Feb 8, 2024 · 35m · mad
Bootstrapping a Decacorn on $15k with Celonis CEO Alex Rinke
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
In this episode of The MAD Podcast, host Matt Turck interviews Celonis co-founder and CEO Alex Rinke to discuss how the company pioneered process mining, scaled from a $15,000 university project into an $11+ billion decacorn, and integrates Generative AI into enterprise workflows.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Matt holds 16.7% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Matt as informed peer 4.1 Guest teaching 4.4 Guest disagreement 1.6 Matt pushing back 0.6
speaking balance: gold is Matt, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 26:04 Rejecting AI-washing hype
Alex forcefully criticizes tech industry pressure to rebrand to celonis.ai and fake generative AI positioning, insisting on delivering real customer outcomes over hype.
Hardest push from Matt ▶ 11:00 Questioning startup partnership timingMatt challenges the premise of early partnerships, questioning whether Celonis was too small at the time for an SAP partnership to be effective.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 11:30 Masterclass on true Product-Market FitAlex reframes the host's partnership question to educate the audience on why 90% of partnerships fail and why faking product-market fit destroys startups.
Matt holds his own ▶ 18:40 Clarifying automated process inferenceMatt uses his understanding of enterprise architecture to cut through technical jargon, explicitly clarifying that process maps are inferred from IT logs rather than manually input.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Matt as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Matt pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Welcome and Key Milestones at Data Driven NYC | 4 | 4 | 0 | 0 | Matt demonstrates thorough preparation by citing exact metrics including Celonis's 3,000 employees, 5,000 enterprise deployments, and $13B valuation. Alex provides a clear foundational explanation of process mining using the metaphor of a giant data vacuum cleaner. | |
| University Origins and $15,000 Scrappy Bootstrap | 2 | 3 | 1 | 0 | Matt asks open questions about bootstrapping from his perspective as a VC. Alex explains the scrappy origins of building a prototype in three weeks and contrasting German incorporation funding requirements with massive US seed rounds. | |
| The SAP Partnership and True Product-Market Fit | 4 | 6 | 3 | 2 | Matt pushes on startup-partner timing and brings up the SAP relationship story. Alex corrects the detail about connecting with SAP's co-founder rather than CEO and delivers a strong lesson on why product-market fit must precede partnerships, warning against startups that fake PMF. | |
| Strategic Expansion into the US Market | 5 | 5 | 1 | 1 | Matt lists distinct technical components of the Celonis platform and asks a sharp clarifying question to ensure listeners understand that process flows are inferred automatically from data rather than defined manually. Alex provides an in-depth breakdown of the Process Intelligence Graph. | |
| Generative AI Capabilities and Symbio Acquisition | 5 | 4 | 1 | 0 | Matt references specific announcements from Celonis's annual conference as well as their acquisition of Symbio. Alex explains how the Process Intelligence Graph acts as a context layer for LLMs and how Symbio captures non-system organizational knowledge. | |
| Navigating AI Hype vs. Tangible Customer Value | 4 | 6 | 4 | 1 | Alex voices strong skepticism toward AI-washing in tech, recounting how he resisted pressure to rebrand as celonis.ai or present fake AI narratives. He also offers detailed GTM advice, insisting that founders must close their first million in revenue personally. | |
| CEO Growth, Active Listening, and Founder Mentorship | 5 | 3 | 1 | 0 | Matt demonstrates host knowledge by bringing up Alex's mathematics background and early coding role under CTO Martin to ask how he grew as a first-time CEO. Alex emphasizes active listening, humility, and seeking external founder mentors. |
Statements from this episode (11)
Matt Turck: Celonis reached 3,000 employees and a $13B valuation
“So, 3000 employees in Munich, New York, Madrid, and 17 offices around the world. 5000 enterprise customer deployments. And a thirteen billion dollar Valuation. Most recently, you raised a billion dollar in Series D round.”
Alex Rinke: Celonis raised only $15,000 during its first six years
“We had no funding, right, so for the first six years we had All the funding we had was 15,000 US dollars.”
Alex Rinke: 90% of business partnerships fail
“Partnerships, Often don't work. Like, 90% of them don't work, right?”
Alex Rinke: Do not scale GTM or raise big money before achieving PMF
“I would not recommend you thinking about partnerships, or scaling go to market, or hiring salespeople, or even raising a lot of money, to be honest, before you feel really confident that you have a product that solves a problem, that you can scale, that you ca…”
Alex Rinke: European startups expanding to the US require singular focus
“The U.S., if you're a European company, is a really tough market to crack, and you need to put a lot of focus into that. You can't do 20 other things at the same time.”
Rinke: Many enterprise software companies over-pivoted on AI without achieving traction
“A lot of enterprise companies sort of over pivoted on AI, but then couldn't really show traction, right?”
Advisors urged Alex Rinke to rebrand Celonis to an AI domain
“There was literally people telling me, like, you need to get rid of solonis.com, you need to call it solonis.ai, right?”
Alex Rinke: Hiring a large sales force is not a GTM strategy
“Just hiring a lot of salespeople, right? It's not a go-to-market strategy. And that's what a lot of startups did, right? Hey, we have just got a hundred million dollars in funding. We're going to hire tons of salespeople. They know how to do this. Good luck. T…”
Alex Rinke: Enterprise founders must personally sell their first $2 million
“If you didn't sell the first million or two in revenue yourself, Don't expect anybody else to do it, right?”
Rinke: Experienced tech leaders often agree to mentor founders via cold email
“You wouldn't believe like what kind of people you just email. Hey, can you get on a call with me to, you know, to, you know, I'm trying to do the startup and, you know, I want to learn something that actually are going to mentor you and help you.”