The Exchanges

Q I know it's tough. And man, I have, you know, my podcast is startups for the rest of us, which I still like, but it feels long now. And I've debated whether to, to change it. Have you guys actually considered it? Cause I'm curious what would go, what would need to go into a name change?

A The problem is, is we considered it like a year ago when we were smaller, but then we were like, back then we were like, Uh, we're too big. Back when we did that, we, we were at, like, three or 400 thousand uniques a month, and, or visitor, or, um, listeners a month, and we were like, oh, but we're too big. It already is stuck. Now, we did, in December, we crossed two million, uh, listens a month, and we're like, now we're definitely, like, we're definitely too big. And Dharmesh, who is the founder of HubSpot, who now owns the podcast, he was like, you gotta change the name. And I'm like, Dharmesh, it's way too late. And he was like, No, it's not. And so he thinks we should do it. I think it's too late in the game. Frankly, I think a bad name sometimes is a good, is a good thing, but the name is quite horrible. And I feel embarrassed to tell my barber and stuff. They're like, well, what's it about? I'm like, I'm not sure, but not much, but it's not about making your first million. That's for sure.

AI assessment note: “we considered it like a year ago when we were smaller”

Q I know. I know you called him out on that, but what are, what are you, cause you're doing Hampton again. You pro I don't, you probably have enough money where you could just sit on it and put it in some like treasuries for the rest of your life, but you're doing Hampton again. What are you optimizing for?

A I'm optimizing for fulfillment. So I'm, so when I took time off after selling my first company, I was incredibly lonely. I was very, I think, I think there, Scott Galloway talks about like a loneliness Uh, epidemic, particularly amongst young men, and I, I experienced that, where I was like, I'm just so alone. I, I feel alone. I, I feel like, uh, quite unhappy. Um, I felt proud of my previous experience, but I, I felt lonely. And so, I started the business because I wanted, um, a new challenge, where, like, I just wanted to achieve something, and I wanted to succeed at something, but more so, I wanted to be less lonely, and I wanted to be in the trenches with the troops, and, like, create something together. Um, I think that, uh, young men, I imagine young women, but I'm a young man, so I only know that perspective, is that, like, I need something to chase after with a team of, of people who I enjoy being near. Um, and that's really what I was optimizing for. I'm also, uh, optimizing for, um, um, Living life on my own terms. Um, so the reason why I'm not willing to do like this, what John said, what did he say? He was like, you got to build something big. I'm like, dude, I don't want that. Cause I feel like you're signing up, you're signing up to live a life where you, where you have, so like, there's like three things. There's like, what do you want to do? What should you do? …

AI assessment note: “I'm optimizing for fulfillment.”

Q What is your current thought on crypto, Sam? Just out of pure curiosity here. And like seeing something like permissionless with like thousands of people walking around, like, do you think that is a scam? Do you think it's just not going to work? Do you think you're excited about it, but you don't understand it? Like, I'd just be very curious to get your take there.

A I'm not incredibly well versed. So I will preface anything by saying that like, I'm not, I'm not that well versed in it. But I would say that the major things in the space, like Bitcoin and Ethereum, I, I do, I, I, I enjoy the, uh, I, uh, like the ideology of it. Like, I respect that. And so I support it. I think that 90% of the rest of the stuff is a complete scam. I think NFTs are, for the most part, total bullshit. I think Web Three, for the most part, is total bullshit. And I think that the people who entered into that space oftentimes are horrible entrepreneurs who are looking for get-rich-quick schemes. And by slapping a web three or an NFT onto it, rather than building a widget that truly solves a problem that people love, that isn't just built to sell to other people in that space. So, um, that's what I believe. So I own Ethereum, and I own Bitcoin, and I like to sit on it, and I enjoy the idea that it could exist, because I, I, I'm in favor of, like, the government not controlling certain things. I think it will exist for a very long period of time, and will potentially become more useful, but most everything else in the space, I think, is nonsense.

AI assessment note: “I think that 90% of the rest of the stuff is a complete scam.”

Q I think he got in stock that thing, right? It's a lot of stock.

A Yeah, he, he got a lot of stock. I think he got some, uh, I think he was able to sell some. I know, I know that the, the, on Wall Street, you could see that he did sell a little bit, and he, um, basically after three years, Pem was like, Shit. You guys are insane. Like you're, it's really hard for us to do like, cause we're regulated as a casino. It's really hard to let you do what you want to do without hurting us. And ESPN wants to do this big deal with us, but they won't do it for with Barstool. You know what, Dave here, look, just have the company back. And if you ever sell it again, we get half of the profit. Cool. And in exchange, we're going to do this ESPN deal, which is going to boost our stock. We're good. It was like the greatest coup of all time of like, You know, Dave getting, uh, Dave selling it, and then them just saying, here, actually, we don't want this. Uh, you know, maybe we have a world where the buyer of, of proper 12 is like, hey, this was cool and all, but you know what? You could just have it. It's yours now. You can have it back.

