Aug 10, 2020 · 1h 9m · capital-allocators

Diversity, Equity & Inclusion 1: Jacob Walthour – A Blueprint for Diversity (Capital Allocators, EP.151)

Jake Walthour · 52m spoken Ted Seides · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this inaugural episode of the Capital Allocators DEI miniseries, host Ted Seides interviews Blueprint Capital Advisors CEO Jacob Walthour to examine his thirty-year Wall Street career, systemic racial disparities in finance, and Blueprint's landmark lawsuit defending diverse asset managers.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Ted holds 14.2% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Ted as informed peer 2.9 Guest teaching 4.2 Guest disagreement 1.9 Ted pushing back 0.2
05100:0015:0030:0045:001:00:004:40–8:47 · Ted as informed peer 2/10 Breaking into Wall Street at Lehman Brothers Ted opens with broad biographical prompts about breaking into banking in 1990. Jake details his unconventional background from a public university and cold-calling Lehman Brothers 14 times.8:48–13:28 · Ted as informed peer 3/10 Transitioning to Asset Management and Morgan Stanley Ted asks how Jake transitioned from banking to asset management. Jake outlines the economic stability of asset management fees versus transaction-based banking and reflects on Morgan Stanley's global expansion.13:29–19:44 · Ted as informed peer 3/10 Early Encounters with Racial Bias and Structural Inequity Jake provides an eye-opening account of systemic racial bias on Wall Street, comparing diversity and finance to 'ketchup and peanut butter.' He explains how connected peers received unearned advantages while minority professionals faced structural ceilings.19:45–23:55 · Ted as informed peer 2/10 Driving Real Corporate Change Beyond Performative Statements Ted asks how change should occur from the bottom up. Jake counters that real solutions must come from top leadership and challenges performative corporate statements following George Floyd's murder.23:55–27:52 · Ted as informed peer 4/10 Strategic Allocation of Race in Wall Street Client Coverage Jake describes how Wall Street strategically pairs race and gender to client coverage, segregating Black bankers into public finance. Ted observes that firms may simply be responding to behavioral tribal affinity, prompting Jake to argue leadership must override harmful biases.27:52–34:12 · Ted as informed peer 3/10 Informal Social Networks and Subtle Exclusionary Dynamics Jake articulates the subtle, informal dynamics that exclude minority professionals, such as golf weekends and casual stereotyping around sports. He stresses that Wall Street must create an environment where sharing these sensitivities carries no career penalty.34:13–40:29 · Ted as informed peer 3/10 Mentorship and Key Investment Lessons from Wall Street Icons Ted guides the conversation toward Jake's work across elite hedge fund managers. Jake shares key management and investment philosophies adopted from Peter Cohen, Ken Griffin, Louis Bacon, and Robert Smith.40:29–42:54 · Ted as informed peer 4/10 Consulting Experience and Allocator-Centric Strategy Design Jake explains how working at institutional consultants Axia and Cliffwater taught him to sit on the allocator's side of the table and reverse-engineer solutions rather than forcing standard products onto clients.42:54–45:43 · Ted as informed peer 4/10 Founding Blueprint Capital and Pivoting to Niche Private Credit Ted asks about the founding and evolution of Blueprint Capital Advisors. Jake details pivoting from hedge fund fee compression toward niche private credit strategies generating high single-digit cash yields with lower downside risk.45:52–55:45 · Ted as informed peer 2/10 The Lawsuit: FAIR Program and Allegations of Discrimination Jake lays out the core allegations of Blueprint's lawsuit against the State of New Jersey and BlackRock, alleging theft of the FAIR proprietary program and explicit racial discrimination by state investment officials.55:45–59:46 · Ted as informed peer 2/10 Catalyzing Industry Progress and the Broader Mission for Equity Ted asks Jake how he will define success in the litigation. Jake frames the lawsuit not as a quest for a payout, but as a broader civil rights mission to create structural accountability across pension plans, consultants, and mega-managers.4:40–8:47 · Guest teaching 3/10 Breaking into Wall Street at Lehman Brothers Ted opens with broad biographical prompts about breaking into banking in 1990. Jake details his unconventional background from a public university and cold-calling Lehman Brothers 14 times.8:48–13:28 · Guest teaching 2/10 Transitioning to Asset Management and Morgan Stanley Ted asks how Jake transitioned from banking to asset management. Jake outlines the economic stability of asset management fees versus transaction-based banking and reflects on Morgan Stanley's global expansion.13:29–19:44 · Guest teaching 6/10 Early Encounters with Racial Bias and Structural Inequity Jake provides an eye-opening account of systemic racial bias on Wall Street, comparing diversity and finance to 'ketchup and peanut butter.' He explains how connected peers received unearned advantages while minority professionals faced structural ceilings.19:45–23:55 · Guest teaching 5/10 Driving Real Corporate Change Beyond Performative Statements Ted asks how change should occur from the bottom up. Jake counters that real solutions must come from top leadership and challenges performative corporate statements following George Floyd's murder.23:55–27:52 · Guest teaching 5/10 Strategic Allocation of Race in Wall Street Client Coverage Jake describes how Wall Street strategically pairs race and gender to client coverage, segregating Black bankers into public finance. Ted observes that firms may simply be responding to behavioral tribal affinity, prompting Jake to argue leadership must override harmful biases.27:52–34:12 · Guest teaching 6/10 Informal Social Networks and Subtle Exclusionary Dynamics Jake articulates the subtle, informal dynamics that exclude minority professionals, such as golf weekends and casual stereotyping around sports. He stresses that Wall Street must create an environment where sharing these sensitivities carries no career penalty.34:13–40:29 · Guest teaching 2/10 Mentorship and Key Investment Lessons from Wall Street Icons Ted guides the conversation toward Jake's work across elite hedge fund managers. Jake shares key management and investment philosophies adopted from Peter Cohen, Ken Griffin, Louis Bacon, and Robert Smith.40:29–42:54 · Guest teaching 3/10 Consulting Experience and Allocator-Centric Strategy Design Jake explains how working at institutional consultants Axia and Cliffwater taught him to sit on the allocator's side of the table and reverse-engineer solutions rather than forcing standard products onto clients.42:54–45:43 · Guest teaching 3/10 Founding Blueprint Capital and Pivoting to Niche Private Credit Ted asks about the founding and evolution of Blueprint Capital Advisors. Jake details pivoting from hedge fund fee compression toward niche private credit strategies generating high single-digit cash yields with lower downside risk.45:52–55:45 · Guest teaching 6/10 The Lawsuit: FAIR Program and Allegations of Discrimination Jake lays out the core allegations of Blueprint's lawsuit against the State of New Jersey and BlackRock, alleging theft of the FAIR proprietary program and explicit racial discrimination by state investment officials.55:45–59:46 · Guest teaching 5/10 Catalyzing Industry Progress and the Broader Mission for Equity Ted asks Jake how he will define success in the litigation. Jake frames the lawsuit not as a