The Exchanges

Q When you decided to join, you know, um, You know, your role now. Was it an easy decision to leave your prior, which you started, and, and join as CEO?

A Yeah, it wasn't so difficult actually, because I was on my way to do something else. I had started a hedge fund. Uh, I, I worked, uh, been running it for 15 years. The learning curve was a bit, was a bit flatter, and I had decided to kind of move on, leave, pass on the firm to the next generation, and then go back to university and study. And then this job came up in the sovereign wealth fund, and I thought, you know what, this is just incredible. Combining my love for asset management, organizational development, and then do something good for the country. So that was, that was not so difficult. But it wasn't easy to get the job, right? Um.

AI assessment note: “Yeah, it wasn't so difficult actually, because I was on my way to do”

Q When you decided to join, you know, um, You know, your role now. Was it an easy decision to leave your prior, which you started, and, and join as CEO?

A Yeah, it wasn't so difficult actually, because I was on my way to do something else. I had started a hedge fund. Uh, I, I worked, uh, been running it for 15 years. The learning curve was a bit, was a bit flatter, and I had decided to kind of move on, leave, pass on the firm to the next generation, and then go back to university and study. And then this job came up in the sovereign wealth fund, and I thought, you know what, this is just incredible. Combining my love for asset management, organizational development, and then do something good for the country. So that was, that was not so difficult. But it wasn't easy to get the job, right? Um.

AI assessment note: “Yeah, it wasn't so difficult actually, because I was on my way to do”

Q You've met some of the most Impressive and incredible leaders of companies where, you know, you own one and a half percent. When you think about that, they're not the best, because that would be, obviously, choosing favorites, but just like the most memorable meetings with CEOs you've had. It could be through the podcast or through meetings. Is there one or two that stand out?

A Do you know, one I, I'm really fond of is a guy called Albert Bene in Switzerland. He's, he's the chair of both a company called Lonza and Geberit, and I did a podcast with him, and, and actually he was the first guy I rang when I got the job in the Sovereign Wealth Fund. And I asked him, Albert, I just got a new job. What should I do? And he said, well, you need to talk to a lot of people in the firm so that you get better data points, so that they get to know you because they don't know you. They need to, then they, they need to get to know you. And when you make, when you, uh, investigate change, it's easier to get through when they feel they've participated. And you need to talk to people who are, you know, the same level as you, below you, all parts of the business. Then you need to decide, what am I going to work on here? What am I going to change? Pick a few things, not many people, put it through together with a whole leader group, and don't go too fast. The people who fail are people who try to do too many things too fast. And there were a couple of times in the beginning after I got the job where we clearly were moving too fast. And it was like as if the, the lower body, you know, was kind of not in sync with the upper body.

AI assessment note: “one I, I'm really fond of is a guy called Albert Bene in Switzerland.”

Q What do you think was the biggest needle moving moment in your career? You mentioned the entry into hedge funds there.

A Yeah, I think it was when I started, uh, at Wharton, which is a U.S. university specializing in finance, because that really was a different type of ambitious, uh, ambitions. And, um, you know, Norway is the kind of place where you're not supposed to be, uh, you know, too ambitious, at least not Uh, overtly. Then you get to America, and it's just like, hey, we want to conquer the world. And you are allowed to say it when you are like, 22. And I remember in class, this guy said, uh, you know, what should I do? What should I, how should I succeed? And he's just like, yeah, but what do you want to do? I just want to conquer the world. And everybody applauded. And for me, it was just like a complete unreal situation.

AI assessment note: “I think it was when I started, uh, at Wharton”

Q When you think about, I, I love this, you asked it with, I think it's Jane, the CEO of Citi, and, and you said, If you were to really have one or two numbers which measure the health of the economy, which one or two are they for you, Jane? And I was like, that's a good question. If you have that same question, how do you respond to that?

