Feb 15, 2021 · 36m · 20vc
20VC: Wunderlist & Pitch Founder, Christian Reber on His Personal Relationship with Risk, Money, Whether the Sale to Microsoft was a Mistake, What Great Product Designs Means Today & Why Founders Investing External Capital is a Distraction
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gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions
In this episode of TwentyVC, host Harry Stebbings interviews Christian Reber, founder and CEO of Pitch and former creator of Wunderlist. Reber shares insights on product design intuition, lessons from the Wunderlist acquisition by Microsoft, founder health and work-life balance, and his ambitious vision for Pitch.
How this conversation actually went
Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Harry holds 29.7% of the talking time here. How this is scored →
Harry as informed peer 1.6 Guest teaching 4.0 Guest disagreement 1.3 Harry pushing back 1.1
speaking balance: gold is Harry, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 9:40 Calling out corporate acquisition failures
Christian bluntly criticizes Microsoft for mismanaging acquisitions like Skype, Yammer, and Wunderlist despite explicit promises made during the acquisition deal.
Hardest push from Harry ▶ 12:38 Pushing on founder angel investing as a distractionHarry challenges Christian on the tension between founder focus and angel investing, especially when taking on external capital from investors.
Biggest teaching moment ▶ 25:20 Exposing investor blind spots on product strategyChristian illustrates why founders shouldn't blindly trust investor feedback by revealing how a board member mocked real-time sync, which ended up being Wunderlist's primary acquisition driver.
Harry holds his own ▶ 7:04 Pressing on feature versus product distinctionHarry articulates a classic VC dilemma regarding features versus products, prompting Christian to explain his core product philosophy.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
| Chapter | Topic | Harry as informed peer | Guest teaching | Guest disagreement | Harry pushing back | Why |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Christian Reber's Journey from Early Projects to Wunderlist and Pitch | 1 | 3 | 0 | 0 | Harry introduces Christian with high praise, framing himself as a fanboy. Christian shares his early entrepreneurial backstory from building Mucelli to Wunderlist and selling to Microsoft. | |
| Distinguishing Features from Products and Trusting Instinct | 2 | 4 | 1 | 1 | Harry asks a sharp product question regarding how to distinguish features from products. Christian reframes the topic around code impermanence and relying on founder instinct rather than heavy analysis. | |
| Reflections on the Wunderlist Acquisition and Founding Superlist | 2 | 5 | 2 | 2 | Harry asks directly about regrets over selling Wunderlist to Microsoft. Christian gives a candid recount of getting physically ill, criticizing Microsoft's handling of acquisitions, and detailing his views on money and angel investing. | |
| The Evolution of the European Startup Ecosystem | 2 | 4 | 1 | 2 | Harry asks about Christian's pre-launch fundraising strategy for Pitch. Christian reveals he was initially anti-VC, but received unsolicited top-tier valuation offers that forced his strategy to shift. | |
| Building a Sustainable Company Culture and Work-Life Balance | 2 | 4 | 1 | 1 | Harry inquires about building startup culture away from toxic hustle mentalities. Christian explains how severe burnout at Wunderlist led him to strictly separate his identity from his work and cap his working hours. | |
| The Craft of Product Design, Instinct, and Perfectionism | 2 | 4 | 1 | 1 | Harry asks how Christian balances intuitive design craft against modern data metrics. Christian explains that product instinct isn't magic but stems from being an obsessive tech consumer across all platforms. | |
| Effective Board Management and Navigating Investor Feedback | 1 | 5 | 3 | 1 | Christian reflects on board management dynamics and tells a story of an investor dismissively pretending to fall asleep during a presentation for real-time sync, which later proved to be the key selling feature. | |
| Quickfire Round: Influential Books, Leadership, and Pitch's 5-Year Vision | 1 | 3 | 1 | 1 | In the quickfire round, Christian discusses his childhood reading, navigating CEO loneliness, and his ambitious 5-year vision for Pitch to accelerate global decision-making through presentation decks. |
Statements from this episode (17)
Reber: The initial version of Wunderlist was built in six weeks
“So I wrote Wunderlist myself with two of my first engineers within six weeks or so.”
Reber: Wunderlist became the most downloaded app worldwide on the App Store
“Super popular there. Most downloaded app worldwide for quite some time.”
Reber: Wunderlist ceased to exist three years post-acquisition
“So, like, Wanderlust is a very good example, right? After selling it three years later, it doesn't exist anymore.”
Reber: Pitch can become a multi-billion dollar business
“I think it's a massive market. It has growth built in, because every presentation is meant to be shared with someone else. So if I'm able to build this tool and a platform around it, I think this can be a multi-billion dollar business.”
Reber: Angel investments rely on instinct rather than product understanding
“When I'm looking at investments as like angel investments, I ask myself that every single time I look at something, I only trust my instinct. Do I get along with the founder? Do I believe the founder understands the market? I don't necessarily have to understa…”
Reber: Microsoft screwed up its acquisitions of Yammer, Skype, and Wunderlist
“I think Microsoft has Screwed up multiple acquisitions like Yammer or Skype, and they promised me when we sold it that they will try their very best not to screw up Wunderlist, and I think they did.”
Reber: Wunderlist could have reached hundreds of millions of users independently
“I think Wunderlist had a very unique character and could have grown to hundreds of millions of users and could have had a successful business process”
Reber has reinvested 50% of his personal wealth into venture capital
“I have actually, I think I've taken 50% of my personal wealth and reinvested it into venture capital by investing into funds and startups.”
Reber: Running a seed fund while building a startup is a distraction
“So angel investing absolutely is a distraction. I think if you as a founder, like run your own like seed fund and raise capital on the side while you are building your own product and business, I think it's a massive distraction.”
Christian Reber Limits Angel Investing to One Hour Per Week
“I spend an hour a week, I would say, on angel investments, maybe one to two hours a week on Superlist, and the rest of my time is pitched non-stop.”
Reber: Tech will replace the auto industry as Germany's economic backbone
“Like, especially in Germany with the car industry, if that might be gone at some point, I think the tech industry will take over, and it will be the backing bone of Germany in the future.”
Reber: Pitch received a $20M seed valuation offer with zero product
“The first fund that made us an offer made us an offer that I just couldn't believe. I think the seed valuation was twenty million with nothing, no co-founders, no deck, Just the idea, and I was like, holy shit, this is insane. Okay, I'm going to take this offe…”
Reber: Pitch raised $50M pre-launch entirely through preemptive investor offers
“We raised fifty million in total exactly that way, by not fundraising.”
Reber: Selling Wunderlist to Microsoft felt like selling to the enemy
“When I sold Wanderlust, it felt like I'm selling my child to the enemy. I didn't want to get bought by Microsoft. I viewed Microsoft as the enemy, and it was just stupid.”