AI assessment note: “Yeah, he, he got a lot of stock. I think he got some”

Q What if, what are some of the takeaways?

A Well, so it's only three days in. And so, but like in the first or second lesson, he just walked around his office. He goes, I'm going to show you how I find cool stories. And he's just walking around and he goes, oh, that's a cool idea. You guys hear that beeping? That's a truck backing up and that ruins, like it makes it really hard for me to record throughout the day. I'm just going to make a video on that. Or he'll walk by, um, a guy selling fake Louis Vuitton purses and he goes, oh, that's a cool idea. Let's create a video on how to buy a fake purse in New York city. And so he's just like walking down the street, coming up with ideas and you're like, look, I'm going to create, these are just small, silly ideas, but I'm going to execute them really well. So in the next series, he's going to show us how he's actually going to execute these small ideas.

AI assessment note: “he's just like walking down the street, coming up with ideas”

Q I was just about, yeah, that's the one I was gonna ask too. Okay. What, what are you most proud of when it comes to my first million?

A Uh, to this day, when people say they listen to it, I'm like, really? Why? So I'm, I'm shocked that anyone even listens to it. Whenever I get, I get recognized on the street weekly and that is the most proud. So I was going to bring this up, but we talked about Ross O'Bright and he said, I want to, I want someone to bring up Silk Road to me and I want them to not know that it was me. I've heard people talk about it or reference it and they didn't know I was there or I say who I am. I'll say I'm Sam and they don't know anything, but then I'll say like, um, oh, my last name is par and they go, oh, wait, you're, uh, from the podcast. I love it. And so that is when I'm most proud is when strangers or people I don't know say that they listen. I'm most proud of that.

AI assessment note: “that is when I'm most proud is when strangers or people I don't know”

Q place where it's like, we've done plenty, and we've had an incredible run, and if it all ended with a bang because we tried some crazy stuff that didn't work, like, I'd be okay with that too. So I feel like I'm at that place now where I wouldn't have been at 15 years, if that makes any sense. What's your sense? I mean, you started a bunch of stuff.

A My sense is that, um, So none of my things have had been as big as yours, but they've been big enough where we've had dozens or, you know, 50, 60 employees, and we got outside of the existential crisis moment where it's like things are working. My, and everyone talks about focus. Focus is a very common thing, and it's something I firmly believe in. But as someone who likes to make things, for my skill set, a company outside, like maybe let's say Three million in revenue, or maybe, maybe five million in revenue. I've noticed consistently a five million in revenue and like, 15 employees, something like that. I'm like, I don't know what to do with my hands. Like I'm just sitting here. Like what, how do, what do I do? I feel useless. And I feel like, uh, sometimes a general behind the scenes, just pointing. And I've noticed something that I, I, I really dislike, but I think it's normal is a company ebbs and flows. And I've noticed that this ebb and flow carries over to the rest of my life where, uh, I just had a child and I'm like, I'm in this Uh, quiet time for a moment where I have to be present. Whereas there's other times where you're dating or something like that. And you're like, I'm in, I'm, I'm in war mode a little bit where it's like, there's, it's action constantly, or like, I'm on top of my game and I gotta be on top of my game. Same with business where it's like, we're …

AI assessment note: “My sense is that, um, So none of my things have had been as big”

Q Loved, loved every minute of it. So now you can get out of the hot seat on your personal life. And I'm going to throw to you the, this was the most liked question. So what were your alternative business ideas if you didn't do Hampton?

A So I, um, I'm, I think I mentioned this last podcast. There's this thing called Ikigai that I'm totally bought into. I'm very fascinated with Japanese culture. Japan has this, like this philosophy where I think I said it last time. It was like a Venn diagram of like what the world wants, what the world wants to pay for, what you're good at, what you love doing. I try to find something in the middle. One thing that I'm obsessed about is data and numbers. I really am. Um, like I, If you search, if you go to my personal blog, which don't judge, I started when I was 21, and I quit blogging there. But I used to have this document called the CEO document. And I tracked hundreds and hundreds of people. I read lots of biographies and I tracked when they're born, when they started their apprenticeship, when they found success, and then like what the success was. And I made these like in-depth databases. I'm obsessed with databases. I'm obsessed with researching things. So I have hundreds of pages, pages of my notion document where I deconstruct how different companies work. So I thought about creating a research company. Or a database company. The reason I didn't start it was because I couldn't find an appropriate problem to solve for. So I have all these databases of information, and I like to analyze them and figure out what they mean. But I couldn't find a good use case, or I couldn'…

AI assessment note: “So I thought about creating a research company. Or a database company.”