A Well, so what I look at is how, um, how much fear and how much greed is there out there? Now, how do you measure that? Well, fear you can measure in, in, you know, in the VIX index, the volatility index, you can measure Um, well, for instance, during COVID, you can measure it in the amount of media on, on the bad news, uh, to which extent specialists disagree with each other, what are the doomsday scenarios and so on. So you can, you can get a gauge for the fear. And gee, did we have a lot of fear at the beginning of COVID when we didn't know what it was. So I think that's, that's not so difficult to measure, but it's an important one to keep track on. But then, then, um, you know, greed, how do you measure that? That's much more difficult to, To gauge. And frothiness. And to try to get your handle on that, that's really important. And so I'm wondering now, you know, over the last two, three days, the share prices of ARM has gone up, you know, a 150% or whatever it is. I mean, something very, very high number. And what is that? Is that some kind of blow, blowout, uh, you know, peak of sentiment for tech shares? Or what is it? I, I don't know, but I'm, I'm, I'm thinking about that.

AI assessment note: “what I look at is how, um, how much fear and how much greed”

Q You've met some of the most Impressive and incredible leaders of companies where, you know, you own one and a half percent. When you think about that, they're not the best, because that would be, obviously, choosing favorites, but just like the most memorable meetings with CEOs you've had. It could be through the podcast or through meetings. Is there one or two that stand out?

A Do you know, one I, I'm really fond of is a guy called Albert Bene in Switzerland. He's, he's the chair of both a company called Lonza and Geberit, and I did a podcast with him, and, and actually he was the first guy I rang when I got the job in the Sovereign Wealth Fund. And I asked him, Albert, I just got a new job. What should I do? And he said, well, you need to talk to a lot of people in the firm so that you get better data points, so that they get to know you because they don't know you. They need to, then they, they need to get to know you. And when you make, when you, uh, investigate change, it's easier to get through when they feel they've participated. And you need to talk to people who are, you know, the same level as you, below you, all parts of the business. Then you need to decide, what am I going to work on here? What am I going to change? Pick a few things, not many people, put it through together with a whole leader group, and don't go too fast. The people who fail are people who try to do too many things too fast. And there were a couple of times in the beginning after I got the job where we clearly were moving too fast. And it was like as if the, the lower body, you know, was kind of not in sync with the upper body.

AI assessment note: “one I, I'm really fond of is a guy called Albert Bene”

Q What do you think was the biggest needle moving moment in your career? You mentioned the entry into hedge funds there.

A Yeah, I think it was when I started, uh, at Wharton, which is a U.S. university specializing in finance, because that really was a different type of ambitious, uh, ambitions. And, um, you know, Norway is the kind of place where you're not supposed to be, uh, you know, too ambitious, at least not Uh, overtly. Then you get to America, and it's just like, hey, we want to conquer the world. And you are allowed to say it when you are like, 22. And I remember in class, this guy said, uh, you know, what should I do? What should I, how should I succeed? And he's just like, yeah, but what do you want to do? I just want to conquer the world. And everybody applauded. And for me, it was just like a complete unreal situation.

AI assessment note: “I think it was when I started, uh, at Wharton”

Q When you think about, I, I love this, you asked it with, I think it's Jane, the CEO of Citi, and, and you said, If you were to really have one or two numbers which measure the health of the economy, which one or two are they for you, Jane? And I was like, that's a good question. If you have that same question, how do you respond to that?

A Well, so what I look at is how, um, how much fear and how much greed is there out there? Now, how do you measure that? Well, fear you can measure in, in, you know, in the VIX index, the volatility index, you can measure Um, well, for instance, during COVID, you can measure it in the amount of media on, on the bad news, uh, to which extent specialists disagree with each other, what are the doomsday scenarios and so on. So you can, you can get a gauge for the fear. And gee, did we have a lot of fear at the beginning of COVID when we didn't know what it was. So I think that's, that's not so difficult to measure, but it's an important one to keep track on. But then, then, um, you know, greed, how do you measure that? That's much more difficult to, To gauge. And frothiness. And to try to get your handle on that, that's really important. And so I'm wondering now, you know, over the last two, three days, the share prices of ARM has gone up, you know, a 150% or whatever it is. I mean, something very, very high number. And what is that? Is that some kind of blow, blowout, uh, you know, peak of sentiment for tech shares? Or what is it? I, I don't know, but I'm, I'm, I'm thinking about that.

