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Apr 29, 2016 · 24m · 20vc

20VC: Why It Is All Still About User Growth and How To Address Retention For A Consumer Social App with Mike Mignano, Co-Founder & CEO @ Anchor

Mike Mignano · 14m spoken Harry Stebbings · 8m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The 20 Minute VC, host Harry Stebbings interviews Anchor co-founder and CEO Mike Mignano about product lessons from early beta testing, strategies for driving user retention through voice engagement, and the future of audio social platforms.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Harry holds 35.9% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Harry as informed peer 3.4 Guest teaching 2.8 Guest disagreement 0.8 Harry pushing back 1.8
05100:0010:0020:002:23–5:58 · Harry as informed peer 2/10 The Founding of Anchor and the Audio Renaissance Host sets up standard background questions about Anchor's founding and podcasting growth. Guest offers industry data citing the Edison report's 57 million monthly US listeners to substantiate the audio renaissance.5:59–13:00 · Harry as informed peer 4/10 Audio Creation Friction and Key Beta Testing Lessons Host invokes industry context like Fred Wilson's blog post on consumer downturns and probes into beta methodology. Guest educates the host by citing Jacob Nielsen's UX study regarding diminishing returns after five user testers.13:00–17:33 · Harry as informed peer 5/10 Driving User Retention Through Voice Replies Host shows domain knowledge by citing Sarah Tavel's hierarchy of engagement framework and comparing Anchor to Peach. Guest collaboratively explains how voice-based replies foster natural loop dynamics.17:33–20:03 · Harry as informed peer 4/10 Long-Term Monetization for Consumer Social Platforms Host pushes guest for a specific quantitative audience threshold needed to start monetizing. Guest politely reframes the premise, arguing stickiness and retention matter more than raw user count.20:08–23:13 · Harry as informed peer 2/10 Quickfire Round: Insights, Books, and Anchor's Future In a rapid-fire format, host asks standard quickfire questions about books, regrets, and platform expansion. Guest gives lighthearted and personal responses in a warm tone.2:23–5:58 · Guest teaching 3/10 The Founding of Anchor and the Audio Renaissance Host sets up standard background questions about Anchor's founding and podcasting growth. Guest offers industry data citing the Edison report's 57 million monthly US listeners to substantiate the audio renaissance.5:59–13:00 · Guest teaching 5/10 Audio Creation Friction and Key Beta Testing Lessons Host invokes industry context like Fred Wilson's blog post on consumer downturns and probes into beta methodology. Guest educates the host by citing Jacob Nielsen's UX study regarding diminishing returns after five user testers.13:00–17:33 · Guest teaching 2/10 Driving User Retention Through Voice Replies Host shows domain knowledge by citing Sarah Tavel's hierarchy of engagement framework and comparing Anchor to Peach. Guest collaboratively explains how voice-based replies foster natural loop dynamics.17:33–20:03 · Guest teaching 3/10 Long-Term Monetization for Consumer Social Platforms Host pushes guest for a specific quantitative audience threshold needed to start monetizing. Guest politely reframes the premise, arguing stickiness and retention matter more than raw user count.20:08–23:13 · Guest teaching 1/10 Quickfire Round: Insights, Books, and Anchor's Future In a rapid-fire format, host asks standard quickfire questions about books, regrets, and platform expansion. Guest gives lighthearted and personal responses in a warm tone.2:23–5:58 · Guest disagreement 1/10 The Founding of Anchor and the Audio Renaissance Host sets up standard background questions about Anchor's founding and podcasting growth. Guest offers industry data citing the Edison report's 57 million monthly US listeners to substantiate the audio renaissance.5:59–13:00 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Audio Creation Friction and Key Beta Testing Lessons Host invokes industry context like Fred Wilson's blog post on consumer downturns and probes into beta methodology. Guest educates the host by citing Jacob Nielsen's UX study regarding diminishing returns after five user testers.13:00–17:33 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Driving User Retention Through Voice Replies Host shows domain knowledge by citing Sarah Tavel's hierarchy of engagement framework and comparing Anchor to Peach. Guest collaboratively explains how voice-based replies foster natural loop dynamics.17:33–20:03 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Long-Term Monetization for Consumer Social Platforms Host pushes guest for a specific quantitative audience threshold needed to start monetizing. Guest politely reframes the premise, arguing stickiness and retention matter more than raw user count.20:08–23:13 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Quickfire Round: Insights, Books, and Anchor's Future In a rapid-fire format, host asks standard quickfire questions about books, regrets, and platform expansion. Guest gives lighthearted and personal responses in a warm tone.2:23–5:58 · Harry pushing back 1/10 The Founding of Anchor and the Audio Renaissance Host sets up standard background questions about Anchor's founding and podcasting growth. Guest offers industry data citing the Edison report's 57 million monthly US listeners to substantiate the audio renaissance.5:59–13:00 · Harry pushing back 1/10 Audio Creation Friction and Key Beta Testing Lessons Host invokes industry context like Fred Wilson's blog post on consumer downturns and probes into beta methodology. Guest educates the host by citing Jacob Nielsen's UX study regarding diminishing returns after five user testers.13:00–17:33 · Harry pushing back 1/10 Driving User Retention Through Voice Replies Host shows domain knowledge by citing Sarah Tavel's hierarchy of engagement framework and comparing Anchor to Peach. Guest collaboratively explains how voice-based replies foster natural loop dynamics.17:33–20:03 · Harry pushing back 5/10 Long-Term Monetization for Consumer Social Platforms Host pushes guest for a specific quantitative audience threshold needed to start monetizing. Guest politely reframes the premise, arguing stickiness and retention matter more than raw user count.20:08–23:13 · Harry pushing back 1/10 Quickfire Round: Insights, Books, and Anchor's Future In a rapid-fire format, host asks standard quickfire questions about books, regrets, and platform expansion. Guest gives lighthearted and personal responses in a warm tone.