quest for a payout, but as a broader civil rights mission to create structural accountability across pension plans, consultants, and mega-managers.4:40–8:47 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Breaking into Wall Street at Lehman Brothers Ted opens with broad biographical prompts about breaking into banking in 1990. Jake details his unconventional background from a public university and cold-calling Lehman Brothers 14 times.8:48–13:28 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Transitioning to Asset Management and Morgan Stanley Ted asks how Jake transitioned from banking to asset management. Jake outlines the economic stability of asset management fees versus transaction-based banking and reflects on Morgan Stanley's global expansion.13:29–19:44 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Early Encounters with Racial Bias and Structural Inequity Jake provides an eye-opening account of systemic racial bias on Wall Street, comparing diversity and finance to 'ketchup and peanut butter.' He explains how connected peers received unearned advantages while minority professionals faced structural ceilings.19:45–23:55 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Driving Real Corporate Change Beyond Performative Statements Ted asks how change should occur from the bottom up. Jake counters that real solutions must come from top leadership and challenges performative corporate statements following George Floyd's murder.23:55–27:52 · Guest disagreement 3/10 Strategic Allocation of Race in Wall Street Client Coverage Jake describes how Wall Street strategically pairs race and gender to client coverage, segregating Black bankers into public finance. Ted observes that firms may simply be responding to behavioral tribal affinity, prompting Jake to argue leadership must override harmful biases.27:52–34:12 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Informal Social Networks and Subtle Exclusionary Dynamics Jake articulates the subtle, informal dynamics that exclude minority professionals, such as golf weekends and casual stereotyping around sports. He stresses that Wall Street must create an environment where sharing these sensitivities carries no career penalty.34:13–40:29 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Mentorship and Key Investment Lessons from Wall Street Icons Ted guides the conversation toward Jake's work across elite hedge fund managers. Jake shares key management and investment philosophies adopted from Peter Cohen, Ken Griffin, Louis Bacon, and Robert Smith.40:29–42:54 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Consulting Experience and Allocator-Centric Strategy Design Jake explains how working at institutional consultants Axia and Cliffwater taught him to sit on the allocator's side of the table and reverse-engineer solutions rather than forcing standard products onto clients.42:54–45:43 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Founding Blueprint Capital and Pivoting to Niche Private Credit Ted asks about the founding and evolution of Blueprint Capital Advisors. Jake details pivoting from hedge fund fee compression toward niche private credit strategies generating high single-digit cash yields with lower downside risk.45:52–55:45 · Guest disagreement 5/10 The Lawsuit: FAIR Program and Allegations of Discrimination Jake lays out the core allegations of Blueprint's lawsuit against the State of New Jersey and BlackRock, alleging theft of the FAIR proprietary program and explicit racial discrimination by state investment officials.55:45–59:46 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Catalyzing Industry Progress and the Broader Mission for Equity Ted asks Jake how he will define success in the litigation. Jake frames the lawsuit not as a quest for a payout, but as a broader civil rights mission to create structural accountability across pension plans, consultants, and mega-managers.4:40–8:47 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Breaking into Wall Street at Lehman Brothers Ted opens with broad biographical prompts about breaking into banking in 1990. Jake details his unconventional background from a public university and cold-calling Lehman Brothers 14 times.8:48–13:28 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Transitioning to Asset Management and Morgan Stanley Ted asks how Jake transitioned from banking to asset management. Jake outlines the economic stability of asset management fees versus transaction-based banking and reflects on Morgan Stanley's global expansion.13:29–19:44 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Early Encounters with Racial Bias and Structural Inequity Jake provides an eye-opening account of systemic racial bias on Wall Street, comparing diversity and finance to 'ketchup and peanut butter.' He explains how connected peers received unearned advantages while minority professionals faced structural ceilings.19:45–23:55 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Driving Real Corporate Change Beyond Performative Statements Ted asks how change should occur from the bottom up. Jake counters that real solutions must come from top leadership and challenges performative corporate statements following George Floyd's murder.23:55–27:52 · Ted pushing back 2/10 Strategic Allocation of Race in Wall Street Client Coverage Jake describes how Wall Street strategically pairs race and gender to client coverage, segregating Black bankers into public finance. Ted observes that firms may simply be responding to behavioral tribal affinity, prompting Jake to argue leadership must override harmful biases.27:52–34:12 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Informal Social Networks and Subtle Exclusionary Dynamics Jake articulates the subtle, informal dynamics that exclude minority professionals, such as golf weekends and casual stereotyping around sports. He stresses that Wall Street must create an environment where sharing these sensitivities carries no career penalty.34:13–40:29 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Mentorship and Key Investment Lessons from Wall Street Icons Ted guides the conversation toward Jake's work across elite hedge fund managers. Jake shares key management and investment philosophies adopted from Peter Cohen, Ken Griffin, Louis Bacon, and Robert Smith.40:29–42:54 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Consulting Experience and Allocator-Centric Strategy Design Jake explains how working at institutional consultants Axia and Cliffwater taught him to sit on the allocator's side of the table and reverse-engineer solutions rather than forcing standard products onto clients.42:54–45:43 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Founding Blueprint Capital and Pivoting to Niche Private Credit Ted asks about the founding and evolution of Blueprint Capital Advisors. Jake details pivoting from hedge fund fee compression toward niche private credit strategies generating high single-digit cash yields with lower downside risk.45:52–55:45 · Ted pushing back 0/10 The Lawsuit: FAIR Program and Allegations of Discrimination Jake lays out the core allegations of Blueprint's lawsuit against the State of New Jersey and BlackRock, alleging theft of the FAIR proprietary program and explicit racial discrimination by state investment officials.55:45–59:46 · Ted pushing back 0/10 Catalyzing Industry Progress and the Broader Mission for Equity Ted asks Jake how he will define success in the litigation. Jake frames the lawsuit not as a quest for a payout, but as a broader civil rights mission to create structural accountability across pension plans, consultants, and mega-managers.

