, I could see slogans like Ratan Tata, Amar Rahe, and, ah, posters being put up on the roads. Ah, I haven't seen that kind of display of emotion for a very, very long time. You know, television channels were full of, you know, eulogies for Mr. Tata and, ah, stories of his life. But more importantly, I found that so many people I spoke to Nancy felt a deep sense of personal loss when Ratan Tata passed away. Even people who did not know him, even people who have never interacted with him, said we were personally very impacted by his passing away. So I said, what is this happening? Why is it that millions of Indians have been impacted personally by the passing away of a leader, an industrialist like Mr. Ratan Tata? Was it only because he was a very successful industrialist? Under whose chairmanshi…

AI assessment note: “the genesis of this book, Nancy, ah, on the ninth of October last year”

Q And, ah, maybe you can share, ah, something about Ratan Tata, sir, here, that people who have worked closely with him often describes him as a very shy person, and this is so unusual for a man who has, you know, led a company for over Two decades, right? And grew revenue 50 times, profit 40 times. How's that possible?

A So, I think, ah, there are different sides to Mr. Atun Tata. He was a visionary leader, and, ah, you know, we spoke about globalization just now, ah, but we could also speak about his launching the first indigenous Indian car, the Tata Indica. We could speak about the Nano, which was also something that he envisioned. Ah, we could speak about many of the high technology businesses that he brought into the Tata group. So, on the one hand, he was a visionary leader, Very bold in his decision making, and during the 20 years that he was the chairman of the Tata group, the revenues of the group grew from six billion US dollars to hundred billion US dollars. So you can imagine the rapid growth that the group experienced during his tenure. But on the other hand, he was also, I believe, a very private person. You know, I would say He was very graceful in his interactions. He met people. He chose his words very thoughtfully and very carefully. Uh, he spoke little, but when he spoke, he spoke after giving every word that he said due consideration. But he was also a very private person who liked his own space. He liked to spend time with his dogs at home. He would take his dogs out for a walk. Um, to tell you the truth, I have never reported directly to Mr. Ratantata. I have met him on several occasions during my long tenure in the group. Um, but what I've heard from everyone who has work…

AI assessment note: “on the one hand, he was a visionary leader... on the other hand, he was also... a very private person”

Q And if you have to summarize, what was Tata Group before and after Rattan Tata? How would you put it in numbers or stories or anecdotes?

A Okay. Uh, I, I would say, you know, the Tata Group has always been a leader in India for many, many decades now, has always been a leader in India. Uh, I think under Mr. Rattan Tata, very strong processes were built. Very strong processes like the Tata business excellence model, the Tata code of conduct was codified. Very strong institutional processes were built, uh, so that the future foundations of the group could be really secure. Uh, Tata Sun stakes in some of the group companies were also enhanced to make sure that the ownership was well protected. So I would say this was a time of consolidation and transformation of the group, uh, and making it future ready.

AI assessment note: “this was a time of consolidation and transformation of the group”

Q So you are coming to another home. This is your place, right?

A So that shows that you went out of your way. And many of those founders, I don't know whether they will remember all the food they ate at your party, maybe yes, but they will definitely keep this note for a very, very long time. This is not something that, uh, every fund is going to do everywhere. This is a very, very emotional gesture, and I think emotional gestures like this speak to people's hearts. They don't speak to people's minds. Often, you know, when we are caught in the world of high finance, we are only talking to people's minds and intellects. But I think it's important to talk to both the head and the heart at the same time.

AI assessment note: “So that shows that you went out of your way. And many of those founders”