Jan 2, 2019 · 24m · a16z
a16z Podcast | Giving and Getting Feedback -- for Bosses and Employees
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In this episode of the a16z Podcast, author and executive coach Kim Malone Scott breaks down her Radical Candor framework for workplace communication, detailing how balancing personal care with direct challenge fosters professional growth and team success.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. The host holds 22.9% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
The host as informed peer 3.8 Guest teaching 4.0 Guest disagreement 1.6 The host pushing back 3.8
speaking balance: gold is the host, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 15:32 Agreeing with five percent
Kim explicitly applies her five-percent rule to Sonal's argument, rejecting Sonal's premise that startup urgency excuses a lack of personal care.
Hardest push from the host ▶ 15:14 Challenging personal care in fast-paced startupsSonal directly challenges Kim's core model by arguing that fast-paced startup environments require directness without taking time to build personal care.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 9:03 Self-generating feedback examplesKim reframes Sonal's instinct to ask givers for specific feedback examples, teaching her to self-generate examples instead of cross-examining.
The host holds their own ▶ 20:42 Managing creative talent dynamicsSonal articulates a detailed insight into the specific ego and identity dynamics involved in managing creative professionals like writers, designers, and coders.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | The host as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | The host pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| The Purpose of Feedback: Behavior vs. Personality | 3 | 3 | 1 | 4 | Sonal opens the topic by challenging the fundamental value of feedback, asking whether people can actually change or if bosses are just imposing their personal style. Kim clarifies how feedback should focus on behavior rather than core personality, illustrating with a story about a negative colleague. | |
| Four Steps to Soliciting and Receiving Guidance | 4 | 4 | 1 | 5 | Sonal pushes back when Kim advises against asking for specific examples during feedback, explaining that her intention when asking is clarity rather than defensiveness. Kim re-educates her by suggesting that feedback recipients should challenge themselves to identify the examples instead of cross-examining the giver. | |
| The Radical Candor Framework and Origin Story | 5 | 6 | 4 | 6 | Sonal directly challenges the Radical Candor framework, arguing that high-velocity startup environments don't always afford time for caring personally. Kim counters playfully using her own framework, stating she agrees with only five percent of Sonal's point before demonstrating that care requires minimal time. | |
| Gender Dynamics and Underrepresented Groups in Feedback | 3 | 4 | 1 | 1 | Sonal asks how workplace guidance dynamics change for women and underrepresented groups. Kim explains how male bosses pull punches with female employees and highlights the double standard women face when offering direct guidance. | |
| Public Praise, Private Criticism, and Managing Creatives | 4 | 3 | 1 | 3 | Sonal demonstrates strong industry knowledge while asking about managing creative employees whose identities are wrapped up in their work. Kim provides practical nuances on remote feedback, over-feedback fatigue, and knowing when to terminate non-performing working relationships. |
Statements from this episode (13)
Kim Scott: Call feedback 'guidance' to avoid triggering defensive reactions
“First of all, I call it guidance, not feedback, because feedback makes us want to put our hands over our ears, and guidance is something we all long for.”
Kim Scott: Sheryl Sandberg calling me 'stupid' was exceptionally kind feedback
“A lot of people would say it was mean of Cheryl to say I sound stupid, but in fact, it was the kindest thing she could possibly have done for me in that moment.”
Kim Scott: Stop telling colleagues not to take feedback personally
“One of the pieces of advice that I often give people is just eliminate from your vocabulary, don't take it personally. Because we spend more time at work than we do in any other activity of our lives. We spend more time with our colleagues than we do with our …”
Kim Scott: Ask colleagues for feedback when they are angry with you
“Alan Eustace, who was the head of engineering at Google, said one of the best times to ask for feedback is when you know the other person is mad at you, because they're more likely to tell you what they really think.”
Kim Scott: Good feedback is measured at the listener's ear
“I think it's really important to remember that good feedback gets measured not at your mouth, but at the other person's ear. So often, you may think You've shown you cared, and you may think you've been crystal clear. More often than not, you have showed that …”
Kim Scott: A manager's need to be liked leads to bad outcomes
“There's a big difference between caring personally and needing to be liked. Needing to be liked will lead you to a bad place.”
Kim Scott: Sparing an employee's feelings ultimately leads to firing them
“When you're trying to spare somebody's feelings to be nice, and then you're going to wind up having to fire them later, it's not so nice after all.”
Kim Scott: Obnoxious aggression is better than ruinous empathy
“I would agree that obnoxious aggression is actually better than ruinous sympathy. I'd rather have obnoxious aggression than ruinous sympathy too, but you don't have to choose between those two things.”
Kim Scott: Direct feedback across demographic differences is significantly harder
“It's hard to be radically candid with someone who looks like you. It's even harder to be radically candid with someone who doesn't look like you.”
Kim Scott: Men are conditioned from childhood to soften feedback to women
“I think Men are trained from the time they're little boys to pull their punches with women.”
Kim Scott: Women giving direct feedback risk being labeled aggressive
“There's another side to the equation, which is if you are a woman giving radical candor, you're much more likely to get unjustly accused of obnoxious aggressions.”
Kim Scott: Praise publicly and criticize privately, but keep debate public
“I am a big believer that you praise, praise in public, criticize in, in private, but I will say there's a fine line, because debate needs to happen publicly, and there's a fine line between private criticism and public debate.”