AI assessment note: “what I look at is how, um, how much fear and how much greed”

Q I get that. No, I totally get that. When you think about, like, how others in sovereign wealth funds do and engage in what they do, who do you respect and why?

A There are a lot of very good funds out there, right? You have the Canadians. They are, they are very strong. They are long-term thinkers. They have good institutions, good organizations. You have something like GIC in Singapore. It's very strong. I would say what I admire with funds is when they are transparent. Now, the, the Norwegian fund is the most transparent fund out there, and I can say that because we, we won the awards for being the most transparent fund in the world, so I'm not even bragging, it's just a fact. But it's so Norwegian. But it's good, it's good to be transparent. Everybody is on the same page. Every know, everybody knows, uh, you know, what's the agenda? What are we driving for? What are we trying to achieve? And it, and it establishes trust.

AI assessment note: “You have the Canadians. They are, they are very strong. They are long-term thinkers.”

Q I get that. No, I totally get that. When you think about, like, how others in sovereign wealth funds do and engage in what they do, who do you respect and why?

A There are a lot of very good funds out there, right? You have the Canadians. They are, they are very strong. They are long-term thinkers. They have good institutions, good organizations. You have something like GIC in Singapore. It's very strong. I would say what I admire with funds is when they are transparent. Now, the, the Norwegian fund is the most transparent fund out there, and I can say that because we, we won the awards for being the most transparent fund in the world, so I'm not even bragging, it's just a fact. But it's so Norwegian. But it's good, it's good to be transparent. Everybody is on the same page. Every know, everybody knows, uh, you know, what's the agenda? What are we driving for? What are we trying to achieve? And it, and it establishes trust.

AI assessment note: “You have the Canadians. They are, they are very strong. They are long-term thinkers.”

Q You said central banks there, and I saw on one interview that you did, you said you hope that central banks Change the type of data that they use to inform their thinking. And I thought, how so? I wasn't really aware of what data they specialize in, like, use today, and how would you like that change?

A Yeah, so I need to be a bit careful when I talk about central banks, because, you know, we are situated in the middle of central banks, so when I talk about central banks, I never talk about the Norwegian central bank. But I think it's interesting to look at the central banks, and I have previously said that I thought they were a bit slow to increase rates. Now, I think that's Pretty, uh, that's the opinion that many people have, and they have admitted it themselves, so I don't think it's particularly controversial to say. And to me, the question is just like, what kind of alternative data do you use? Do you speak to the CEO of companies and ask them what they expect for the next 12 months? And historically, they haven't necessarily done that. I think they probably will do it or are already doing it more. And, and perhaps that will improve the decision making.

AI assessment note: “Do you speak to the CEO of companies and ask them what they expect”

Q You said central banks there, and I saw on one interview that you did, you said you hope that central banks Change the type of data that they use to inform their thinking. And I thought, how so? I wasn't really aware of what data they specialize in, like, use today, and how would you like that change?

A Yeah, so I need to be a bit careful when I talk about central banks, because, you know, we are situated in the middle of central banks, so when I talk about central banks, I never talk about the Norwegian central bank. But I think it's interesting to look at the central banks, and I have previously said that I thought they were a bit slow to increase rates. Now, I think that's Pretty, uh, that's the opinion that many people have, and they have admitted it themselves, so I don't think it's particularly controversial to say. And to me, the question is just like, what kind of alternative data do you use? Do you speak to the CEO of companies and ask them what they expect for the next 12 months? And historically, they haven't necessarily done that. I think they probably will do it or are already doing it more. And, and perhaps that will improve the decision making.

AI assessment note: “Do you speak to the CEO of companies and ask them what they expect”