speaking balance: gold is Ted, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Ted 100% · guest 0%0:00 · Ted 100% · guest 0%3:00 · Ted 60.4% · guest 39.6%3:00 · Ted 60.4% · guest 39.6%6:00 · Ted 9.8% · guest 90.2%6:00 · Ted 9.8% · guest 90.2%9:00 · Ted 1.4% · guest 98.6%9:00 · Ted 1.4% · guest 98.6%12:00 · Ted 13.4% · guest 86.6%12:00 · Ted 13.4% · guest 86.6%15:00 · Ted 3.3% · guest 96.7%15:00 · Ted 3.3% · guest 96.7%18:00 · Ted 7.7% · guest 92.3%18:00 · Ted 7.7% · guest 92.3%21:00 · Ted 21% · guest 79%21:00 · Ted 21% · guest 79%24:00 · Ted 0.1% · guest 99.9%24:00 · Ted 0.1% · guest 99.9%27:00 · Ted 29.1% · guest 70.9%27:00 · Ted 29.1% · guest 70.9%30:00 · Ted 8.1% · guest 91.9%30:00 · Ted 8.1% · guest 91.9%33:00 · Ted 10.3% · guest 89.7%33:00 · Ted 10.3% · guest 89.7%36:00 · Ted 1.6% · guest 98.4%36:00 · Ted 1.6% · guest 98.4%39:00 · Ted 6.9% · guest 93.1%39:00 · Ted 6.9% · guest 93.1%42:00 · Ted 4.1% · guest 95.9%42:00 · Ted 4.1% · guest 95.9%45:00 · Ted 6.5% · guest 93.5%45:00 · Ted 6.5% · guest 93.5%48:00 · Ted 2.1% · guest 97.9%48:00 · Ted 2.1% · guest 97.9%51:00 · Ted 0% · guest 100%51:00 · Ted 0% · guest 100%54:00 · Ted 2.9% · guest 97.1%54:00 · Ted 2.9% · guest 97.1%57:00 · Ted 7.2% · guest 92.8%57:00 · Ted 7.2% · guest 92.8%1:00:00 · Ted 14.6% · guest 85.4%1:00:00 · Ted 14.6% · guest 85.4%1:03:00 · Ted 1.8% · guest 98.2%1:03:00 · Ted 1.8% · guest 98.2%1:06:00 · Ted 7.3% · guest 92.7%1:06:00 · Ted 7.3% · guest 92.7%1:09:00 · Ted 47.9% · guest 52.1%1:09:00 · Ted 47.9% · guest 52.1%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 53:20 Exposing alleged blatant institutional discrimination