Q Why should you get on an airplane? Do you really care?

A Yeah, it doesn't matter. I'm in one a, no one's bothering me in one a. And in some regard, the commercial jet is safer. You have more amenities. So yeah, like, but I've been on a, I flew first class, uh, from New York to LA one time for, like, some meeting. I would, I had never flown first class, but I did it because it was overnight, and I had to be ready for a meeting. And I get on, I was one A, and one B, or sitting right next to me, was Stephen A. Smith. And I was like, how the fuck did you get on the plane before me? And I, like, looked it up, and apparently there is, like, a private door, I guess, if you're famous. Uh, what, what is that?

AI assessment note: “Yeah, it doesn't matter. I'm in one a, no one's bothering me”

Q Girls are so brutal. Okay, this next question is from Caitlin. What is one trendy business model, uh, you think is overhyped?

A Um, I think the NFT and web three stuff is just complete nonsense. I think it's inferior entrepreneurs slapping their web three name on crap that no one wants and hoping that it's going to work. So, but everyone knows that now. Um, I think, um, what's overhyped. I think starting a newsletter is really popular right now. Most people don't realize it is a treadmill. It is very challenging to create new content, just like this podcast. It's hard. This is a hard job. I like it because I think I'm good at it, or I'm decent. But it is very challenging. Any type of content business, very, very, very, very hard to do for like two or three years. And newsletter, the newsletter space, significantly different than when I started. It is way more competitive, way more challenging. So I think that is a bit overhyped. Although I would still start one because I like it. I think that most of the people in the space Are not going to work and it's pretty bad. Their content stinks because it's just a rinse and repeat of what already has existed. So I think that's quite overhyped. I would say getting popular on the internet can be awesome because you get an audience. But, um, in general, I think that creating businesses based off your, or like getting popular on Twitter and Instagram and things like that, I think it's incredibly empty feeling for most people. And I think it's complete nonsense and …

AI assessment note: “I think the NFT and web three stuff is just complete nonsense.”

Q I'm, I'm a very withholding mother, so I totally get. And speaking of you being effing rich, this is a next question that I personally am curious about. It's what's the biggest difference in your lifestyle now that you're effing rich?

A I have nothing to do with picking these questions. I just want to say that I hate talking. I don't like that topic, but I will discuss it. So Basically, before I sold my first company, I, my four years of salary leading up to it was 20,000 a year, 20,000 a year. I think I paid myself a 150,000 a year. And then the last year, I think I paid myself 350,000 dollars a year. So for the first while, I didn't have a lot of money. I was, I was, I didn't have much. And then all of a sudden I sold the business and I, I had enough. Uh, at first, I did something that I advise everyone not to do, which is I bought a few things. I bought some real estate. I think that I bought a fancy car. I think that That brings close to no happiness, um, and might be one of those things that you have to go through in order to, um, to truly appreciate. But I think that if you do have a windfall, you likely shouldn't buy anything crazy fancy for the first year or two and just get used to it. But I've also learned, there's this like, um, story about, um, the study about these people who have studied, uh, amputees. And they found that after six months, the level of happiness went back to where they were when they had both legs. So you, you get hurt, you lose your leg, you're bummed for a little while. After six months, you go right back to feeling as good as you did with two legs. That kind of happens. Um, wh…

AI assessment note: “the biggest change is my confidence. My confidence went through the roof.”

Q that this thing has, um, this thing resonates with people and that's the beauty of having Twitter. So visualize value. You can see this image that you own. Through 3300 or 4500 people clicked on and said, I like this thing. So there's also a mega advantage there having that layer on top where you can evaluate how, like how much this thing resonates before yourself. Does that make sense?

A I, yeah, that does make sense. And Jack, as like, I consider us close friends, I wanted to like buy, I wanted to, I was willing to spend around 5000 dollars to buy one of your things, just because I like look up to you as like a creator, and I actually think your art's badass, and I think you're gonna be like a far more important person than you already are. I was willing, I, so I get the sentiment. Now, without sounding like a douche, like, I, I have money, right? And I was only willing to spend five grand. The way, the re, the way that someone was gonna spend a 150 grand, that either they're like, way richer than I am, or they're just crazy. That's what I, like, I don't understand a 150 K, but like, maybe some people don't understand that I was willing to do five K. So these are the people who bought, bought it very, very wealthy.

AI assessment note: “I, yeah, that does make sense. And Jack, as like, I consider us”

Q subway, it would be an air-based subway. He's just creative. Like, but look, I think everyone's got to figure out what it is they want their own life to be. Like, there's no bad or worth selling out stuff. Uh, I guess lately I've been just thinking about, like, with this one period of time we have here on Earth, like, how interesting do we each want to make it?