speaking balance: gold is Harry, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Harry 90.6% · guest 9.4%0:00 · Harry 90.6% · guest 9.4%3:00 · Harry 19.6% · guest 80.4%3:00 · Harry 19.6% · guest 80.4%6:00 · Harry 24.9% · guest 75.1%6:00 · Harry 24.9% · guest 75.1%9:00 · Harry 13.6% · guest 86.4%9:00 · Harry 13.6% · guest 86.4%12:00 · Harry 30.2% · guest 69.8%12:00 · Harry 30.2% · guest 69.8%15:00 · Harry 25.9% · guest 74.1%15:00 · Harry 25.9% · guest 74.1%18:00 · Harry 24.4% · guest 75.6%18:00 · Harry 24.4% · guest 75.6%21:00 · Harry 46.2% · guest 53.8%21:00 · Harry 46.2% · guest 53.8%24:00 · Harry 100% · guest 0%24:00 · Harry 100% · guest 0%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 19:43 Reframing Monetization Audience Threshold

Guest pushes back against host's request for a specific audience metric, insisting retention matters far more than simple headcount.

 Hardest push from Harry ▶ 19:25 Pressing for Specific Monetization Metrics

Host explicitly acknowledges the guest might dislike the question but directly presses for a quantifiable user target before turning on monetization.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 10:15 Citing Nielsen's 5-User Testing Rule

Guest educates host on product design methodology by referencing Jacob Nielsen's classic study showing diminishing returns past five beta testers.

 Harry holds his own ▶ 13:00 Applying Engagement Hierarchy & Peach Case

Host displays strong venture expertise by framing his question around Sarah Tavel's engagement hierarchy and contrasting Anchor with Peach's retention drop-off.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicHarry as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementHarry pushing backWhy
The Founding of Anchor and the Audio Renaissance 2311 Host sets up standard background questions about Anchor's founding and podcasting growth. Guest offers industry data citing the Edison report's 57 million monthly US listeners to substantiate the audio renaissance.
Audio Creation Friction and Key Beta Testing Lessons 4511 Host invokes industry context like Fred Wilson's blog post on consumer downturns and probes into beta methodology. Guest educates the host by citing Jacob Nielsen's UX study regarding diminishing returns after five user testers.
Driving User Retention Through Voice Replies 5201 Host shows domain knowledge by citing Sarah Tavel's hierarchy of engagement framework and comparing Anchor to Peach. Guest collaboratively explains how voice-based replies foster natural loop dynamics.
Long-Term Monetization for Consumer Social Platforms 4325 Host pushes guest for a specific quantitative audience threshold needed to start monetizing. Guest politely reframes the premise, arguing stickiness and retention matter more than raw user count.
Quickfire Round: Insights, Books, and Anchor's Future 2101 In a rapid-fire format, host asks standard quickfire questions about books, regrets, and platform expansion. Guest gives lighthearted and personal responses in a warm tone.

Statements from this episode (9)

Assertion Supported
Edison Research: 57 million Americans listen to podcasts monthly
“The latest Edison report I saw that came out a month or two ago showed that something like fifty seven million Americans are now listening to podcasts monthly, which is a, an extremely large number.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 3:50
Insight
Mignano: Mass media consumption naturally drives creation demand
“When you have a lot of people consuming content of a specific type, you naturally have people that want to create and want to contribute.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 4:33
Prediction Held up
Mignano: Audio consumption will grow dramatically via voice technology
“I absolutely see it increasing. I think what will drive it will be some of the things you just mentioned. Data, you know, increase in data, increase in bandwidth, connectivity of cars, absolutely. I also think, you know, improving the technology and voice reco…”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 5:18
Insight
Mignano: Product testing yields diminishing returns after five users
“If you're testing a feature or a specific product idea, oftentimes you only really need five users before you start to get diminishing returns on an increase in users in the group.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 10:22
Insight
Mignano: Optimal length for short audio clips is 1.5 to 2 minutes
“We saw that the sweet spot, the best length for waves was about a minute and a half to two minutes in length.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 11:54
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Mignano: Voice replies are the primary driver of retention on Anchor
“Replies have now become that engagement mechanic for us that drives people back, that keeps them coming back into the app, that retains users over time.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 14:29
Disclosure
Mignano: Anchor launched without reply or comment features
“We initially had no concept of replying, no concept of commenting. We just let people record waves. And what we saw, and this was sort of a light bulb moment for us. We saw people manually trying to reply to each other with their voices.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 15:13
Prediction Held up
Mignano: Anchor's monetization will allow creators to earn a living
“When we do decide to monetize, I think it's important to us that the people are able to monetize the content, that the people can actually earn a living on anchor.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 18:44
Insight
Mignano: Voice control is native to the medium of audio
“And I think it should be voice controlled because I think that's native to the medium of audio.”
Mike Mignano Apr 29, 2016 ▶ 22:55
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