Jake forcefully reveals how New Jersey officials allegedly appropriated Blueprint's FAIR program and explicitly told him that the investment council was averse to minority-owned managers.

Hardest push from Ted ▶ 26:59 Host raising behavioral affinity rationale

Ted gently challenges Jake's premise by noting that firms matching salespeople to clients of similar backgrounds might simply be rational profit-maximization based on human affinity.

Biggest teaching moment ▶ 13:48 Explaining the reality of diversity in finance

Jake candidly educates the host on how financial services fundamentally struggle with inclusion, using the blunt analogy of ketchup and peanut butter.

Ted holds their own ▶ 27:05 Framing client assignment as psychological tribalism

Ted demonstrates industry insight into allocator sales behavior, articulating how firms leverage tribal affinity before questioning where systemic correction should originate.

the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicTed as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementTed pushing backWhy
Breaking into Wall Street at Lehman Brothers 2310 Ted opens with broad biographical prompts about breaking into banking in 1990. Jake details his unconventional background from a public university and cold-calling Lehman Brothers 14 times.
Transitioning to Asset Management and Morgan Stanley 3200 Ted asks how Jake transitioned from banking to asset management. Jake outlines the economic stability of asset management fees versus transaction-based banking and reflects on Morgan Stanley's global expansion.
Early Encounters with Racial Bias and Structural Inequity 3620 Jake provides an eye-opening account of systemic racial bias on Wall Street, comparing diversity and finance to 'ketchup and peanut butter.' He explains how connected peers received unearned advantages while minority professionals faced structural ceilings.
Driving Real Corporate Change Beyond Performative Statements 2530 Ted asks how change should occur from the bottom up. Jake counters that real solutions must come from top leadership and challenges performative corporate statements following George Floyd's murder.
Strategic Allocation of Race in Wall Street Client Coverage 4532 Jake describes how Wall Street strategically pairs race and gender to client coverage, segregating Black bankers into public finance. Ted observes that firms may simply be responding to behavioral tribal affinity, prompting Jake to argue leadership must override harmful biases.
Informal Social Networks and Subtle Exclusionary Dynamics 3620 Jake articulates the subtle, informal dynamics that exclude minority professionals, such as golf weekends and casual stereotyping around sports. He stresses that Wall Street must create an environment where sharing these sensitivities carries no career penalty.
Mentorship and Key Investment Lessons from Wall Street Icons 3200 Ted guides the conversation toward Jake's work across elite hedge fund managers. Jake shares key management and investment philosophies adopted from Peter Cohen, Ken Griffin, Louis Bacon, and Robert Smith.
Consulting Experience and Allocator-Centric Strategy Design 4310 Jake explains how working at institutional consultants Axia and Cliffwater taught him to sit on the allocator's side of the table and reverse-engineer solutions rather than forcing standard products onto clients.
Founding Blueprint Capital and Pivoting to Niche Private Credit 4300 Ted asks about the founding and evolution of Blueprint Capital Advisors. Jake details pivoting from hedge fund fee compression toward niche private credit strategies generating high single-digit cash yields with lower downside risk.
The Lawsuit: FAIR Program and Allegations of Discrimination 2650 Jake lays out the core allegations of Blueprint's lawsuit against the State of New Jersey and BlackRock, alleging theft of the FAIR proprietary program and explicit racial discrimination by state investment officials.
Catalyzing Industry Progress and the Broader Mission for Equity 2540 Ted asks Jake how he will define success in the litigation. Jake frames the lawsuit not as a quest for a payout, but as a broader civil rights mission to create structural accountability across pension plans, consultants, and mega-managers.