A Yes, but I will to play devil's advocate. It's also how hard do you want to grind? So like, do you want to like, cause I think that in order to make, in order to make cool shit, I can't decide how I feel at the moment. Actually for the longest time, I was like, dude, in order to make something huge and something amazing, you gotta just lock yourself in a room for like three years. Like you just have to grind. Now my thinking is, I think you actually only need to do that early on and then you can somewhat let up. So where's your opinion on that? Do you have to grind like all the time in order to make something happen? Or do you think that you can, you could have a little bit more balance? Because if you have to grind all the time, that's just exhausting. I only have that so many times in my life.

AI assessment note: “to play devil's advocate. It's also how hard do you want to grind?”

Q million pounds. It's really cool. But one of the weirdest houses you'll ever see, it's mostly a pool, uh, in the middle and it's a treasure island themed with like palm trees and like a bunch of pirate stuff. And the whole house only has two bedrooms. So the question is, fellas, does this make you guys into themed houses? Are you guys gonna be building, uh, themed houses now?

A Well, the takeaway here for me is F legacy because this guy built something that he wanted. And oftentimes people will say things like, um, well, what about the resale value of this thing? Um, or how, uh, how is this gonna impact your legacy? And my reply to that lately has been like, well, I don't know, like I'm, I'm gonna be dead. I don't care. And so what I appreciate about this is that he spent his money the way he wanted to, and he made something cool, even if it didn't do, uh, make any financial sense. So I think it's cool. Um, and if you haven't read his book, how to get rich, we talked about a bunch here. It changed my life. Whenever we talk about that book, it like goes up to like number, uh, 10, top 10 in the business category. So go read it. It's, it's awesome.

AI assessment note: “the takeaway here for me is F legacy because this guy built something that he wanted”

Q What technology tells you to stop eating ice cream and eat more kale?

A Well, okay, so I, I, I've been sober for 12 years or so, but when I took it five years ago, I was like, you know what's crazy is I walked by a brewery the other day, and sometimes when I walk by breweries and I smell like hops, you guys ever like smell that in the middle of the day? I'm like, oh, that's amazing. I wish I was there. I remember smelling it, and I was like, I don't like wish I would, like, I don't want to go there and like drink this stuff, and then I remember eating like a scoop of ice cream or just a bite of ice cream, and I was like, That was lovely. I don't want it anymore.

AI assessment note: “I remember eating like a scoop of ice cream... I don't want it anymore.”

Q So I, I guess an example would be like, well, what are other bottlenecks like memory bandwidth? What, like, what if you design storage to be specific for AI data centers? What if you, like you could do cooling systems for, like there are, if you just reimagine the entire data center around like big AI In France, I think you end up with like totally different needs.

A The, uh, the New York Times had this article the other day, and I don't remember the stat entirely, but it was something like the amount of AI capacity or in chips, like currently created right now, we need to create like another like four trillion dollars in market cap in order to satisfy like the amount of capacity that we have. And they were sort of writing it in a, in a way of like, I don't know if we're gonna be able to do that. But then when you think about it the other way around, where you, where you think about, well, in 1998, if you said like, you know, what, how big is the internet going to be? Uh, I'm sure it went far beyond virtually 100% of the expert's opinion as to how big it will get. And I remember reading this article the other day and I was like, that's just absolutely astounding that we're in one of these moments.

AI assessment note: “The, uh, the New York Times had this article the other day”

Q order effects? If it's true that there's going to be a lot more autonomy, like, how quickly does that ramp up? You take, like, Waymo, which is a lot of people think of as in, like, Phoenix or San Francisco. I just read an article the other day saying that Waymo's are already taking up 20% of Uber rides in Austin, and so this stuff can, like, move pretty quickly.

A I had a, I don't, I don't smoke weed anymore or do anything like that, but I had like this thought the other day, because I had to send someone a letter in California. Isn't it insane that for, what's a stamp cost? 40 cents, 50 cents, that I can send a letter, 3500 miles, and it will reliably get to pretty much any house I want to in a matter of like four or five days. I think that is insane. That is insane. That is so crazy, and to think that, like, so there's that type of delivery that I think of all the time, and I'm like, the post office, USPS, uh, UPS, FedEx, these companies are wild. That's got the biggest moat ever. To build that, that is so freaking hard. But then, there's the last mile component, and that's this whole other thing, and to think that drones, that that's what's gonna be happening, is that drones are gonna be flying everywhere. It's pretty wild to, like, imagine, like, The moat that a company in this space has. It is, it's, it's, it's, it's hard to, like, comprehend, because if you think, 50 years ago, to try to explain to someone, no, you're not going to go to Walmart anymore, you're not going to go anywhere, everything's going to come to your door. To think, how is that going to change in the next 20 or 50 years? It's hard to comprehend.

AI assessment note: “I had like this thought the other day, because I had to send someone a letter”