Statements from this episode (12)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Walthour: Lehman Brothers 1990 Analyst Class Was Exclusively White Outside Diversity Programs
“Outside of those of us that came through some type of diversity program, everyone else was white.”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 7:57
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Walthour: SEO trained 60% to 70% of Black Wall Street talent
“Sponsors for educational opportunity, and great organization, probably responsible for 60 to 70% of the African American population on Wall Street at one point.”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 14:05
Insight
Walthour: Wall Street meritocracy metrics mask unequal opportunity and capital allocation
“Wall Street's a meritocracy. And I always say the numbers don't lie. And at the end of the year, you can add everything up. Well, if an African-American marketing professional or asset manager or portfolio manager had much less in the way of an opportunity set…”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 18:28
Insight
Walthour: Matching client coverage by race perpetuates inequality on Wall Street
“And so the game that's played on Wall Street that isn't so subtle is that if there is a client And the firm wants to do business with that client. They think that they need to select a woman if that client is a woman. Or they think they need to select an Afric…”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 24:54
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Walthour: Wall Street banks historically steered Black professionals toward municipal finance
“One of the areas that African Americans always got pushed into was municipal finance. Why? Because they felt like government institutions would be a better place for them to go knocking and calling versus calling on corporate America.”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 26:22
Opinion
Walthour: The Smartest People in Finance Worked for Endowments and Foundations
“Let's face it, you know, over the course of my career anyway, the smartest people worked for endowments and foundations.”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 35:32
Opinion
Walthour: Ken Griffin Holds the Title of World's Best Moneymaker
“When I went to work for Citadel, it was an opportunity to go work for a guy who I think Holds the title world's best moneymaker, Ken Griffin, and a chance to understand how he put that organization together, how he managed to just print money for a longer per…”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 35:50
Insight
Walthour: Asset managers succeed by reverse engineering products from allocator fears
“Because I think sometimes, in my career at least, I have found that the street produces a product. And then it goes out there and it tries to jam that product through decision makers. And what it taught me was that reverse engineer the process. Go and spend ti…”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 41:37
Assertion Contradicted
Walthour: In 2015, most large institutions were still paying full alternative fees
“We went around and analyzed investor portfolios, and believe it or not, Ted, despite some of the world's largest institutions being invested in hedge funds and other types of alternative products, they were paying full fees. The overwhelming majority of the in…”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 43:20
Opinion
Walthour: Larry Fink's diversity pledge was PR to deflect Blueprint's lawsuit
“Larry Fink comes out with an announcement on June, 22nd, that he's going to increase his black staff by 30% over four years. I'd like to think that we had positive influence there, but I think that it really was not a heartfelt announcement. It was really desi…”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 48:10
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Walthour: NJ Director said State Investment Council opposed minority-owned firms
“And McDonough says to me, Jake, the SIC is not a fan of investing in minority owned firms.”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 54:00
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Walthour: NJ claimed investing in diverse managers breached its fiduciary duty
“They originally told us, quote unquote, it was against their fiduciary responsibility to invest with women and minority-owned firms. Their website now says women and minority-owned firms, we're open for consideration.”
Jake Walthour Aug 10, 2020 ▶ 56:11
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